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Pistons vs Bulls
March 8th, 2006 ~ 7:30pm
The Palace of Auburn Hills, Auburn Hills, MI
TV: Local Only
Radio: WDFN

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Your comments?
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Beat down at the Palace!

http://www.pistonsforum.com/images/picdump/skiles_cry.jpg

we have no excuses. NONE. we're rested, we're at home, and we're better. who can find a stupid excuse if we lose this one?

OT, somewhat. Skiles interviewing for a prime Big 10 HC job? Here's hoping he gets it.

My only problem is that I'm in Chicago this week so I'll get the local broadcasters. Red Kerr is such a homer. Fortunately with the DVR I can just fast forward anytime the clock isn't running.

we have no excuses. NONE. we're rested, we're at home, and we're better. who can find a stupid excuse if we lose this one?

Exactly,
The Bulls played a tough game last night.
This small team should be dominated in the paint.
The bench should show up... MO effort and don't want to hear how smooth Delfino is only to see another goose egg.
Is this the game that Rip Van-Tayshaun wakes up?
Put the Bulls to rest
Cue pic of Bull on a spigot

Pistons 100
Bulls 85

My only problem is that I'm in Chicago this week so I'll get the local broadcasters. Red Kerr is such a homer. Fortunately with the DVR I can just fast forward anytime the clock isn't running.

they have the chicago station here in michigan on 1000 AM, and they also have cleveland's on 1100. shouldn't chicago have any pistons stations? you can hope and see if 1130 works over there, i doubt it though.:ohwell:

Chat is open, I'll see you guys there!!!

http://www.pistonsforum.com/news/853-pistonsforum-com-game-chat-debut.html

Pistons get up for this game...

..and its at home.

Offense should run on all cylnders.

108-96 Detroit!

Very exciting game. One very big complaint:

David Hall.

The Linwood family enjoys gathering around the AM radio and enjoying an exciting game of basketball. It brings us all closer together. Unfortunately, the Pistons have decided to allow David Hall to buy his way into the broadcast to sell mortgages. I'm not talking about timeouts (allthough he was there too) I'm talking about during the game color commentary. If you hadn't guessed, he sucks at this job. Some examples.

"Yeah, that was a great shot by Chauncey. He is really good."

"The Pistons are really playing exciting basketball."

And then he is selling mortgages all through the game. He even did the post game interview with Rasheed. What's next? is he going to take over as Hallway coach? Should Sidney Lowe be looking over his shoulder?

Before the game, and throughout whenever necessary, Fred McLeod reminded those of us watching on Fox of the Official Excuse For The Night ™: “we all know how hard it is the first game back after a West Coast trip.” It looked in the first quarter like we’d be needing it. Bulls guards were weaving their way around the PisCones as though auditioning for the All-Star Weekend Skills Competition. Meanwhile, on the other end, we were equally cone-like, standing still and missing contested jumper after contested jumper. On the positive side, we seemed a bit more active on the boards, especially on the defensive boards.

The second quarter was marginally better. Lindsey and, especially, Tony Delk came in and started to at least try to make things happen on offense. The defensive energy definitely stepped up in the second quarter and threw some cold water on the Bulls first quarter shooting spree. Tayshaun got a few easy buckets that seemed to enliven him a bit and integrate him into the offense more than he has of late. Sheed missed a couple of early bombs and disappeared after that until the 4th quarter. Evans also came in and hit one triple, showed some good energy on the boards, but didn’t really seem like a big factor. Chauncey had only one dish (I think) in the first half and the team as a whole had far fewer assists than usual: a sign not only of the Bulls’ energy, but of the Pistons’ lack thereof.

The big turnaround, however, came in the third quarter. Tay, who had been having a decent game, banged his knee, and Delfino came in, starved for burn, and came up with two steals and some aggressive offensive play. Meanwhile, the team started actually running an offense and it resulted in some open looks for Chauncey who was able to knock them down. The Pistons really locked down on defense in the third quarter too, allowing only 16 points in the period.

