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Originally Posted by Dumars4Ever I saw at least two plays where Sheed got around Darko but missed easy shots near ...

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  #101 (permalink)  
Old 12-09-2006, 08:03 PM
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Re: At Orlando December 8th, 7:00 PM

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Originally Posted by Dumars4Ever View Post
I saw at least two plays where Sheed got around Darko but missed easy shots near the basket. I'm not saying Darko sucks, but I didn't see him do much to prevent Sheed from scoring.
Took the words out of my mouth. Anyone watching the game could see that Darko's man was missing shots versus Darko causing misses. Darko has had stellar defensive performances in the past, though. This just wasn't one of them. He was not impressive by any means. The Pistons didn't go inside because our guards were torching the imposing guards. Detroit took advantage of the mismatch. The real question to ask is why Darko wasn't able to gobble up more rebounds? During the time he was on the court, he was easily the biggest player on the floor and couldn't manage to pull more than 5 boards. He was outrebounded by Chauncey, Rip and Prince. Darko's inability to grab more boards when Howard was out of the game probably cost Orlando many potential possesions. The difference to be made in this game was not his handling of the bigs...who the Pistons didn't even really go to...but to dominate the boards when the Pistons went small. Or to dominate offensively with up against a smaller lineup. Being able to get away with putting Tay and Maxiel on Darko was a huge advantage for the Pistons and played a large part in the 4th quarter dominance. Knowing when to adjust your game to help the team is a skill great players learn. He isn't there now and personally I don't think he ever will be.
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  #102 (permalink)  
Old 12-09-2006, 11:29 PM
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Re: At Orlando December 8th, 7:00 PM

Should be interesting to note that when I heard two different interviews on Sirius' NBA radio from the Orlando organization, (Pat Williams / VP as well as their radio color analyst) they hardly mentioned him. It was all about Howard and the other young guys coming on and Grant Hill. Arroyo got some love, but I think Darko's name got mentioned once as part of the trade.

Looks like Darko will be the typical bench player.
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  #103 (permalink)  
Old 12-10-2006, 05:46 AM
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Re: At Orlando December 8th, 7:00 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by MAINMANFD View Post
Took the words out of my mouth. Anyone watching the game could see that Darko's man was missing shots versus Darko causing misses. Darko has had stellar defensive performances in the past, though. This just wasn't one of them. He was not impressive by any means. The Pistons didn't go inside because our guards were torching the imposing guards. Detroit took advantage of the mismatch. The real question to ask is why Darko wasn't able to gobble up more rebounds? During the time he was on the court, he was easily the biggest player on the floor and couldn't manage to pull more than 5 boards. He was outrebounded by Chauncey, Rip and Prince. Darko's inability to grab more boards when Howard was out of the game probably cost Orlando many potential possesions. The difference to be made in this game was not his handling of the bigs...who the Pistons didn't even really go to...but to dominate the boards when the Pistons went small. Or to dominate offensively with up against a smaller lineup. Being able to get away with putting Tay and Maxiel on Darko was a huge advantage for the Pistons and played a large part in the 4th quarter dominance. Knowing when to adjust your game to help the team is a skill great players learn. He isn't there now and personally I don't think he ever will be.
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  #104 (permalink)  
Old 12-10-2006, 02:14 PM
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Re: At Orlando December 8th, 7:00 PM

darko was as bad as i remembered.

but NO ONE has mentioned the most important stat of the entire game: maxiell got his first assist of the year! wooooot
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  #105 (permalink)  
Old 12-10-2006, 03:23 PM
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Re: At Orlando December 8th, 7:00 PM

At any rate. I think Magic showed us that they are not going to vanish anytime soon. What impressed me is their constant push to take the ball inside and improve the shot. Guards trying to penetrate and Howard always there ready for the pass. Fall asleep on defense and the Magic will take advantage.

They will continue to improve their young core and should get better as the season continues. Howard, Nelson, Ariza, Bogans, their rookie Redick, and of course Darko. Most teams improve as the season advances so we will see if they keep pace. Also crucial is the status of Grant Hill. He still has not made it for a full season over there.

Then they get to enter the next stage of rebuilding which is trying to hand onto all the players they put so much hard work in developing. Especially if they end with a good record, generate a lot of interest in their players.

Next Magic/Piston games are Feb 23 at Orlando and April 11 at home. Taking this 1st road game gave us home court for the 3 meetings. This could come into play for playoff seeding if the Magic keep up the pace.

