I have a friend of mine who is a HUGE Utah Jazz fan. We just had a spirited discussion on John Stockton's place in history versus Zeke's. Of course we got in a heated debate about Isiah's snub from Dream Team I and the offensive outburst Johnny Boy got as a result of the snub.

Anyway, I was curious to know what the folks in my Pistons Forum think about Isiah Thomas's place in history. Where do you rate him amongst the greatest point guards of all-time. Is he in your top 5? Here's my top 5:

1)Magic - The Championsips, The Smile, The versatilty, The Passes, will there ever be anyone better?
2)Oscar Robertson - Lord of the Triple Double, complete all-around player
3)Zeke - He beat perhaps 2 of the toughest teams in the history of Sports (Celtics and Lakers). Excellent ball handler, sprited leader, clutch shooter, and offensive magician.
4)Stockton - How can you argue with the numbers? Career leader in steals, blocks, and one of the most dependable/inury free players in the history of the NBA
5)J-Kidd - I think at the end of his career we will consider him one of the top 5 point guards to ever play. I really wanted to pick Pistol Pete Marovich because of the innovation he brought to the league, but I think this pick makes alot more sense. When heatlhy, Kidd can take over the game in so many different ways. His involvement on the floor makes any team instantly competitive.

I'm sure there are many other picks that others may include like: Jerry West, Walt Fraizer, Dennis Johnson, etc... but these are the guys I like. What is everyone else's thoughts?

Charley Rosen recently made a list of top point guards. I think he is trying to stir up controversy with some of his choices:

http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/3734262

1. Big "O"
2. Magic
3. Jerry West
4. Jon Stockton
5. Walt Frazier
6. Dennis Johnson
7. Lenny Wilkens
8. Ralph Beard (played 2 seasons before banishment from NBA for point-rigging)

Zeke made honorable mention. Some people simply hate the Pistons. Even if you do, Zeke still has to be in the top 5.

If you click on the link above, you can also see other rankings (top center, power forward, 6th man, coach, team, overrated, etc.).

Only 3 more posts until I get my *^&(*^(^(*& avatar...

Dennis Johnson over Zeke. WOW! Can you say no love?

I really don't see Jason Kidd as one of the top five PG ever to play the game. Aside from the fact that if I saw him in my local watering hole I wouldn't bother to acknowledge his existence, I think that he is mostly hype. We have fallen prey to the NBA marketing machine.

A PG is the leader of the team. The floor general. I haven't seen much from Kidd that says that he has led his teams anywhere. I'm not positive about this, I tend to follow the Pistons extremely closely, and the rest of the NBA at a glance, but does Kidd have a ring? If not, I don't think he compare to some of the other PG's who don't have them... ie Stockton, Payton... he's a flashy, quick thinking player who shines in the transition game, but in the half court, he's mortal.

And if I see him blow a kiss before a free throw again, I'll throw up all over myself.

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Hey Laim. Good to see you make it over to this neck of the woods.

I completely agree with your comment on Zeke. Any list of the best PG's in NBA history that doesn't include Zeke in the top five, let alone the top eight, just can't be taken seriously. But, people have been hatin' on Thomas for so long now, that it's just to be expected. It really is a shame.

J Kidd was a good point guard in his day, but that day is done. He is older now and never could shoot much. That has hurt his game and made him into basically a transition set up guy. I think was an excellent player but worthy of a top 10 spot really. His wife is very hot though.

Regarding Zeke against the greats:

How many of those other guys took games over and willed their squads to titles? Magic and Oscar sure, but Stockton?? Was West a point guard? Walt Frazier?? Everyone hated his Piston team because they were the bad guys and played physical. Zeke created his own problems in the media and got labeled. No big deal. Who cares what Charlie Rosen says anyway?

Last time I checked, the Pistons of Zeke's era beat the Bulls a few times and Stockton's squad never could. Isiaha was money in the Finals and Stockton was not. Besides, he busted Stockton's ass after that Dream Team BS too. DJ couldn't cover Zeke either. What a joke.

He is a terrible GM though.

LMAO.

I think the hype surrounded around Kidd's ability is warranted. He is an excellent defender when healthy and an effective rebounding guard. I really did not get an opportunity to study Kidd's game until he joined the Nets. It was undeniable the impact he had on that team. Hey, two straight NBA finals appearances is nothing to sneeze at, although they ultimately ended up being fodder for the Lakers. Career Stat wise he is no slouch either. His numbers are comparable with all the greats so far. His Assists per game career average is tied with Zeke for #4 all-time and he is number 9 on the list for total assists with only 786 games played. He might not be the ideal citzen, but this dude is a hall of famer to be in my book.

Quick correction: I said Stockton was the career leader in BLOCKS! LOL! I obviously meant assists.

Another point on J-Kidd. Its really easy to write a player off after injury. His numbers were slowly coming back to form near the close of the regular season. I wouldn't be suprised to see a rejuvination of J-Kidd this season especially since he has Carter and Jefferson on the wings this year. I still don't get why New Jersey soured on Rahim espescially since Sacramento jumped all over him once New Jersey backed away from the deal. New Jersey missed a golden opportunity of Shareef is in good enouch condition to play. A lineup featuring Carter, Jefferson and Rahim would have been nassssssssty!!!

They would have been nasty on offense but probably would have played no D either. No boards and no D = 39 win season.

without a doubt. people are making excuses for kidds injuries why he should be in the top 5. zeke played in the finals with his ankle hanging off. stockton or kidd shouldn't be above zeke because they both haven't won anything. kidd also can't hit a jumper to save his life. he also gets absolutely shut down by the pistons so i can't see putting him in the top 5. zeke's teams beat jordan, bird, mchale, magic, etc.