Can you draw a parallel with any other coach taking over a team of this recent history and caliber?

I don't think so....

Phil never sat MJ or Scottie. Remember when Pippen had the Game 7 (1990) migraine and had ice packed on his head during timeouts? He played 41 or 42 minutes. AND SUCKED HORRIBLY.

Jordan had some rough games against the Bad Boys. Did PJ sit him down? For Craig Hodges?

I remember Manu struggling this year. Did Pop go away from him? What about Duncan struggling in the Finals last year, getting 14 and 16 points in Games 4 and 5? He still played almost 40 minutes in those games.

Ilgauskas? This is a player who needs ego massaging?

D'Antoni plays a short rotation. Has for the last 2 seasons. They don't even have a guy playing the Mo Evans role, let alone tidbits of minutes for a Carlos Delfino.

Riley rests Shaq when he is struggling. He doesn't pull him for non-performance. I've watched almost every Heat game this playoffs.

Josh Powell has played 18 minutes in 3 playoff games. He's a major threat to Griffin and Stackhouse. NOT. Harris played 23 MPG all year. Is his PT a surprise?

Dampier has been pulled for the last two years, and particularly this year when Diop (who was a bust in Cleveland the way Diaw was a bust in Atlanta) stole his starting job for 45 games.

You make it sound like these coaches are making radical changes and experimenting with their benches. They are not. They're carrying on what they did during the season. None of this should be a surprise if you follow other teams. I do, and it's no news to me that Diop gets Dampier's minutes in a heartbeat when the "prized free agent" who was called out for being a wimp last playoffs by Nowitizki, stinks up the joint.

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Nov 13 LW Milan Lucic had an active night. He scored his first goal in eight games since his Oct. 25 hat trick and also pounded Michael Komisarek in a third-period fight. Lucic cut his hand in a fight with Michael Komisarek. "I'll be fine," he said. "(X-rays are) negative, but there's so many broken bones in there from before you can't really tell."

It's a gift. You should meet my biological father.

Yes, it is lack of effort. Precisely why Darko was shipped out. Where are the energy guys on the bench? Is Delfino gunna fire everyone up by bricking a one handed jam? Is Davis gunna flex and point to the sky after he gets a rebound?

Name 5 each.

I agree, but Dyess is not a cureall. He has bad games and good just like everyone else.

Tay needs to play 40 MPG because he has been our best player in the playoffs. It's what Wade does. It's what LeBron does. It's what Iverson would have been doing. It's what Dirk, Tony Parker, Tim Duncan, Steve Nash are doing.

You'll have to convince me (better than AHB with his inability to revise an opinion when presented with overwhelming evidence) that Tay has not played at a high level. Then we can talk about reducing minutes. Instead, it sounds like you are grasping at straws, "They are in trouble, they can't score, oh my god I'm freaking out!", "Put in Delfino, where is Memo, we should have never traded Darko, play anyone because I can't see the game as it unfolds!"

Joe said it best. Management cannot afford to overreact when things get tough. If they acted like us, and played musical chairs with the bench, we'd probably be eliminated now.

Dallas, down 0-1.

SanAntonio - eliminated.

Cleveland - eliminated.

Phoenix, has mostly played 7 guys. I don't think you are familiar with this team at all.

Miami, I'll give you that ONE.

You forgot New Jersey and Chicago (eliminated).

Also Indiana is a great team for playing the bench. They did real good too.

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Nov 13 LW Milan Lucic had an active night. He scored his first goal in eight games since his Oct. 25 hat trick and also pounded Michael Komisarek in a third-period fight. Lucic cut his hand in a fight with Michael Komisarek. "I'll be fine," he said. "(X-rays are) negative, but there's so many broken bones in there from before you can't really tell."

Yes, it is lack of effort. Precisely why Darko was shipped out.

Darko looked good in Orlando when he actually played. I'd take his quickness and shotblocking over Bens anyday.

Where are the energy guys on the bench? Is Delfino gunna fire everyone up by bricking a one handed jam? Is Davis gunna flex and point to the sky after he gets a rebound?

Who knows, but the starters aren't getting it done consistantly and the bench hasn't been consistantly played.

Name 5 each.

They could all start for just about any lottery team. And a lot of teams bring their starters off the bench like Dallas with Terry or Mike Miller in Memphis.

Tay needs to play 40 MPG because he has been our best player in the playoffs. It's what Wade does. It's what LeBron does. It's what Iverson would have been doing. It's what Dirk, Tony Parker, Tim Duncan, Steve Nash are doing.

Tay has been our most consistant player. You yourself claim that he is a 4th option. A 4th option can't be your teams best player unless you have an idiot coach and a crappy team. I think he could maximize his production if he played a little less thats all. We have the depth we should use it.