Last edited by max : 12-10-2006 at 03:24 PM.
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  #106 (permalink)  
Old 12-10-2006, 03:36 PM
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Re: At Orlando December 8th, 7:00 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by max View Post
At any rate. I think Magic showed us that they are not going to vanish anytime soon. What impressed me is their constant push to take the ball inside and improve the shot. Guards trying to penetrate and Howard always there ready for the pass. Fall asleep on defense and the Magic will take advantage.

They will continue to improve their young core and should get better as the season continues. Howard, Nelson, Ariza, Bogans, their rookie Redick, and of course Darko. Most teams improve as the season advances so we will see if they keep pace. Also crucial is the status of Grant Hill. He still has not made it for a full season over there.

Then they get to enter the next stage of rebuilding which is trying to hand onto all the players they put so much hard work in developing. Especially if they end with a good record, generate a lot of interest in their players.

Next Magic/Piston games are Feb 23 at Orlando and April 11 at home. Taking this 1st road game gave us home court for the 3 meetings. This could come into play for playoff seeding if the Magic keep up the pace.
I agree Max.

The key to this young team as you mentioned is the health of Grant Hill. His experience and veteran leadership is key to the success of the Magic.

If he can play the full season and into the playoffs, with steady improvements from the youngsters, who knows what might happen.

This is the Eastern Conference.............
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  #107 (permalink)  
Old 12-10-2006, 07:08 PM
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Re: At Orlando December 8th, 7:00 PM

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Originally Posted by MotownPride View Post
Took the words out of my mouth. Anyone watching the game could see that Darko's man was missing shots versus Darko causing misses.
we just disagree. i think a hand in the face does cause players to miss. it isn't just coincidence that when darko's hand is up by most players that they miss. that's why players are taught to put a hand in the face.

Quote:
Darko has had stellar defensive performances in the past, though. This just wasn't one of them. He was not impressive by any means. The Pistons didn't go inside because our guards were torching the imposing guards. Detroit took advantage of the mismatch.
or you could say the pistons didn't go inside because it was easier to score against jameer than darko. you could dismiss it if it was only sheed that missed shots inside but it was mcdyess as well. i agree darko wasn't dominant defensively this game but he was definitely solid.

Quote:
The real question to ask is why Darko wasn't able to gobble up more rebounds? During the time he was on the court, he was easily the biggest player on the floor and couldn't manage to pull more than 5 boards. He was outrebounded by Chauncey, Rip and Prince. Darko's inability to grab more boards when Howard was out of the game probably cost Orlando many potential possesions. The difference to be made in this game was not his handling of the bigs...who the Pistons didn't even really go to...but to dominate the boards when the Pistons went small.
i didn't see darko miss any rebounds that came to him. the ball bounces where it wants. i saw darko grab several strong rebounds.

Quote:
Or to dominate offensively with up against a smaller lineup. Being able to get away with putting Tay and Maxiel on Darko was a huge advantage for the Pistons and played a large part in the 4th quarter dominance. Knowing when to adjust your game to help the team is a skill great players learn. He isn't there now and personally I don't think he ever will be.
well if he hasn't learned it shouldn't his coach?? shouldn't his coach have pounded it inside repeatedly when flip went small ball?? or is it up to darko to bring the ball up the court and post himself up?? darko doesn't get the attempts to be offensively dominant. he gets 6 shots per game about.
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  #108 (permalink)  
Old 12-10-2006, 07:20 PM
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Re: At Orlando December 8th, 7:00 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by bball jay View Post
we just disagree. i think a hand in the face does cause players to miss. it isn't just coincidence that when darko's hand is up by most players that they miss. that's why players are taught to put a hand in the face.
I agree, except I didn't see a hand in the face until well after the ball was released.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bball jay
or you could say the pistons didn't go inside because it was easier to score against jameer than darko. you could dismiss it if it was only sheed that missed shots inside but it was mcdyess as well. i agree darko wasn't dominant defensively this game but he was definitely solid.
Pistons scored on the guards when Darko was end and out of the game. And I agree it is much easier to score on Jameer than Darko. You completely missed my point about where Darko needed to contribute to get the win didn't you. I'm not surprised.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bball jay
i didn't see darko miss any rebounds that came to him. the ball bounces where it wants. i saw darko grab several strong rebounds.
Oh, I get it. Darko doesn't get rebounds because the ball doesn't like to bounce his way. That's creative. We'll just ignore the fact that he hasn't been an efficient rebounder all season if that makes you feel more comfortable. Perhaps he can ask Dwight Howard how he gets the ball to bounce near him. lol. Bballjay, you literally do have an excuse for everything. You're too far gone man. Too far gone.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bball jay
well if he hasn't learned it shouldn't his coach?? shouldn't his coach have pounded it inside repeatedly when flip went small ball?? or is it up to darko to bring the ball up the court and post himself up?? darko doesn't get the attempts to be offensively dominant. he gets 6 shots per game about.
Nope, its up to Darko to get open and stop doing his impression of the stiff Indian dude from one flew over the coocoo's nest. When he did get the ball he couldn't even score on Maxiel or Tay..so why pass it to him?