The fourth quarter was INSANE. Pistons go up 10, looking completely solid and in control. On one notable play, Chauncey and Sheed ran their pick and pop at the top of the key, Chauncey looked over to a wide-open Sheed behind the 3 point line, and then went inside to Tayshaun. Tay missed the shot, but that play suggested to me that the Pistons were conscious of trying to get the best shot available or to the line and of only taking the 3s (for the most part) only when they were the best shot (overall, I was pleased to see Tay working to get something other than a jumper and the team looking for him more -- he was 5 for 13 for 10 points). Anyway, then it starts raining triples on the other end of the court. We were doing a lot of scrambling and running out, but to the Bulls’ credit, they kept swinging the ball and eventually someone (Nocioni and Gordon principally) would get an open look from beyond the arc and sink it. I didn’t see a lack of effort on the Pistons’ part, however, and in the final minute and a half, that effort finally prevailed and we got the big stops needed to push us over the top.

When I look at the box score, several things stand out: we were outboarded 42-35, but the Bulls only got 7 offensive boards to our 16. We were out shot 53 % to 44 %, but we got 18 more shots than they did. The shot 56 % from 3 (way higher percentage than the league-leading Pistons usually give up in this category). We shot 17 3s, 1 under our average for the season (Sheed 1-5, Chauncey 4-5). The Bulls also committed 17 turnovers (11 on Pistons’ steals). Finally, despite the atrocious start, the Pistons wound up with 26 assists on 39 buckets. And I have to throw in: whatever legitimate complaints people might have about Flip’s philosophy, there was in this game an undeniable correlation, backed up by the box score, between the team’s increasing their player and ball movement, their taking the lead in the game and keeping it, and the number of assists they racked up. At the same time, it was important to see that in this game that same offensive flow could yield points in the paint (34 for us, 30 for them – I know they are a perimeter team, but still, we got the ball inside, especially at key times, got offensive rebounds, and eventually kept their guards out of the paint).

We saw the kind of intensity from the Bulls that I expect we’ll see from a lot of these “should-win” opponents over the next couple of weeks. They’re trying to get that 8th spot and other teams will be trying to get a better seed and so they’re pumped. Perhaps because it was the rival Bulls, or perhaps for some other reasons as well, the Pistons, after the first quarter, matched that intensity. When they did that, they were clearly in the game and looked little by little like a team that finds ways to win, adapting to what works, leaving out what doesn’t. That’s what we need to keep seeing.

1-800-333-ROCK

I expected the Pistons to come out blazing and they came out flat. Some inspired urgent play in the third got them back in the game and they still almost blew it with less than inspired defense. They were being out hustled by a team that played last night:doh:

Back on the road Saturday night after two days rest, lets hope we can work on some defensive stops for Arenas and Jamison. This is the rematch game for OT loss earlier in the season. The problem is that 5 of our 11 losses have been on a Saturday.

Thank you Scolas, linwood and LA Dre. Posting makes the site go.

I only caught the last 3 minutes of this one. What a thriller. Every day, in so many little ways, Flip becomes Larry Brown. ;)

Great clutch scoring down the stretch from CB, Rip and Sheed. Particularly Rip who doesn't get enough credit for his 4th quarter production.

Bulls hate us. But hate alone is not enough. You must have the Zen of the Sheed. The power of the Smooth. The relentless attack of the Hollywood Hamilton.

Oh, and the Pistons DIDN'T GET ANY TECHS!

Video Recap

**link** (http://boss.streamos.com/wmedia/nba/nbacom/recaps/recap_901_chidet.asx)

Thanks Roscoe and Co.

Great recap Scolas. Big ben gets the big block. It may not be the display of domination we like to see but these close games are great. It keeps their edge honed.

Rock on!!!

Out Hustled? Pistons took what 20 more shots because of offensive boards?

The shots just were not falling tonight. And they were for the Bulls. Team did go inside a lot to go along with all the 2nd chance opportunities.

But all some choose to see were Gordan and Niocioni. They were hitting some tough shots. Chandler has been abusing everyone on the offensive glass. Thats about the only thing he is good at but it did not happen that game.

For the record Teams usually start sluggish after a West coast swing. Even if it was only 2 games and with the extra day.

49-11 - yea the skys falling.