Joe said it best. Management cannot afford to overreact when things get tough. If they acted like us, and played musical chairs with the bench, we'd probably be eliminated now.

Dallas, down 0-1.

SanAntonio - eliminated. Lost to Dallas who had a better bench.

Cleveland - eliminated. Took us to 7 games!!!!

Miami, I'll give you that ONE.

You forgot New Jersey and Chicago (eliminated).

Also Indiana is a great team for playing the bench. They did real good

too. Maybe there teams weren't very good?

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I have nothing to say.

darko wasn't shipped out because of lack of effort. darko requested the trade cause he was tired of the double talk from the pistons coaches. he was giving plenty of effort and results in the preseason when he was getting minutes and a chance.

you are also wrong about delfino. he does get the crowd fired up with his dunks missed or made. he is the only piston that will go to the hole and thunder dunk on someone. he doesn't brick them all. you should recall that tip dunk off the free throw that even got shaq to drop his jaw. davis may not point to the sky but he will get the rebound and knock some people around.

yes. mcdyess has bad games but those are usually his low minute games. mcdyess doesn't have a consistent 30 minute bad game. some games he comes in instantly hot other games he needs to warm up. i still think his minutes should be consistent and upped if the starters aren't getting it done. if they aren't getting it done put in mcdyess and see if he can get it going instead of having ben brick free throws and save his ego.

yes. tay has been our best player throughout the playoffs but he still needs rest. he has shown that he can't play a full 82 game season and a bunch of 7 games series without running out of gas when we really need him. tay is majorly inneffective against driving players (lebron, jefferson, wade, ginobli) this is the reason evans, delfino should get shots and defending these guys. i'm not saying sit tay on the bench but give delfino 5 minutes just to see if he can make it happen.

or rip would have healed his ankle. sheed wouldn't be injured as we speak. mcdyess, davis, delk have the hunger. when our starters were playing uninspired and going through the motions we could have used them.

when guys were injured. he just plugged in a bench player. flip would just play our injured starter. most of those teams you named about being eliminated were eliminated by teams that used thier bench. so your argument is flawed. you still can't argue that those teams developed thier bench either to the point where they are starters or significant bench contributors. our bench never go the chance to crack the lineup. the lineup was set from before training camp that's why darko wanted out. doesn't matter if you can play if you aren't part of the starting 5 you ain't hitting the court and other teams know this.

So Chauncey Billups, Tayshaun Prince, and Ben Wallace are comparable to Jordan and Pippen? You overestimate the 'caliber' of this team.
Bet your ass he did.
What is the difference between struggling and non-performance?!
Were we talking about playoff games? The topic was consistency during the regular season creating options in the playoffs.
Exactly!
No, Diop was pretty much a bust in Cleveland the way Darko was a bust in Detroit. He gave minimal effort and was horrible on the court - despite being given all the minutes he could handle.
And if Dale Davis had been given a similar chance during the regular season, he would be a rotation player. Davis would start for Toronto, Indiana, Chicago, New Jersey, New York, Boston, Atlanta, Charlotte, Sacramento, and maybe Orlando, Miami, Minnesota, and the Lakers. Delfino would start for Charlotte, Orlando, Utah, Oklahoma City, Denver, Philadelphia, Minnesota, and maybe Washington, Atlanta, Portland, Houston, and the Lakers. Delk probably would not be a starter for any team in the NBA due to his size.
This is obviously an irreconcilable difference. You view Delfino as a poor man's Mo Evans, with "potential" to become somewhat better sometime in the future. I view Delfino as essentially Corey Maggette, right now, with "potential" to become better sometime in the future. Obviously the postseason is not the ideal time for a player to be given a chance to prove himself, which was the point, I believe, of the original post. The Pistons are now a "one-trick pony" without many options - but they didn't have to be.
Now you're comparing Tayshaun Prince to All-Stars and MVPs. Tayshaun Prince is a role player, and your "overwhelming evidence" of opinion to the contrary doesn't make it so. Prince "has been our best player in the playoffs", by which you mean that he had some good offensive games against Cleveland and did a halfway decent job defending James with a little help from his friends, but that is precisely what I mean by overgeneralizing. You extrapolate from his domination of point guards in the post of pick-and-roll mismatches and some decent isolations against LeBron James, a notoriously bad defender, that Prince is a dominant scorer. You extrapolate from the numbers that James put up, conveniently ignoring the constant triple-teaming, that Prince is a lockdown defender. And when Prince has a game like he did two days ago, in which he's used and abused by Antoine Walker of all people on both ends of the court, that's my "inability to revise an opinion".

Look - I like Tay. But he's an opportunistic scorer without many opportunities in this series. He's an average defender who can't guard anyone in this series. Recognizing the matchup problems that are posed - like Gregg Popovich did in yanking Nazr Mohammed from the starting lineup in favor of Finley - rather than kicking your heels together and hoping that Kansas reappears, might be prudent - especially in the playoffs, where every possession is important.

Hate to say it and I am sorry if I offend anyone but saying the Pistons need a bench like Dallas or PHX or Miami is a pile of crap. Its a non-informed knee jerk reaction.

Dallas and others play their bench because they lack quality starters at every position. They start some guy and only play him 20 mins because there is no significant difference between what he can do and what the guy who subs for him can. Why is that so hard to understand?

Pistons are not going to win or lose because of the bench. May get a lift and it would be welcomed from Dyess, Hunter, Evans or Delfino but that guy they subbed in for is going to be the best option to have on the floor 98% of the time.

You want a bench? Lets start Delk, play him 10 mins and bring in Rip for the rest of the 38. Lets start Hunter, Delk and Evans. Billup, Tay and Rip come off the bench. That would be a fine bench, a great bench. Guaranteed to win the bench battle every single game.

I agree. He looks a lot like DeSagana Diop.

We are on the same page with this.

Maybe Miller, but not Terry. Terry started all 80 games he played this year, and has started every game in the playoffs. I'm sure there are exceptions (Memphis = eliminated) but the better teams do not. Right now, AJ is coaching out of his mind. Wait a couple years when spasmodically rotating players will get old and people will say he can't find horses to ride or define roles.

Tay is the 4th option, but has been the most important player in several games now. It speaks to the fact the first 3 options have not played well that he has stepped to the forefront. I do not see him getting tired late. The Miami game was not lost late. He did not falter down the stretch of games 6 or 7 of the Cleveland series.

San Antonio had the better bench. But if your starters cannot carry you, then no amount of Barry and Finley can make things right.

Cleveland took us to 8 games because we played bad. Not because the waves of Damon Jones and Varejao off the bench turned the series.

Yes, NJ, Indiana and Chicago aren't very good. That's my point. They had deep benches but it doesn't fix poor play by the starters. A deep bench doesn't solve a lack of size or poor execution.

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Nov 13 LW Milan Lucic had an active night. He scored his first goal in eight games since his Oct. 25 hat trick and also pounded Michael Komisarek in a third-period fight. Lucic cut his hand in a fight with Michael Komisarek. "I'll be fine," he said. "(X-rays are) negative, but there's so many broken bones in there from before you can't really tell."

You're a big fat fibber. I will respond to the rest later. Or maybe not. Playing semantic games is a sign that you are losing the battle.

I edited out "liar" and substituted "fibber". No long term friction intended.

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Nov 13 LW Milan Lucic had an active night. He scored his first goal in eight games since his Oct. 25 hat trick and also pounded Michael Komisarek in a third-period fight. Lucic cut his hand in a fight with Michael Komisarek. "I'll be fine," he said. "(X-rays are) negative, but there's so many broken bones in there from before you can't really tell."

That's true, to a greater or lesser extent depending on the team. However, the point that slippy originally made is that the Pistons essentially go 6 deep every night, with Dice and Hunter representing "half" of the trusted sixth man, rather than the 8 man rotation that's customary in the playoffs.

The Pistons starters are not in all cases significantly more talented or better options than the guy who subs for him - definitely not better "98% of the time" - but the substitution pattern used in the regular season created a situation where that's the unit that has to be used whether it works - "produces", in themicrowave's parlance, or matches up well, or is needed due to injury, or not, in a particular situation during the playoffs.

The reserves are confused about their roles, rusty, probably lack confidence, and definitely have little chemistry with the starters - making them near useless if necessity or a favorable matchup presents itself. That's a situation that
could have been avoided.

nodody is calling for the bench to play major minutes except mcdyess. i think the other guys can be used for 10 minutes a game to give rest to the starters. they can be used for a spark when the starters are in a funk. mcdyess is not a significant dropoff from our starters and even he isn't getting the minutes.

mcdyess is simply better than ben. mcdyess would be a 20 and 10 and 1.5 blocks guy if given ben's minutes.

the other guys yes they aren't as good as the starters. but that's why it should be 80 20 it doesn't have to be 98%. the problem is when that other 2% comes up flip still won't sub. cola though that curry should be on the floor 98% of the time over tay. if tay hadn't been given that chance we never would have won that series.

you don't always sub just because a player is better. ec should have been used more to bang and tire shaq. he isn't better than ben wallace but he should have played more. delfino checks driving players better than tay does so he should get some minutes on wade. rip can't hit the side of the barn. evans has a great shot if you pass it to him and don't ask him to move.