By the way, if Darko's good games always seem to be controversial, doesn't that tell you something?
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  #109 (permalink)  
Old 12-10-2006, 07:54 PM
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Re: At Orlando December 8th, 7:00 PM

You guys can argue this stuff all day, but it doesn't mean much because it is too small of a sample. Maybe the ball didn't bounce his way. Maybe Dice and Sheed were just cold while Darko was guarding them, etc. Since we are only talking 10 shots or so, it is not statistically significant. It could have been because of good defense or just plain missed shots. You have to look at the long term stats.

These are "on" the floor stats per 100 possessions that show how many points the Magic give up on D when each of the following players are on the court.

1) Ariza- 101.6
2) Milicic- 102.4
3) Turkoglu- 103.0
4) DHoward- 103.3
5) Arroyo- 103.4 (probably because he usually plays with #1 and #2)

The top 5 for the Pistons are:
1) Davis- 96.0 (although this is probably not stat sig. due to low mins).
2) Rip- 107.6
2) Delfino- 107.6 (tie w/ Rip)
4) Sheed- 107.7
5) Lindsay- 108.1
5) Chauncey- 108.2 (virtual tie with Lindsay)


Whatever the reason, Darko is helping on D. And it is not coming at the expense on offense for the Magic like it is for the Pistons and a player like Lindsay Hunter. The Magic score 105.7 per 100 possession with Darko out there. The Pistons only score 99 when Hunter is out there... 9 points worse than they allow!
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  #110 (permalink)  
Old 12-10-2006, 08:28 PM
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Re: At Orlando December 8th, 7:00 PM

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Originally Posted by TaShawn View Post
You guys can argue this stuff all day, but it doesn't mean much because it is too small of a sample. Maybe the ball didn't bounce his way. Maybe Dice and Sheed were just cold while Darko was guarding them, etc. Since we are only talking 10 shots or so, it is not statistically significant. It could have been because of good defense or just plain missed shots. You have to look at the long term stats.

These are "on" the floor stats per 100 possessions that show how many points the Magic give up on D when each of the following players are on the court.

1) Ariza- 101.6
2) Milicic- 102.4
3) Turkoglu- 103.0
4) DHoward- 103.3
5) Arroyo- 103.4 (probably because he usually plays with #1 and #2)

The top 5 for the Pistons are:
1) Davis- 96.0 (although this is probably not stat sig. due to low mins).
2) Rip- 107.6
2) Delfino- 107.6 (tie w/ Rip)
4) Sheed- 107.7
5) Lindsay- 108.1
5) Chauncey- 108.2 (virtual tie with Lindsay)


Whatever the reason, Darko is helping on D. And it is not coming at the expense on offense for the Magic like it is for the Pistons and a player like Lindsay Hunter. The Magic score 105.7 per 100 possession with Darko out there. The Pistons only score 99 when Hunter is out there... 9 points worse than they allow!
Tashawn nobody is disputing that Darko is a good defender. My point was only that he did not play well against Detroit. His defense was not game changing and his offense was non-existent. Rebounding and points were needed by Darko to defeat the Pistons. He provided neither. If you think he had a good game as well then I will have a hard time taking you seriously going forward as it pertains to your takes on Darko.

Oh yeah, he played most of the 4th quarter and he came in on the minus side with that effort. Darko averages 7.3 pts and 4.8 rebounds for the season. We've already established that per 48 mins there are many players who are better statistically. I will go out on a limb and say that no player in the history of the game has recieved so much praise for mediocre results. If you're a Magic fan, Darko should be your 6th favorite player on the team based on contribution. If you're a Pistons fan, Darko should probably be somewhere between 6000 and 6 million.

Last edited by MotownPride : 12-10-2006 at 08:32 PM.
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