A salute to all from Italy, this is my first one post and ....it coincides with one success. I want to only say that unfortunately i have been able to follow the match by livescore of the Cbs and only mourn not to have been able to see the beautiful fourth end

Ciao nene:)

Great post Scolas. Now THAT'S a recap! :attention :whip:

Da Bulls have the making of a great team. Their coach seems to know what he's doin too. Heinrich, Gordon, Deng, Nocioni and Chandler look like they're gellin. I like that Nocioni fella. In fact, I like all their starters. I wouldn't mind having any of them commin off our bench. :eyebrows: :nod:

another kind of win that makes our record make look much better than the team's play.
Nothing has changed- the Pistons got outrebounded, Tayshaun hat a low %, Sheed got 5 (!!!) boards (damn, this is a 6'11 PF!), absolutely nothing from the bench (offensively). Some decent D from Fino, some good rebounding by Dyess but that was it.
I always wonder how this team manages to win while getting outrebounded, shooting weaker and playing without effort.
Probably it was the big effort on the offensive board last night.

I guess the final score is only an after thought.
We must to have used a half court O because we got O boards. Usually if we miss no one is around for the board or tip in.

I only caught the last 3 minutes of this one. What a thriller. Every day, in so many little ways, Flip becomes Larry Brown. ;)

Great clutch scoring down the stretch from CB, Rip and Sheed. Particularly Rip who doesn't get enough credit for his 4th quarter production.

Bulls hate us. But hate alone is not enough. You must have the Zen of the Sheed. The power of the Smooth. The relentless attack of the Hollywood Hamilton.

Oh, and the Pistons DIDN'T GET ANY TECHS!

For some reason i wanted to hear the chicago radio, and they were saying a lot of smack about the pistons.

...the PisCones...
Love it. Probably best used with an adjective, as in dreaded PisCones, for when the evil twins show up.

Nice run by Delfino last night. No hoops on one shot, but some intensity and a get the ball and push it attitude I really like. He made some good things happen on the defensive end. But he was playing the 3 spot so seemed to be the forgotten man in the offense most of the time, mostly just hanging around at the line.

And how about that guy impersonating Sheed?? Pump fake the three and then drive the lane!! Now if we can only get that play set up from the top of the key rather than the three point line so it's one dribble to the hoop rather than about six and we got something special. You got to work a bit to find any fault with his game last night though - 8 of 12 inside the arc, five boards, assists, steals, blocks - big game.

Another forlorn night from Dice and I must have missed the good parts of Tayshawn's game others are talking about.

I got the Bulls broadcast in Chicago and there were loads of interview quotes with Skiles (who did not try to sell me a mortgage) - pretty articulate guy for a Neanderthal.

And how about that guy impersonating Sheed?? Pump fake the three and then drive the lane!! Now if we can only get that play set up from the top of the key rather than the three point line so it's one dribble to the hoop rather than about six and we got something special. You got to work a bit to find any fault with his game last night though - 8 of 12 inside the arc, five boards, assists, steals, blocks - big game.

It was funny last night at one point, sheed' got the ball behind the arc at the top of the key, got ready to launch, hesitated, the defender closed, and sheed sort of chucked up this horrible three. Greg Kelser says: "conscience must have got to him"

I must have missed the good parts of Tayshawn's game others are talking about.

I guess it's not that I thought Tayshawn had such a great game. I was mostly encouraged that after several games of bricking jumpers, as if trying to force himself out of a slump, he seemed to finally resign himself to work his way back from it from the bottom up, with shots inside. he worked to get himself open looks near the hoop, and the pistons seemed to remember he was on their team.

p.s. and watch out dba: god didn't make the PisCones, man did.

The good, bad & strange

The good: We finally got to see Sheed on the blocks (still not enough)... it's almost instant success for him down there... something good should happen... Joe should wrote in his contract ...for every 3 you miss we deduct $1,000... for every post up shot you get $2000.
Also nice to see them starting to use Prince as a slasher where he doesn't have to body up... that floater is almost unblockable.
Rip got back to recognizing a double team and making the dump off to the open man... he draws more attention than any of our other players.

The bad: Still not much to be impressed with from our bench.... neither Delfino or Evans did much... if you think they did go take a look at some other teams box scores... Delfino made one nice steal (the other was bobbled into his hands)... he made a nice defensive stop down low... and he gave up two points on a gamble... had a t.o. that didn't make the box score.... Evans did absolutely nothing but hit a 3 pointer... did Hunter even play?... oh yeah he hit a 3 pointer... sorry this ain't enough production from any of them.

The strange: How did the team that played the night before come out with twice the energy of the team that had three days off?
Anyone notice how many wide open uncontested shots Chicago missed?
I think Ben had more tap backs to his teammates than rebounds last night... Chauncey missing 3 FT's.

They all don't have to be dominant victories... I was glad to hear that Flip addressed the excessive 3's with the team... hopefully this will stick for a while.... These rope a dope W's are a little nerve racking.... now where did I throw that remote?

Game Flow

http://popcornmachine.net/cgi-bin/gameflow.cgi?date=20060308&game=CHIDET

I didn't get to see the third, but it looks like Delf was at least on the floor for the run. +10. Not too shabby.

The neat thing about the Gameflows are the HV column (Help Value). Pretty good help distribution among the starters.

REB + AST + STL + BLK - TO

Was Tay covering Deng and how did he do?

The bad: Still not much to be impressed with from our bench.... neither Delfino or Evans did much... if you think they did go take a look at some other teams box scores... Delfino made one nice steal (the other was bobbled into his hands)... he made a nice defensive stop down low... and he gave up two points on a gamble... had a t.o. that didn't make the box score.... Evans did absolutely nothing but hit a 3 pointer... did Hunter even play?... oh yeah he hit a 3 pointer... sorry this ain't enough production from any of them.

Delfino: 1 shot
Evans: 2 shots
Hunter: 2 shots
Delk: 2 shots

There's your answer. Lindsey is the only guy that actually touched the ball more times than he shot it on the offensive end. They just don't get the ball unless they are completely WIDE open or they get it themselves on a steal/rebound. I have seen Delfino have success driving to the hoop off pick and rolls and I have seen Mo Evans have success with turnaround jumpers in the post, so why doesn't Flip get them involved? The fact is that none of them have plays called for them. Every other team has plays to get their bench players involved. Flip must just tell these guys to go out there and blend in while the "big boys" play offense.

I only caught the last 3 minutes of this one. What a thriller. Every day, in so many little ways, Flip becomes Larry Brown. ;)

That's a good thing?

Was Tay covering Deng and how did he do?

ehhh.... Not great, IMO. Deng was 4-6 from the floor with Tayshaun on him, and 0-3 with Delfino on him. Tayshaun did a little bit more inside offensively, which was good, but he is still clearly off. Most of his offense was off of nice feeds by Sheed/Chauncey and a Rip alley-oop.

1-800-333-ROCK

Nice recap - but this was a little cruel... are you trying to drive poor Linwood crazy?

I don't mind getting out rebounded if we have a better offensive rebound total. We bricked 18 more attempts at their basket.

nice recaps...

all I was hoping for from the stones in the first half was a little b.m. :laugh:

for a good 10-12 minute stretch, I thought the teams switched jerseys cuz the young bulls moved the ball very well

chitowners should be very excited.. I think their team has a ton of potential

That's a good thing?
I like exciting basketball. I like 4th quarter heroics. I like defense, blocks, rebounding and clutch shooting. That's why I don't watch the Orlando Magic.

The good, bad & strange

The good: We finally got to see Sheed on the blocks (still not enough)... it's almost instant success for him down there... something good should happen... Joe should wrote in his contract ...for every 3 you miss we deduct $1,000... for every post up shot you get $2000.
Also nice to see them starting to use Prince as a slasher where he doesn't have to body up... that floater is almost unblockable.
Rip got back to recognizing a double team and making the dump off to the open man... he draws more attention than any of our other players.

The bad: Still not much to be impressed with from our bench.... neither Delfino or Evans did much... if you think they did go take a look at some other teams box scores... Delfino made one nice steal (the other was bobbled into his hands)... he made a nice defensive stop down low... and he gave up two points on a gamble... had a t.o. that didn't make the box score.... Evans did absolutely nothing but hit a 3 pointer... did Hunter even play?... oh yeah he hit a 3 pointer... sorry this ain't enough production from any of them.

The strange: How did the team that played the night before come out with twice the energy of the team that had three days off?
Anyone notice how many wide open uncontested shots Chicago missed?
I think Ben had more tap backs to his teammates than rebounds last night... Chauncey missing 3 FT's.

They all don't have to be dominant victories... I was glad to hear that Flip addressed the excessive 3's with the team... hopefully this will stick for a while.... These rope a dope W's are a little nerve racking.... now where did I throw that remote?hey, BroMerc...here's a stat I always have fun with....
Sheed is a 36% 3ptFG shooter, meaning if he makes 36 of 100, he scores 108 pts.....to score that same amount on 2 PTFG's , he'd have to shoot 54% or make 18 more 2's than 3's:nod: Numbers are funny....my bruddah!:yo:

I like exciting basketball. I like 4th quarter heroics. I like defense, blocks, rebounding and clutch shooting. That's why I don't watch the Orlando Magic.

I wasn't referring to the end of the game, I was talking about Flip becoming more like LB, because none of the things you just mentioned are on display in LB's current team.

The last thing Detroit needs is for Flip to become more like LB.

hey, BroMerc...here's a stat I always have fun with....
Sheed is a 36% 3ptFG shooter, meaning if he makes 36 of 100, he scores 108 pts.....to score that same amount on 2 PTFG's , he'd have to shoot 54% or make 18 more 2's than 3's:nod: Numbers are funny....my bruddah!:yo:

Wassup HQ,
Yes this is a valid point... unfortunately we don't get as many offensive rebounds shooting 3's... deep shots also create easy run outs for the other guys... and less FT attempts for us... other than that BOMBS AWAY!!!

It really comes down to how selective you are with your 3's... if you come up and jack one up with 20 secs left on the clock, the defense didn't have to expend any energy and prolly didn't risk getting in foul trouble for the QTR.
If they moved it around and the choice was a contested shot on the blocks or an open shot from outside then there shouldn't be a question of which is your best option... at least you gave your teammates a chance to set up for an "O" board (LB preferred everything down low).

My preference is no predictability... I'm ok with a quick bomb from CB once or twice a game just to keep em off balance.
As we said before the inside game sets up the outside game and vice versa.

The good, bad & strange

The good: We finally got to see Sheed on the blocks (still not enough)... it's almost instant success for him down there... something good should happen... Joe should wrote in his contract ...for every 3 you miss we deduct $1,000... for every post up shot you get $2000.
Also nice to see them starting to use Prince as a slasher where he doesn't have to body up... that floater is almost unblockable.

The bad: Still not much to be impressed with from our bench.... neither Delfino or Evans did much... if you think they did go take a look at some other teams box scores...... sorry this ain't enough production from any of them.

The strange: How did the team that played the night before come out with twice the energy of the team that had three days off?
Anyone notice how many wide open uncontested shots Chicago missed?

They all don't have to be dominant victories... I was glad to hear that Flip addressed the excessive 3's with the team... hopefully this will stick for a while.... ?

Good analogy Mercury
I was hoping that Flip would address the Sheed three ball issue and reel him back in. He was 1-5 from beyond the arc and did think about it a couple of times before passing or trying that awkward drive where his shot was way off. Agree that driving to the hoop is going to improve Tay's game and confidence until he gets the long shot back.

I know there has to be a transition between Delk and Arroyo, but our bench should have progressed more so at this juncture of the season, than it has. We all complained about this in December and January, and some said that we would be OK. Face it, this bench is not ready for the playoffs. :frusty:

The Bulls had the same energy they had the night before in Jersey and we looked like we had just come back from the west coast the night before. Lets hope that next two days off get us back in game shape

I will take the needed win and the improved play inside, as well as the dominance on the offensive boards, but overall we have get on the positive side of the overall rebounding battle as well as get some consistence offensive play from the bench ...what?...Flip does not call any plays for them???

I don't mind getting out rebounded if we have a better offensive rebound total. We bricked 18 more attempts at their basket.

we only lost the boards because we shot 10% worse than them. someone was wondering why the bulls had more energy early. usually the team that has the advantage in rest will do bad early since they're more rusty, but they'll usually do better at the end of the game since they have more energy.

hey, BroMerc...here's a stat I always have fun with....
Sheed is a 36% 3ptFG shooter, meaning if he makes 36 of 100, he scores 108 pts.....to score that same amount on 2 PTFG's , he'd have to shoot 54% or make 18 more 2's than 3's:nod: Numbers are funny....my bruddah!:yo:

Your forget to take into account drawing fouls. Assuming Sheed almost never gets fouled taking 3's he's scoring 108 pts per 100 shots. 82 games says Sheed scores 1.7 pts on free throws per game. He shoots 8.0 2-pointers per game, so in a hundred 2 point shots, he'd get an extra 21.3 points from fouls. He also shoots 48% for 2 point shots, which means for 100 2-pt shots, he gets 96 points+21.3 from fouls=117.3

117.3>108, plus he draws fouls on guys.

Sheed, shoot the 2

Your forget to take into account drawing fouls. Assuming Sheed almost never gets fouled taking 3's he's scoring 108 pts per 100 shots. 82 games says Sheed scores 1.7 pts on free throws per game. He shoots 8.0 2-pointers per game, so in a hundred 2 point shots, he'd get an extra 21.3 points from fouls. He also shoots 48% for 2 point shots, which means for 100 2-pt shots, he gets 96 points+21.3 from fouls=117.3

117.3>108, plus he draws fouls on guys.

Sheed, shoot the 2

That's some good analysis. I'm convinced. Another factor that would support your argument is that Sheed is not available to rebound his misses when he's outside the 3-point line. Also, missed 3's lead to fast breaks for the other team. Since Sheed is the one who is back, he'll be the one picking up the fouls.

It is such a fluid game isn't it?

I think these numbers are bogus.
If sheed shoots 8, 2pts at 48% per game + 1.7 for fouls = 48%x16+ 1.7=9.38 per game avg. Or it takes 10.66 games for him to score 100 pts. On 2s alone.
But if Sheed shoots .385% on 6, 3 pointers he nets, .385x18=6.9 pts on 3s only. Or 6.9+9.38=16.2 per game.
Now if Sheed takes 8+6 or 14 3s per game and shoots 50% which he will do in the playoffs he nets 21 pts. What if he shoots .75% on 3s [31 pts]? He's gonna kill the other team.
These are the questions we should be asking our children.

That's whack.

If he shoots 100%, then I would prefer he takes all 3's and gets fouled too. Preferably, he would then proceed to make the free-throw. That would eliminate the whole rebounding problem we have been having.

I think these numbers are bogus.
If sheed shoots 8, 2pts at 48% per game + 1.7 for fouls = 48%x16+ 1.7=9.38 per game avg. Or it takes 10.66 games for him to score 100 pts. On 2s alone.
But if Sheed shoots .385% on 6, 3 pointers he nets, .385x18=6.9 pts on 3s only. Or 6.9+9.38=16.2 per game.
Now if Sheed takes 8+6 or 14 3s per game and shoots 50% which he will do in the playoffs he nets 21 pts. What if he shoots .75% on 3s [31 pts]? He's gonna kill the other team.
These are the questions we should be asking our children.

He is MUCH more likely to shoot 2 for 14 than he is 7 for 14.

Where's your faith baby? He and Bup-Bup were shooting .42% in the first half. You don't think they'll nut it up for the playoffs?

Your forget to take into account drawing fouls. Assuming Sheed almost never gets fouled taking 3's he's scoring 108 pts per 100 shots. 82 games says Sheed scores 1.7 pts on free throws per game. He shoots 8.0 2-pointers per game, so in a hundred 2 point shots, he'd get an extra 21.3 points from fouls. He also shoots 48% for 2 point shots, which means for 100 2-pt shots, he gets 96 points+21.3 from fouls=117.3

117.3>108, plus he draws fouls on guys.

Sheed, shoot the 2We both have issues that we know this, my bruddahs!:laugh: