This test has been formulated to figure out who has the best feel for Darko's currently existing capabilities (i.e. not long-term potential). The benchmarks used are taken from the 10th-ranked Center in the NBA for each category last season.

For each right answer, you get 1 point. For each wrong answer, you lose 1 point. Winners will be determined during the All-Star break and will receive a Darko Milicic related item purchased off of Ebay. All votes need to be in before the start of the season.

Tiebreaker- predict the actual # of points per game he averages to as many decimal places as you want.

This test has been formulated to figure out who has the best feel for Darko's currently existing capabilities (i.e. not long-term potential). The benchmarks used are taken from the 10th-ranked Center in the NBA for each category last season.

For each right answer, you get 1 point. For each wrong answer, you lose 1 point. Winners will be determined during the All-Star break and will receive a Darko Milicic related item purchased off of Ebay. All votes need to be in before the start of the season.

Tiebreaker- predict the actual # of points per game he averages to as many decimal places as you want.

You lost me with the prize...but it should be fun seeing if he meets these thresholds. Pretty cool idea Tashawn. :)

You lost me with the prize...but it should be fun seeing if he meets these thresholds. Pretty cool idea Tashawn. :)

The prize will be something between $10 and $20 purchased off of Ebay and it will be Darko related. It may be a jersey, a signed picture, a bleached lock of hair, a bobble-head, or anything else that I can find.

I'll sweeten the pot. The Winner will also receive a "Darko Expert" tag on their forum profile, as well as a thread devoted to their Darko Intelligence.

Cool idea!! I continue to be amazed by the continued interest in this NBAer. I don't believe it will wane anytime soon, either.

I already voted at the beginning of the thread. Are you able to determine how each of us voted or are we supposed to submit again, before the season starts?

lazy, click on one of the "numbers" on the poll to see who voted...

Once you vote, you can see how everyone else voted. Just remember to submit your ppg tiebreaker guess before Nov 1.

This poll would be more useful if the numbers were "per game" instead of "per 40 minutes".

By the all star break I am projecting

12.7 pts
5.6 rebounds
2.8 assts
.7 stl
2.1 blks

for 28 minutes

This poll would be more useful if the numbers were "per game" instead of "per 40 minutes".
I do not agree.

This poll would be more useful if the numbers were "per game" instead of "per 40 minutes".
Its not useful in the first place...its just for fun. I think the real fun is Darko's stats AFTER the break.

I'll sweeten the pot. The Winner will also receive a "Darko Expert" tag on their forum profile, as well as a thread devoted to their Darko Intelligence.

Oh, that's just mean.

Great idea Tay.

The benchmarks used are taken from the 10th-ranked Center in the NBA for each category last season.
This is why it's per 40 and not per game. Having to predict Darko's minutes in addition to the stats would add another dimension to each stat category and confuse the beejezus out of many of us.

40 is equalized. I think that makes sense.

This poll would be more useful if the numbers were "per game" instead of "per 40 minutes".

I don't want Brian Hill to be the reason that somebody's predictions don't come true.

My guess for points per game would be 12.5, prior to the All-Star break.

The only one I think I might be too high on is the rebounds. With Dwight there, DMC will have to really go for them. But then, they were for per/40 minutes. I guess that is OK.

In the words of the immortal Guilda Radner, "Never mind".

no player is an island. you have to take in the dwight for rebouns but dwight, jameer and hedo are all potential assists opportunities.

Points Per 40 - 15.28145798512

Points per: 14.666

Points Per 40 - 15.28145798512

Dangit Jammer. That's exactly what I was going to suggest. Now I gotta think of a new one.

pp40 = 14.3

How about a JMax expert licensing exam!!

Per 40 minutes he will exceed

20 points
10 rebounds
15 foul shots attempted
5 knockdowns of opponents
10 clearout of opponents
5 awsome throwdowns
15 oohs and aahs from the Palace crowd.
:gun1:

Oh, no!!!

Not another hi-jacking of a Darko thread !!!

Dangit Jammer. That's exactly what I was going to suggest. Now I gotta think of a new one.

Yeah, I kept going back and forth between 15.28145798511 and 15.28145798513 so I decided to split the difference and go with 15.28145798512.

darko will average 20 pts per 40 min. i believe d. howard will have such a monster season darko will just bomb away out of double teams. he will rarely have to create his shot. some nights d. howard will kill teams and other nights darko will. just pick your poison.

btw.
blocks will be 3.5 per 40
assists will be 5 per 40

darko will average 20 pts per 40 min.

:pound:

I'll have what he's having!

Can i ask why everybody here likes JMAX that much?

Can i ask why everybody here likes JMAX that much?


Because he rules!

Mostly because he plays really hard, and that makes him exciting to watch. He charges to the rim, knocks guys down (while drawing the foul) and almost rips the rim off every single time he dunks. He blocks shots against guys 5 inches taller by sheer force and willpower. He runs the floor. He DOESN"T PASS out of a doubleteam. He isn't that other guy. He is, in front of our very eyes, "going to work" incarnate.

At least that's why I like him.

Can i ask why everybody here likes JMAX that much?

Have you seen him play? If not, I'm sure you'll like him when you do see him.

He may be an undersized black hole, but he's OUR undersized black hole.

Two words: Pistons DNA

He may be an undersized black hole, but he's OUR undersized black hole.

Two words: Pistons DNA

Technically, I think that is one word and one acronym.

Two words: Bill Sucks

He may be an undersized black hole, but he's OUR undersized black hole.

Two words: Pistons DNA

is selfishness part of pistons dna???

http://www.pistonsforum.com/images/picdump/tashawn_102306.gif

You can see everyone's positions in handy grid form if you follow the link.

Since we a few different potential tie situations and is impracticle to have everyone post away with extended decimal point predictions, I'd like to reserve the right to run a tiebreaker if there are indeed ties at the end. It will be simple and fair and may involve a 1 game point guess.

Anyway, the range of predictions sheds light on why we have never reached a consensus on Darko. But now, the argument will not be settled through debate, but rather by the Serbian Gangster himself. Wait and see. :gun1: :grouphug:

http://www.pistonsforum.com/images/picdump/tashawn_102306.gif

You can see everyone's positions in handy grid form if you follow the link.

Since we a few different potential tie situations and is impracticle to have everyone post away with extended decimal point predictions, I'd like to reserve the right to run a tiebreaker if there are indeed ties at the end. It will be simple and fair and may involve a 1 game point guess.

Anyway, the range of predictions sheds light on why we have never reached a consensus on Darko. But now, the argument will not be settled through debate, but rather by the Serbian Gangster himself. Wait and see. :gun1: :grouphug:

awesome work ta! wow! that's very cool. i was a little surprised to see the generalization associated with my prediction (intuitively I would have thought I viewed Dartho somewhat more positively), but I think it fits pretty well. and i'm always happy to be riding close to dba in any race revolving around numbers.

Great work, Ta. I did not classify myself quite as high because I though we were going by the number 10 center in the league, not by the best. But if it worked out that way, I am not ashamed.

This will be the year that he begins to take his proper place in the scheme of things. At least, it seems as though he controls his own destiny now.

If he makes it, good, and if he doesn't, it will be his own fault.

That's all I ever asked.

The generalizations are a bit of a joke. I'm just having fun.

I just thought that everyone is probably a little sick of making the same arguments over and over. So, I wanted to break down the different camps out there a little bit and provide a goal line.

When it is all said and done, we will have 1 official expert who's wisdom should not be misunderestimated.

I predict Darko will average 7.925342 points per game at the All-Star break.

Sorry, guys. I thought this was too good a photo to not share:

http://www.nba.com/media/milicic_300_060412.jpg Fernando Medina/NBAE/Getty Images
Milicic may just be poised for a breakout campaign



I would have posted it no matter who it is.

Why isn't he just dunking it?

The photographer who shot is said that he went up outside the foul lane. It was apparently a pre-game thing and he wanted to see if he could make it from that far away.

The photo said it was more exciting than the foul line dunk from a while back.

That's all I heard about it. I just liked the photo, no matter who was in it.

Oh, and you have to admit, he can jump higher than even Bill Laimbeer could :pound: :pound: :pound: :pound: !!

It's one of the nicest live action armpit shots I have seen

roscoe, I knew you would be able to appreciate the finer points :winner_first_h4h: !!

What the photographer actually said about it was:

"It was a pregame exhibition. Darko actually jumped over the Raptor, coming in on an angled trajectory, and is about to demonstrate his amazing reach by dunking the ball from the side of the FT alley while his mommentum is moving him away from the basket. It was really breath taking when I took that picture. So much more impressive than the FT line dunks of folklore".

Anyway, I thought it was a neat shot!!

So... did he actually make the basket?

16 points/ 40 min http://www.pistonsforum.com/images/pfv2/polls/bar2-l.gifhttp://www.pistonsforum.com/images/pfv2/polls/bar2.gifhttp://www.pistonsforum.com/images/pfv2/polls/bar2-r.gif 11 (http://www.pistonsforum.com/detroit-pistons-general-discussion/poll-145-darko-will-exceed-following-benchmarks-all-star-game.html) 34.38% 12 rebounds/ 40 min http://www.pistonsforum.com/images/pfv2/polls/bar3-l.gifhttp://www.pistonsforum.com/images/pfv2/polls/bar3.gifhttp://www.pistonsforum.com/images/pfv2/polls/bar3-r.gif 7 (http://www.pistonsforum.com/detroit-pistons-general-discussion/poll-145-darko-will-exceed-following-benchmarks-all-star-game.html) 21.88% 1.75 assists/ 40 min http://www.pistonsforum.com/images/pfv2/polls/bar4-l.gifhttp://www.pistonsforum.com/images/pfv2/polls/bar4.gifhttp://www.pistonsforum.com/images/pfv2/polls/bar4-r.gif 19 (http://www.pistonsforum.com/detroit-pistons-general-discussion/poll-145-darko-will-exceed-following-benchmarks-all-star-game.html) 59.38% 2.25 blocks/ 40 min http://www.pistonsforum.com/images/pfv2/polls/bar5-l.gifhttp://www.pistonsforum.com/images/pfv2/polls/bar5.gifhttp://www.pistonsforum.com/images/pfv2/polls/bar5-r.gif 22 (http://www.pistonsforum.com/detroit-pistons-general-discussion/poll-145-darko-will-exceed-following-benchmarks-all-star-game.html) 68.75% 0.75 steals/ 40 min http://www.pistonsforum.com/images/pfv2/polls/bar6-l.gifhttp://www.pistonsforum.com/images/pfv2/polls/bar6.gifhttp://www.pistonsforum.com/images/pfv2/polls/bar6-r.gif 9 (http://www.pistonsforum.com/detroit-pistons-general-discussion/poll-145-darko-will-exceed-following-benchmarks-all-star-game.html) 28.13% None of the above http://www.pistonsforum.com/images/pfv2/polls/bar1-l.gifhttp://www.pistonsforum.com/images/pfv2/polls/bar1.gifhttp://www.pistonsforum.com/images/pfv2/polls/bar1-r.gif 5 (http://www.pistonsforum.com/detroit-pistons-general-discussion/poll-145-darko-will-exceed-following-benchmarks-all-star-game.html) 15.63%


In addition to those above, I suggest a couple Darko statistics sure to be of interest during the season:

Flip engendered twitch/ 40 min = 3,167 :rant:

Dumars' "dat durned it"*/ 40 min = 723 :yell:



*In deference to the pale circumlocutions of Richard Prior. :pray:

linwood, the only things I know about it are the statement of the photographer. He said that "he was about to demonstrate his . . . .".

From that, I would assume he did, but I just liked it because it is a good shot.

Gee, you never doubted that he made it, did you :rolleyes: :stirthepot: :pound: !!

linwood, the only things I know about it are the statement of the photographer. He said that "he was about to demonstrate his . . . .".

From that, I would assume he did, but I just liked it because it is a good shot.

Gee, you never doubted that he made it, did you :rolleyes: :stirthepot: :pound: !!

Of course I never doubted. It's just that, when you hear a great story, and you know it's going to have a happy ending, you still want to hear it!

:)

linwood, I know, I like happy endings, too.

I know this is way off point but in movies, even though they are pure fiction, why do some of them have to have a sudden, unhappy, downright mean and nasty ending?

I loved a couple of Kevin Costner's movies right up until the end and then hated them. 'Tin Cup' and the one about the Indians come to mind.

And just this past week, we finally rented 'Pay It Forward' and it was a great feel good movie, pure fiction, but right at the end they had to stretch to give it a mean ending. My wife and I just sat there and said, "why did they have to do that?"

There are not so many romantics these days, it seems.

linwood, I know, I like happy endings, too.

I know this is way off point but in movies, even though they are pure fiction, why do some of them have to have a sudden, unhappy, downright mean and nasty ending?

I loved a couple of Kevin Costner's movies right up until the end and then hated them. 'Tin Cup' and the one about the Indians come to mind.

And just this past week, we finally rented 'Pay It Forward' and it was a great feel good movie, pure fiction, but right at the end they had to stretch to give it a mean ending. My wife and I just sat there and said, "why did they have to do that?"

There are not so many romantics these days, it seems.

Count me as one of the romantics. Through and through, my friend.

Although we have a very small sample size so far, I thought I would show how Darko is mearuring up so far. Keep in mind that he has not yet had a game that has been considered good or that anyone has talked about. Just average stuff from the guy.

Actual/40 minutes (benchmark)

Points- 19 (16) passing
Rebs- 11 (12) barely failing
Assists- 2.1 (1.75) passing
Steals- .70 (.75) barely failing
Blocks- 2.8 (2.25) passing


So far, he is getting most of his on-court time with Howard on the bench. One would think that would hurt his assist #'s and help his rebounding numbers. I'll re-calculate after he gives us more data.

I haven't checked, but JMax's 40 minutes stats must look great so far.

Although we have a very small sample size so far, I thought I would show how Darko is mearuring up so far. Keep in mind that he has not yet had a game that has been considered good or that anyone has talked about. Just average stuff from the guy.

Actual/40 minutes (benchmark)

Points- 19 (16) passing
Rebs- 11 (12) barely failing
Assists- 2.1 (1.75) passing
Steals- .70 (.75) barely failing
Blocks- 2.8 (2.25) passing


So far, he is getting most of his on-court time with Howard on the bench. One would think that would hurt his assist #'s and help his rebounding numbers. I'll re-calculate after he gives us more data.

I haven't checked, but JMax's 40 minutes stats must look great so far.

A shame his foul problems aren't weighted.

I'm really hoping the Darko and the Magic have a bad year, so we will get a good pick.

as an fyi. per 40 minutes. this is through a whopping 3 games :)

darko / j-max:

18.9 / 16.8 points
11.2 / 7.4 rebounds
2.1 / 0.0 assists
2.8 / 4.2 blocks
0.7 / 1.1 steals

as an fyi. per 40 minutes. this is through a whopping 3 games :)

darko / j-max:

18.9 / 16.8 points
11.2 / 7.4 rebounds
2.1 / 0.0 assists
2.8 / 4.2 blocks
0.7 / 1.1 steals

Interesting. Looks like Jam-X is outblocking the Serbian Swat Machine.
Does anyone know what their per 40 minute salary comparison looks like per 40?

Darko was averaging 16.5 minutes in his first two games and had almost 25 tonight. So I added it up and divided by 3 to get 19.3 minutes per game for the Serbian Gangsta.

Darko
Minutes: 19.3 per game
Annual Salary: $5,218,627 (per StoryTeller's Salaries)
Salary prorated to 40 MPG: $10,815,807

Brahma
Minutes: 12.7 per game
Annual Salary: $973,440 (per StoryTeller's Salaries)
Salary prorated to 40 MPG: $3,065,952

Here's a stat for you:

Thru 3 games

Ben Wallace Free Throw Pct. 6/9 = .625
Darko Free Throw Pct. 5/13 = .385

Ben has made more free throws with less attempts. How funny is that? lol.

here's a stat for you. through 2 games. darko is undefeated against ben. 2 - 0. darko pretty much owns ben and whatever team he plays for.

darko / ben per 40 minutes head to head.

15 / 4 pts
8 / 6.7rebs
2 / 1.3 assists
0 /1.3 steals
2 / .67 blocks


don't let the numbers fool you darko is still a square peg getting stuck into a round hole. he's doing ok but those numbers will explode in the right situation. b. hill is using him all wrong. he's got darko in the post only, darko hasn't shot a jumpshot all season. he won't play darko and d. howard at the same time so teams can easily focus on either one.

he won't play darko and d. howard at the same time so teams can easily focus on either one.

I haven't seen any Magic games, but the notion of a high/low post offense with Darko and Howard at the same time does seem one of the more obvious things.

here's a stat for you. through 2 games. darko is undefeated against ben. 2 - 0. darko pretty much owns ben and whatever team he plays for.

darko / ben per 40 minutes head to head.

15 / 4 pts
8 / 6.7rebs
2 / 1.3 assists
0 /1.3 steals
2 / .67 blocks


don't let the numbers fool you darko is still a square peg getting stuck into a round hole. he's doing ok but those numbers will explode in the right situation. b. hill is using him all wrong. he's got darko in the post only, darko hasn't shot a jumpshot all season. he won't play darko and d. howard at the same time so teams can easily focus on either one.

You are hilarious. When Ben put up that line Darko didn't even play the majority of the game. Try again. Ben has had superior games against defenders far more accredited than Darko. Darko has yet to have a great game this season. If you wipe out the Atlanta game from two years back, he has nothing. He's mediocre. Average. A good sub at best. He's shown little less. Ben is an all-star and a contributing member to a championship team. No comparison. Nothing to see here folks. This ones over before the bell rings. Keep it movin'.

Ben did fill up the stat sheet last night in a big way.

6 points, 4 assists, 3 steals, 5 blocks, and 1 TO.

But he did play for 40 minutes, so there can be no extrapolating.

You are hilarious. When Ben put up that line Darko didn't even play the majority of the game. Try again. Ben has had superior games against defenders far more accredited than Darko. Darko has yet to have a great game this season. If you wipe out the Atlanta game from two years back, he has nothing. He's mediocre. Average. A good sub at best. He's shown little less. Ben is an all-star and a contributing member to a championship team. No comparison. Nothing to see here folks. This ones over before the bell rings. Keep it movin'.

you missed the point. i wasn't comparing thier overall careers. i was comparing thier head to head matchups. darko hasn't had as many 30 minute games as ben has to have good games. when his minutes increase his numbers will increase. i don't ever recall ben having a game close to darko's atlanta game. ben is one dimensional and darko can be dominant on both ends of the court.


I haven't seen any Magic games, but the notion of a high/low post offense with Darko and Howard at the same time does seem one of the more obvious things.

well it's not to b. hill. he's busy trying to make darko earn it and he'll be sad when darko is gone next year. darko's passing ability will only increase d. howards effectiveness. they will make each other better.

you missed the point. i wasn't comparing thier overall careers. i was comparing thier head to head matchups. darko hasn't had as many 30 minute games as ben has to have good games. when his minutes increase his numbers will increase. i don't ever recall ben having a game close to darko's atlanta game. ben is one dimensional and darko can be dominant on both ends of the court.

You obviously missed the NBA finals 2004.

How about 65% shooting, 18 pts 22 rebounds 3 steals and 1 block in the clinching game?

Has Darko has a 20+ rebound game in his career? Will he ever?

Man you really don't have a clue of what Ben did here. Read up please, you might be..dare I say impressed.

Not to mention his consistent,dominating rebounding, blocks and steal numbers he has put up during his entire career as a Piston. How easily we forget, huh. Maybe you're just not trying. At least you have your one Darko game to be excited about. Keep it close bballjay. Keep it very close. lol.

You obviously missed the NBA finals 2004.

How about 65% shooting, 18 pts 22 rebounds 3 steals and 1 block in the clinching game?

even the sun even shines on a dog's butt sometimes.

1 game out of 698. ben put together a complete game. no i'm not impressed.


Has Darko has a 20+ rebound game in his career? Will he ever?

has darko ever quit on his team during the middle of a championship run? will he ever?

Man you really don't have a clue of what Ben did here. Read up please, you might be..dare I say impressed.
[quote]

that's what ben did past tense. his best years are behind him. i remember how ben quit on us and caused us to lose.

[quote]
Not to mention his consistent,dominating rebounding, blocks and steal numbers he has put up during his entire career as a Piston. How easily we forget, huh. Maybe you're just not trying. At least you have your one Darko game to be excited about. Keep it close bballjay. Keep it very close. lol.

i used to like ben until he became a malcontent. i liked him until i saw that it was him that didn't want the young bigs to develop. i liked him until he made joe choose him or darko and then turned around and stabbed joe and the pistons org in the back.

actually i have a career of great games from darko to look forward to. you can remember thost past tense great games from ben. skiles is even sitting ben on the bench already. if chicago gets behind they simply can't afford to have him on the floor. so yeah ben had a good game the other day but only because it was a blowout.

Still got no data to back up anything, only illusions of Puff the Magic Dragons, Easter Bunnies and Great Pumpkins.

Dude please look at the stats, you are embarassing yourself. The game I mentioned was one of many awesome games by Ben. There are way to many to even respond too. Prior to Flip he was very close to averaging a double double. The game I listed wasn't even his best game it just came during the best time.

I want to say that he had at least 50 games in 2004 where Ben had at least 15 pts and 15 rebounds in the same game to go with his 4-6 blocks and 2-6 steal game performances. His career with the Pistons is FULL of examples.

Dude was a monster prior to Flip. An absolute monster.

Darko has 1strong game.

Please stop.

Darko quit whenever he went out during garbage minutes.

Ben quit once.

Again, this isn't really close. We're talking about one of the most dominating defensive players of all-time next to a guy who is having problems getting pass Tony Battie in the starting lineup. Right now he's a mediocre player. Average sub.

Quick update:

After Darko's last crappy game, he somehow pulled all of his #'s into passing territory. And for some reason, he had to guard Antoine Jamison on the perimeter the whole time he was in there last night.

Per 40
Points- 16.16 (16) passing
Rebs- 12.01 (12) passing
Blcks- 2.49 (2.25) passing
Assists- 2.07 (1.75) passing
Steals- 1.04 (0.75) passing

Maybe the reason that he doesn't seem like he is very good is that he is about 10th in every category. However, if he can maintain, then he would probably be the only center in the league to accomplish that feat.

Still got no data to back up anything, only illusions of Puff the Magic Dragons, Easter Bunnies and Great Pumpkins.
i posted data of head to head matchups you chose to ignore it and post about the past 6 years of glory by ben. i didn't say darko was a better player right now or in the past. i said head to head darko owns ben. you post some data to dispute that.



Dude was a monster prior to Flip. An absolute monster.

he was a monster prior to the ego trip.


Please stop.

Darko quit whenever he went out during garbage minutes.

Ben quit once.

ben quit when the game was still being decided and his team lost. darko didn't play hard cause the game was already decided and didn't want to be a part of the lb sideshow.


Again, this isn't really close. We're talking about one of the most dominating defensive players of all-time next to a guy who is having problems getting pass Tony Battie in the starting lineup. Right now he's a mediocre player. Average sub.

he's having the same problems he had here. folks telling him to earn it instead of just playing the better player. ben is catching quite a bit of bench time in chicago too. he isn't having trouble getting past battie really cause b.hill keeps subbing darko in for d.howard. ben would sit behind howard too.

why are you still talking about the past???? ben will suck for the next 4 years and you'll still bring up his old news dpoy wins.

Maybe the reason that he doesn't seem like he is very good is that he is about 10th in every category. However, if he can maintain, then he would probably be the only center in the league to accomplish that feat.

darko is like the 7' ak47. the serbian swat machine can do it all. his stats will get better cause he'll be starting or playing 30 minutes by game 20 of the season.

i don't ever recall ben having a game close to darko's atlanta game. ben is one dimensional and darko can be dominant on both ends of the court.

The info I provided was in response to this quote by YOU, which as we both know is a pretty ridiculous thing to say now, right? I won't bring up old stats if you don't make false statements.

Care to address that...or ignore it?

The head to head response was simply this... Darko didn't play Ben the entire time so it is difficult and damn near inaccurate to accredit Darko for Ben's bad play. Darko played a whopping 18 mins that game. 18 measley minutes! Darko was simply on the winning team, which to me says nothing in regards to his talent versus Ben's now. Do you see why its hard to take your arguements seriously?

Your thoughts about Ben and him being put on the bench in Chicago are fabricated. Show me a quote where the Bulls coaching staff or players are unhappy with his play. You've manufactured a biased-based lie to prove your point yet again. Everything I've read has said that Chicago is getting exactly want they want out of Ben. Ben has played 28, 41, and 40 mins in Chicago's only games of the season. What bench time problem are you talking about? That's more than our friggin' starters!!!!!

Statisically Ben has been better than Darko this season. Darko hasn't done anything yet this year noteworthy. No break out game. Poor field goal pct and poor free throw shooting. Uninspired rebounding and assist numbers. He's had a couple okay games but nothing extraordinary.

Oh yeah...quitting is quitting. Doesn't matter if its big game time or not. And ya boy Darko quit on us multiple times while in a Detroit uniform. I could care less about his excuses. I don't care if he just quit in practice. Unexcusable. I don't excuse Ben for his actions and I certainly don't forgive a player who hasn't shown signs of dominance in three years outside of one game in Atlanta.

...and you are wrong. Ben would play WITH Howard, not sub for him.

lol jay's claims get worse with every post. it's becoming comical. 7' kirilenko. would start for the spurs. guarantee a contender a title. i hope he doesn't stop because this is entertaining.

lol jay's claims get worse with every post. it's becoming comical. 7' kirilenko. would start for the spurs. guarantee a contender a title. i hope he doesn't stop because this is entertaining.

it isn't comical more like prophetic. i like this forum because this post will be here at midseason so all of you can see that i was right about darko.


The info I provided was in response to this quote by YOU, which as we both know is a pretty ridiculous thing to say now, right? I won't bring up old stats if you don't make false statements.

my statement wasn't false. i said "i don't ever recall ben having a game close to darko's atlanta game". how can that be false? who do you think will put up 20 and 10 first darko or ben??


The head to head response was simply this... Darko didn't play Ben the entire time so it is difficult and damn near inaccurate to accredit Darko for Ben's bad play. Darko played a whopping 18 mins that game. 18 measley minutes! Darko was simply on the winning team, which to me says nothing in regards to his talent versus Ben's now. Do you see why its hard to take your arguements seriously?


darko played well against the bulls and the pistons. ben played longer so he should have a bigger effect on the outcome. the fact is he still loss. i didn't say it was ben's fault or darko's game that won. i'm just saying that darko's team won and darko had better games than ben did in head to head matchups.


Your thoughts about Ben and him being put on the bench in Chicago are fabricated. Show me a quote where the Bulls coaching staff or players are unhappy with his play. You've manufactured a biased-based lie to prove your point yet again. Everything I've read has said that Chicago is getting exactly want they want out of Ben. Ben has played 28, 41, and 40 mins in Chicago's only games of the season. What bench time problem are you talking about? That's more than our friggin' starters!!!!!

the 28 game was against orlando because he couldn't stop anybody over 6' 9" tall. of course chicago will think they are getting what they want out of ben. just wait until miami does hack a ben on him in the playoffs.


Statisically Ben has been better than Darko this season. Darko hasn't done anything yet this year noteworthy. No break out game. Poor field goal pct and poor free throw shooting. Uninspired rebounding and assist numbers. He's had a couple okay games but nothing extraordinary.


ben only has better stats because he gets more minutes. so basically what you're saying is even while playing okay darko is statistically better than ben. you're proving my point so as soon as a coach that knows how to use darko get his hands on the serbian swat machine there will be no comparison.


Oh yeah...quitting is quitting. Doesn't matter if its big game time or not. And ya boy Darko quit on us multiple times while in a Detroit uniform. I could care less about his excuses. I don't care if he just quit in practice. Unexcusable. I don't excuse Ben for his actions and I certainly don't forgive a player who hasn't shown signs of dominance in three years outside of one game in Atlanta.

darko's played basically 40 games in those 3 years. look who's bending stats to fit thier point of view. i will say that he has shown defensive dominance.

do you play hard when you play against 8 year olds?? does that make you a quitter for taking it easy on them and not being interested??

ben quit when his old prodigy came to town. ben quit in the heat of a game during a championship run. ben's quitting on us was the turning point of the season. he sucks. it's difficult to say the two types of quits are equal.

...and you are wrong. Ben would play WITH Howard, not sub for him.


i know because ben can't be the 1st option offensively on the second team like darko can. ben has to be carried offensively by d. howard. i stand corrected.

my statement wasn't false. i said "i don't ever recall ben having a game close to darko's atlanta game". how can that be false? who do you think will put up 20 and 10 first darko or ben??

You also said Ben was too one diminensional to put up a game like Darko's. You left that out conveniently to prove your point...again. I'm noticing a trend here. First to 20 and 10 this season? Honestly, I don't see either of them accomplishing that feat. They aren't using Ben like that offensively in Chicago and Darko can't get passed Battie to get the minutes. Only difference is Darko is expected to score. Orlando has already stated that Darko needs to prove he belongs there. I agree with Orlando's management.



darko played well against the bulls and the pistons. ben played longer so he should have a bigger effect on the outcome. the fact is he still loss. i didn't say it was ben's fault or darko's game that won. i'm just saying that darko's team won and darko had better games than ben did in head to head matchups.

So basically the matchup meant nothing. Glad we are on the same page.



the 28 game was against orlando because he couldn't stop anybody over 6' 9" tall. of course chicago will think they are getting what they want out of ben. just wait until miami does hack a ben on him in the playoffs.
Brad Miller and Bogut are both 7 foot tall and you have embarassed yourself again with inaccurate information.


ben only has better stats because he gets more minutes. so basically what you're saying is even while playing okay darko is statistically better than ben. you're proving my point so as soon as a coach that knows how to use darko get his hands on the serbian swat machine there will be no comparison.
Ben is one of the best rebounders in the league after 4 games because he is one of the best rebounders in the game. Period. Darko has not proven that he can perform well given alot of minutes. He hasn't really proven anything except that he can play average and still have you sing his praises. He couldn't beat Dale Davis for minutes and now he can't beat Battie. Sad.


darko's played basically 40 games in those 3 years. look who's bending stats to fit thier point of view. i will say that he has shown defensive dominance.
I said he quit when he played in garbage minutes, but that doesn't help support your opinions so of course you choose to ignore that. He's a quitter. A habitual one at that and his effort will probably be questioned until he proves otherwise. Perhaps Ben learned how to quit from Dorko.


do you play hard when you play against 8 year olds?? does that make you a quitter for taking it easy on them and not being interested??
First of all your comparison of me a 32 year old man versus 8 year olds and Darko versus NBA players is completely ludacris.

Let's take a second to digest just how ridiculous that comment was....

...thank you.

Now the reality is that Darko played against players that were his level or better. For him to think that he was too good to play against them was not only cocky but inaccurate. He probably could have learned something from those guys he was too good to play against.


ben quit when his old prodigy came to town. ben quit in the heat of a game during a championship run. ben's quitting on us was the turning point of the season. he sucks. it's difficult to say the two types of quits are equal.

All of that description was 1 game compared to the continual displays of quitting we've seen from Darko during his tenure as a Piston. The fact that you let that define Ben's entire career and do not hold any resentment for Darko tells the entire story.


i know because ben can't be the 1st option offensively on the second team like darko can. ben has to be carried offensively by d. howard. i stand corrected.

Ben's not asked or paid to be the first option and Darko is not on the bench because he was needed to be the first option on offense..its because he can't play pass Battie.


Feel free to make a REAL point at anytime.

First of all your comparison of me a 32 year old man versus 8 year olds and Darko versus NBA players is completely ludacris.

Let's take a second to digest just how ridiculous that comment was....

...thank you.

:pound:

So I'm guessing a :grouphug: is out of the question?

We are now about 20% of the way to the All-Star break. The data set is becoming more significant. Here is how Darko is tracking...

Per 40
Points- 16.37 (16.00) barely passing
Rebs- 10.78 (12.00) failing
Blcks- 4.35 (2.25) passing. this is his strongest stat.
Ast- 2.07 (1.75) passing. Seems like this will probably hold.
Stl- 1.45 (0.75) passing. Also seems like this will hold.

He is trending towards getting the blcks, ast, and stl categories. He will probably come up short in rebounds... especially if he plays more with Dwight. He's passing in points, but I think this will be 50/50 whether or not he can sustain the pace as they give him more minutes.

I'll recalculate at the 20 game mark.

It's worth noting that Darko had one of his best lines tonight..I won't post it though because I am Darko hater. :)

It's worth noting that Darko had one of his best lines tonight..I won't post it though because I am Darko hater. :)

admitting you have a problem is the first step to recovery. the thing is he probably still won't be starting until the all star break. b. hill is stubborn but they are winning right now so there is no need to change. i'm hoping they trade us bo outlaw for delfino. that way i won't have to follow 3 teams.

admitting you have a problem is the first step to recovery. the thing is he probably still won't be starting until the all star break. b. hill is stubborn but they are winning right now so there is no need to change. i'm hoping they trade us bo outlaw for delfino. that way i won't have to follow 3 teams.

You obviously don't speak from experience as you constantly live in a state of Darko-rose-colored glasses and Ben hatred bliss unwillingly to ever give the "malcontent" props for any of his accomplishments. By the way, it is worth saying that the only reason I don't like Darko much these days is because you've shouted and argued his praises so highly without evidence/performance to back up your claims that I associate Darko with your inability to be logical and unbiased. I don't like Darko because I can't stand your double standards. You've turned me against him. So I hope he sucks and I hope his team sucks so that we can get a good pick.

After saying that, I feel better already. Recovery is bliss.

Oh yeah, word on the street is that Darko will be in the starting lineup very soon as the coach has finally realized that Battie is D-League material. Looks like good ole Darko will finally get a shot at some big minutes. Lets see what he does with it.

Now that you are recovering, you will probably not get that ulcer :pound: !!

You know, I understand what you are saying. When I joined the forums, it was because I wanted to find a place to support Darko because I believed that he was not being treated fairly. I admit, I liked what he showed in bursts, and being an inexperienced teenager, I knew he would not be consistent, and I could live with that.

What got me hooked as a Darko defender was what I considered the many, many cheap shots people kept giving him. He would get these shots even when the subject of people's posts were about something entirely different. They would very often find ways to get in a dig about him and not only did I not feel they were justified but they were just mean-spirited in the fact that the posters had to go way out of context to even bring them up.

So, I know how you feel but from the opposite point of view. I do still like the kid and have found it fun to follow different teams.

I had a good day yesterday. OSU won, Orlando won (tied for best team in the east), Utah won and is the best team in the NBA, the Pistons won (of course I am still a Piston fan), OSU even won in basketball, too.

And it is a sad day when they all lose, too.

I understand about wishing the Magic would do poorly as far as the draft pick, but you would not want them to do too badly as then they would not have to give us the draft pick, at all.

I may be off-base about DMC starting, though. I don't care if they do not rush him starting, as long as his minutes increase. He and the other second unit are a tremendous force off the bench and that is not all bad.

I always enjoy crossing swords with you and quite a few other of the posters here. Not that I am doing that now; I'm agreeing with you.

Right ???

I have no problem with your support of Darko lazy. I find you to be very openminded and I enjoy and respect your position...most of the time. ;)

You obviously don't speak from experience as you constantly live in a state of Darko-rose-colored glasses and Ben hatred bliss unwillingly to ever give the "malcontent" props for any of his accomplishments. By the way, it is worth saying that the only reason I don't like Darko much these days is because you've shouted and argued his praises so highly without evidence/performance to back up your claims that I associate Darko with your inability to be logical and unbiased. I don't like Darko because I can't stand your double standards. You've turned me against him. So I hope he sucks and I hope his team sucks so that we can get a good pick.

i'm like lazy my defense of darko seemed to come from an illogical hatred of him from some posters. he was on our team he was a # 2 pick with great potential. it was like they would be happier if he failed than succeed. they remember peter john ramos instead of the 1 handed running pass on the break from a 7' player. but now they want to develop the youth. it's bs like darko didn't deserve to be supported but jmax does. some people hated darko while he was still on our team.

well the problem is ben isn't tearing up the league. it's proving me right. darko is starting to give you the stats and evidence that you say i need to backup my praise. it's ok to like darko he's just doing what i said he would be doing given the oppurtunity. it's ok for me not to like ben cause he's doing exactly what i said he would be doing (declining).


Oh yeah, word on the street is that Darko will be in the starting lineup very soon as the coach has finally realized that Battie is D-League material. Looks like good ole Darko will finally get a shot at some big minutes. Lets see what he does with it.

oh ok. that's good news i heard that brian hill was happy to have a post threat for when d. howard goes to the bench. what i read into that is darko would still be anchoring the bench for the time being.

i'm hoping they trade us bo outlaw for delfino. that way i won't have to follow 3 teams.

sounds like you are following one team and one player.

i'm like lazy my defense of darko seemed to come from an illogical hatred of him from some posters.

whats illogical about being frustrated with a number 2 pick who thought he was owed something he never earnt?

i mean some of these statements are so outrageous its not funny. I'm suprised motown continues defending something that is not in any doubt whatsoever. i wonder why low hasn't got stuck into these posts?

i still dont know where your darko obsession has come from. maybe you just like to be different, but the moment darko left this team i stopped giving a rats ass about him. same with arroyo, same with evans, same with ben. they are now the opposition. why don't you just change to the magic, theres no shame in it. a lot of people follow individual players and pretend to follow the team. (re: jordan and bulls. where are all the bulls fans now?)

it would actually make more sense if you went for the magic. at least there would be a logical reason for your bias.

ps: its a shame this darko thread has been hijacked by darko again. :nerd2:

hello old piston frends i hope everyone has been doing good it has been awile i have been to busy to post alot hear or on my blog plus my team of riting profestionals is busy to but rest asured i have been folowing darko and i must say that i am very happy with his progress to date. we should all be happy for darko finally geting a chance to play and show his stuff the man is alreddy realizing his potencial. i bet the pistons miss him but oh well. lazyberbs i am glad you are still fighting the good fight.

I'm suprised motown continues defending something that is not in any doubt whatsoever. i wonder why low hasn't got stuck into these posts?

Low is obviously alot smarter than I am. lol.

whats illogical about being frustrated with a number 2 pick who thought he was owed something he never earnt?

frustration is different than hatred. the thing is he was owed a chance. i see you are fooled by the company line. there is nothing to earn on the pistons. look at delfino, maxiell, amir this year. those guys are struggling to get minutes even though it came down from management to play the young guys.

but aren't you glad we made him earn it?? he's shutting down the paint in orlando while we struggle to keep some guy named armstrong out of ours. hadn't scored an nba point until he played the pistons.


i still dont know where your darko obsession has come from. maybe you just like to be different, but the moment darko left this team i stopped giving a rats ass about him. same with arroyo, same with evans, same with ben. they are now the opposition. why don't you just change to the magic, theres no shame in it. a lot of people follow individual players and pretend to follow the team. (re: jordan and bulls. where are all the bulls fans now?)


some people take up for the little guy, some people just kick him because everyone else is kicking him. i made my own opinion about darko instead of downing him because it was the in thing to do. i made my own opinion about whether he deserved playing time instead of just repeating the company line of "earn" it.

i'm a piston fan and i don't want us to keep repeating the mistakes we made with darko. so far this season we haven't learned about playing our youth. this year will have another exodus of young talent. and some of you will still recite the company line of "earn" it as we bring in more aging vets and continue to fall out of the elite teams of the nba.

Low is obviously alot smarter than I am. lol.

i am obviously smarter than you too. :) when it comes to darko at least.

b. hill is stubborn but they are winning right now so there is no need to change. i'm hoping they trade us bo outlaw for delfino. that way i won't have to follow 3 teams.

Really? I had no idea you were a Bo Outlaw fan.

some people take up for the little guy, some people just kick him because everyone else is kicking him.


I assume you are speaking figuratively, since the little guy here is 7'1", 290 lbs. :detective:

i am obviously smarter than you too. :) when it comes to darko at least.

Actually you are not.

One good game does not justify your claim.

In fact if we judge it purely based on stats, Ben has had more successful/strong games in a Chicago uniform than Darko has had in an Orlando uni. So take that how you will.

Personally I still think Darko will be nothing but an average serviceable player.

However, If Darko does end up becoming an all-star (which I still seriously doubt by the way) it has nothing to do with your logic because it has always been flawed.

I will never be impressed by your jump to giving praise without any substantial evidence.

:) right back at ya!

frustration is different than hatred.

You're wrong there.

Frustration is the path to the Darko Side.

Frustration leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering.

:starwars:

Here is an interesting stat:

So far this year, 82% of Darko's FG attempts have been inside. That's right, just 18% jumpers.

For comparison, JMax shoots 44% jumpers.
Nazr- 39%
Sheed- 82%

Combined with the shot blocking, Darko is contradicting his rep as a finnesse player and is providing an inside pressence on offense and defense for the Magic.

And just think, Dwight Howard takes 84% of his shots from inside. That is a true twin tower type situation going on there.

I thought Sheed was going to go inside more this year with Ben gone? Last year Sheed shot 84% J's. Is a 2% increase from the paint all he can give???

Update through 20 games.
Per 40 minute stats for Darko compared to benchmarks and % diff:

Points- 14.26/16.00/-11% Failing
Rebs- 9.07/12.00/-24% Failing
Asst- 1.85/1.75/+6% Passing
Blck- 3.70/2.25/+64% Passing
Stls- 1.11/0.75/+48% Passing

It looks like he will be short on rebounds and he will be long on blocks and steals.

The stats that are still in play are Points and Assists. Assists will show more volitility because they are a relatively rare occurance compared to points.

Next update will be at the 40 game mark.

...i wonder why low hasn't got stuck into these posts?...

Are you kidding me? I nearly have an aneurism just watching Flip coach...Do you really think I could handle a full-time ongoing debate with bballjay?

Are you kidding me? I nearly have an aneurism just watching Flip coach...Do you really think I could handle a full-time ongoing debate with bballjay?


maybe not by yourself, but perhaps you and motown could go tag-team wrestling style.
but i suppose it doesn't matter how many people you have helping when you're banging your head against a brick wall... :frusty:

Are you kidding me? I nearly have an aneurism just watching Flip coach...Do you really think I could handle a full-time ongoing debate with bballjay?

debating with me is mentally stimulating.

the debate will be ended for a lot of people tonight. some first hand darko watching will make a lot of converts. darko will have a hof career. he will have more dpoy's than ben. he will have more rings than ben. he will have more points than ben. he will have more class than ben. :stirthepot:

debating with me is mentally stimulating....

So is being tazered....


I want none of either.

debating with me is mentally stimulating.

the debate will be ended for a lot of people tonight. some first hand darko watching will make a lot of converts. darko will have a hof career. he will have more dpoy's than ben. he will have more rings than ben. he will have more points than ben. he will have more class than ben. :stirthepot:

someone save this post so in 12 years from now we can cross all these off the list. lol.

Will someone please start a fund to ship yuckface Darko back to Europe so he can be on the serbian forum????!

I'd rather someone give bball Jay some glasses so he can watch Darko play, realize the truth, and never post again.

I'd rather someone give bball Jay some glasses so he can watch Darko play, realize the truth, and never post again.

i do watch darko play. i watch darko more than anyone besides the people in florida and the league passers. some of you like to make posts with only looking at box scores and watching 1 game out 20. do more research and then it will be you realizing the truth.

Geezus. You shouldn't have admitted that. Now you look that much worse.

I probably do the most Darko debating and I live in Tampa, FL, catch the games locally and have NBA League Pass. Go figure.

In my opinion, Hack you have always been accurate in your takes on Darko.

Anyone from the DHOF care to expound on Darko's performance tonight? Or are we waiting for him to at least score 10 pts so we can marvel at what his 48 min stat performance would be like? lol.

I caught most of the 2nd half. He was playing agressively, but really got shut down by Hunter and Dalembert. On one possession, he got blocked at least 3 straight times on dunk attempts.

Howard got blocked a few times too. The 76ers were very active.

Man would the Pistons be good if we had Dalembert instead of Nazr.

Kind of you to mention...

From Charley Rosen:


"Darko Milicic tossed in a pair of left-handed jump hooks on strong drives from the right-box — 2-5, 5 rebounds, 2 blocks, 4 points. In so doing, he made excellent use of his right elbow to fend off his opponent. He also played splendid post-up defense against Wallace (who was 1-5 against him) and against Antonio McDyess (0-2).

Otherwise, Milicic was rarely involved. In fact, he often allowed his man to cut unopposed across the lane as he laid back and sought to block any subsequent shot. Milicic also failed to meet an entry pass that was intercepted and committed a critical 3-second violation in the waning moments of the game. And, because he recoiled his body as he released the ball, he missed both of his free throws.

How often does Milicic put together a complete ball game? Not often enough for the Magic to seriously think about challenging for the championship."

Someone needs to introduce Rosen to the correct camera angles. His analysis is clearly biased and, frankly, just plain wrong. :stirthepot:

During last night's Magic game, the Orlando broadcast ran about a 10 minutes special at halftime called "going home with Darko" or something like that. They went back to Serbia with him last summer and showed his house, interviewed his parents, and showed the surrounding area a little. The whole thing was pretty funny. He had a really nice basketball 1/2 court that it looked like they built in a valley behind their house. The general vibe of the area was a lot more like Spain than what I would have imagined Serbia looking like.

Anyways, Darko showed zero personality as he was giving the tour. It could have been the language barrier, but it also could be that he is just really boring.

This is more how I imagined Serbia to be:
IOL: Serbia's sulkers become cult figures (http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?set_id=1&click_id=29&art_id=iol1166008613691S612)

Also, here is a picture of Darko when he was younger trying to get a scoring opportunity (in the plaid shorts):
http://www.silvija.net/2001YugoAug/sikistrand01.jpg

I think the bridge behind him got bombed by NATO. Any guesses at which pick-up line he used?

what bridge?

Luke, that upside down drawbridge behind the girl. It goes down in the middle rather than up so the boats can go over it instead of under it. :pound:

What happened to him trying to shoot baskets in his youth with bombs falling all around? Thats what they told us when we drafted him.

They say that he still hears the explosions and the screaming when he's at the free throw line.

For some reason, the beach volleyball was omitted from his pre-draft profile.

Okafor is absolutely owning Darko tonight. I haven't seen a physical dominance like this since I whipped on my little brother 10 years ago. Emeka has to be in the running for most improved this year.

Okafor had 13 points in 41 minutes.

What about Sean May's 32 points and 17 free throws? That is where most of the "owning" was going on.

How did Charlotte's starting center do? He got shut out. How about the Magic's starting center? 3 points and 1 rebound. The Magic starting 5 had 20 turnovers!

If the Pistons were missing the starters the Magic are missing, it would mean that Chauncey, Rip, and Tayshaun would all be out. We wouldn't beat anybody either.

Okafor had 13 points in 41 minutes.

What about Sean May's 32 points and 17 free throws? That is where most of the "owning" was going on.

How did Charlotte's starting center do? He got shut out. How about the Magic's starting center? 3 points and 1 rebound. The Magic starting 5 had 20 turnovers!

If the Pistons were missing the starters the Magic are missing, it would mean that Chauncey, Rip, and Tayshaun would all be out. We wouldn't beat anybody either.

lol. You really are a diehard Orlando/Darko fan.

Seems like you're taking the Orlando loss hard.

My comment was based on how Okafor was pushing Darko around getting rebounds and scoring. He was literally man handling him. Besides, most of the time Emeka was playing center with Darko guarding him so I don't see the point about Primo Brezec being relevant. Darko's statline was actually a little more robust than usual. He had 5 assists, 4 boards, 3 blocks tonight. His shooting stank up the place. You're right though, the story of the game was Sean May. The Magic couldn't double on him because of how active Okafur was. A good number of those shots came against Darko by the way. I just couldn't believe how Okafur was pushing Darko around though. Its amazing how much Okafor has changed physically since his rookie season. Looks like those summer sessions with Olajuwan have been paying off because he's had an excellent season so far.

Light day for games tonight on NBA League Pass.

Mo, here's the thing. Okafor played for 41 minutes and Darko played for 26 minutes. Here is how Okafor performed:

In the 24 minutes that they were on the court together, Okafor had 3 points and 5 rebounds to Darko's 6 points and 4 rebounds.

In the 15 minutes that Okafor was on the court without Darko, he scored 10 points and picked up 6 rebounds.


You don't man handle somebody for 3 points.

Mo, here's the thing. Okafor played for 41 minutes and Darko played for 26 minutes. Here is how Okafor performed:

In the 24 minutes that they were on the court together, Okafor had 3 points and 5 rebounds to Darko's 6 points and 4 rebounds.

In the 15 minutes that Okafor was on the court without Darko, he scored 10 points and picked up 6 rebounds.


You don't man handle somebody for 3 points.

hmm... are you sure? I seem to remember a lot more scores than 3 points. lol. I'll take your word for it though Tashawn, maybe I mistook Darko for another Magic player. If so, I stand corrected. Thanks for the clarification and I apologize for the misguided diss. :)

Okafor abuses averybody with his combination of speed and strength. I thnk darko needs to get more aggressive or more involved...he makes good things happen when he has the ball and sometimes be makes great things happen. That touch pass early on was nuts!!!!

People keep saying he is better with HO but I disagree. Darko needs to be a 1st or 2nd option not a 4th option. He needs more responsibility. He needs to carry the team instead of float around. He needs to learn to be dominant. hopefully he'll make strides in that next year.

Okafor abuses averybody with his combination of speed and strength. I thnk darko needs to get more aggressive or more involved...he makes good things happen when he has the ball and sometimes be makes great things happen. That touch pass early on was nuts!!!!

People keep saying he is better with HO but I disagree. Darko needs to be a 1st or 2nd option not a 4th option. He needs more responsibility. He needs to carry the team instead of float around. He needs to learn to be dominant. hopefully he'll make strides in that next year.

This was the point I was trying to make, but, unfortunately was not as eloquent. Thanks Slip! I'll take it easy on you in the open league now. ;)

Emeka O is a very physical player. That's sort of his forte. The few times they were in contact were when Darko was trying to box him out, which I agree was unsuccessful. But Okafor had his full attention and just fought through it. I think Okafor also took a charge when DM was trying to post him up.

Other noteworthy performances were Adam Morrison and Trav Deiner. The 2 of them were a combined 12-18 with 6 threes.

I'm just wondering why in the World Brian Hill continues to give Pat Garrity playing time. Last night he was -10 in 10 minutes. They had Garrity, Diener, Reddick, Dooling, and Howard in the game. All you need is 1 defensive weak link to get pounded, and they had 4 in there.

It's a good example for Flip Saunders. If the Magic are sacrificing games to develop players, then we can.

TaShawn, you think we should develop Pat Garrity? :nerd2: :MusicBigGrin: :stirthepot:

I guess I'm beginning to think of Garrity as one of those guys that sucks, but who all coaches like... Michael Curry was like that too. These are the guys that laugh at every joke the coach makes, ask questions during film sessions, and tell on the guys that go to the strip clubs after curfew.

MoTown, you are very fair and it's time I acknowledged it. I was feeling that you were wrong about this particular diss of DMC because I did not see it that way, but I did not want to come on and argue about it. But when Tay did, you handled it very fairly. :cheerleader: And that's not the first time.

I, myself, was more provoked with DMC last night for the way Sean May kept scoring. Darko was keeping his hands straight up, probably because he is trying to avoid fouls, and May understood and was scoring on him.

By the way, that touch pass was absolutely . . . . . And right before it, the pass to Dwight under the basket was so fast that if some blinked, they would have missed it.

Anyway, this bad streak is helping the Piston draft position but I think it is like a stock market correction. Finishing up last year 16-6 and continuing that same pace at the start of this year, it is not possible to keep that pace. A correction was called-for.

I still think they will finish just under the Pistons, though. It is still a long season remaining. And they have their longest west coast trip out of the way.

Surprising how much like the Pistons they are though, playing down to teams they should beat. Downright disconcerting.

Lazy, the lineup that the Magic are putting on the floor right now is not one that can beat even the lower tier NBA teams. It's like they are playing pre-season games. What they have in talent and energy, they more than make up for in inexperience and injury. I wouldn't stress about it if I were you. They are making the best of a bad situation by throwing young guys into the fire. And after all, it's the East. It's not like they are going to miss the playoffs.

Diener and JJ Redick had virtually no experience against other NBA starters until this week. And their starting guard, Arroyo, had only 1 assist last night! That is brutal. Then they stick Garrity out there with them to miss threes and play matador defense. Battie is shooting airballs from the post.

So all the pressure goes to Dwight Howard. Even if Darko became a 7'1" entry passing specialist to Dwight Howard, he would be worth $10M/year, because nobody else on the team seems to be able to do it. If you pass the ball to him 10 times, you'll get 4 assists.

MoTown, you are very fair and it's time I acknowledged it. I was feeling that you were wrong about this particular diss of DMC because I did not see it that way, but I did not want to come on and argue about it. But when Tay did, you handled it very fairly. :cheerleader: And that's not the first time.

I, myself, was more provoked with DMC last night for the way Sean May kept scoring. Darko was keeping his hands straight up, probably because he is trying to avoid fouls, and May understood and was scoring on him.

By the way, that touch pass was absolutely . . . . . And right before it, the pass to Dwight under the basket was so fast that if some blinked, they would have missed it.

Anyway, this bad streak is helping the Piston draft position but I think it is like a stock market correction. Finishing up last year 16-6 and continuing that same pace at the start of this year, it is not possible to keep that pace. A correction was called-for.

I still think they will finish just under the Pistons, though. It is still a long season remaining. And they have their longest west coast trip out of the way.

Surprising how much like the Pistons they are though, playing down to teams they should beat. Downright disconcerting.

Thanks lazy! :)

ORL and NOK both have key guys hurt and a lot of opportunities to show why the bench guys are not starters. Maybe with Sheed sitting, we can open up some floor time for our bench.

I was watching Darko's after-game interview on Raptors TV a couple hours ago and I'm losing the faith that I had on this guy. A lot of the questions that were asked were mostly about his progress as a player. He just kept telling them that he was finding his game and that that he chalked it all up to not playing for 3 years.

That's inexcusable to me. If basketball was your life, you keep up with your workout routines and drills. If you're going to be demanding big bucks from a team, you reciprocate by showing promise and good play. Darko has been showing some promise, but there's just times where he flat out gets embarassed.

When I was watching him in the Toronto game, I was expecting a more dominant performance. Instead what do I see? A lackluster effort with Toronto's #1 draft pick Andrea Barganani having a career night off of Darko's expense. I've watched every single game this season for the Raptors guys and let me tell you, this kid is far from polished. But when he was up against Darko, he looked like this year's ROY. For someone praised as the next European superstar, Darko should not be getting embarrased by this 7'0 Italian rookie.

Honestly though, I think the Magic are ruining him. I'm tired of seeing Darko attempt one of his awkward post ups - it looks unnatural and rushed. His head is always down and he's not strong enough (or shown enough passion) to finish the play. Its not his game and there's no way that they can have both him and Howard running similar types of plays. Milicic stated how: "he's still sometimes lost on offence but he's getting better."

One of the reporters stated: "We've seen you post up players, block shots, rebound and play solid defence..."; which is all true, I give Darko his due, he has been playing well. But the question: "When is the game going to all come together?" is what's the real concern. He can show flashes of greatness here and there all he wants, but until he starts showing signs that he can dominate, rather than just showing signs of playing average basketball, he may never live up to our expectations.

Another effective game for Orlando's backup center. 32 minutes, and 1 rebound short of a double double. +15 for the game.

He played the entire 2nd quarter as they held the LeBrons to 8 points. It looked like an old fashion Pistons lockdown. And yes, James was playing the whole quarter too, less 50 seconds.


An interesting player is emerging from the Magic bench as well... Travis Diener. He's a guy that you wouldn't think could possibly play in the NBA, but he just hits too many shots to be denied. He looks like "the professor" from AND1 streetball.

Diener rose to bit of prominence at Marquette when they made the Final Four in '03, with a backcourt of him and...Dwyane Wade. Maybe he can be a poor man's Steve Kerr type of player in the NBA.

And after all, it's the East. It's not like they are going to miss the playoffs.

The reality of it is is that the Central diviison is probably close to if not better than the Southwest division in the battle for the top division in the NBA. Right now only the Bucks are below .500 in the Central and by year end I expect that all the teams in the Central will be over .500.

The Western Conference's early success this year against the East has been excerbated by the excessively lopsided home and away schedule early favioring the West.

This is not to say that Phoenix, San Antonio, Utah Dallas and the Fakers are not among the top 8 teams in the league. But Houston is basically a two man team the rest of the West including the Clippers are medicore.

The top eight teams in the league right now in no particular order are

Detroit
Chicago
Cleveland
San Antnoio
Dallas
Phoenix
Lakers
Utah

:hoops:

After the last two nights' games, I think maybe Brian needs to reassess his rotations. Both Deiner and JJ need to be in there more. Even at their early states of development, teams need to respect their outside shots.

Did anyone besides my wife and I notice that when Darko came in and dove out of bounds to flick an errant pass back in bounds, initiating a fast break basket, the game changed. After a 2-16 start, the Magic turned it around completely and beat the only team ahead of the Pistons in the Central. Deiner and JJ then made the whole pace of the game much faster. And if Hill thinks that Augustine could foul things up more than Garrity does, James must be pretty bad. That is another rotation changes that needs to be made.

Notice that DMC is getting his share of post-game interviews these days. Under difficult circumstances, I didn't think the interview last night was as bad as some (one poster) did. He did say that he thought by later on this year, it would come together, after having to have the question re-asked due to the noise. I did notice that he did not have an exact date for that to happen :pound:though. And I don't know how he could make it more apparent that he wants to stay in Orlando and play with "these guys".

And Buddha, I don't know how the Magic can be left off that list. If they can beat the LeBrons after starting out 2-16, with two starters out and another one injured, another bench player injured, and the LeBrons at full strength, they have to have some serious depth, at the very least. 16-10 after a three game losing streak seems pretty good to me.

And Buddha, I don't know how the Magic can be left off that list. If they can beat the LeBrons after starting out 2-16, with two starters out and another one injured, another bench player injured, and the LeBrons at full strength, they have to have some serious depth, at the very least. 16-10 after a three game losing streak seems pretty good to me.

It was tough no doubt but it had to be done.

:hanged2:

Just out of boredom, I have decided to compare Dirk Nowizki with Darko Milicic at the age of 21. It is convenient because they both received about the same amount of playing time, and this is a guy that Darko was hyped to resemble pre-draft. It was Dirk's rookie year, and we could very well call this Darko's rookie year as well, since 4 MPG in 1/3 of games is a rounding error.

Dirk/Darko

MPG 20.4/ 22.5
Pts 8.2/ 7.5
Reb 3.4/ 5.0
Ast 1.0/ 1.1
Stl 0.6/ 0.6
Blk 0.6/ 1.70
TO 1.55/ 1.62
PF 2.20/ 2.80
FG% .405/ .450

Gms started
Dirk = 24 Darko = probably 0.

The differences in their play were that Dirk scored more, but less efficiently. Darko got more boards and blocks. They were both semi turnover prone and either fouled a lot or didn't get much respect from the zebras.

What happened when Dirk was 22? Well, they increased his playing time from 20 mins to 35 and he pretty much double all of his key stats, with only a modest increase in TO's and PF's. His shooting % increased drastically.

This is why the bust talk is a little premature. You don't even want to see Jermaine O'Neals stats at that age, which was his 3rd year in the NBA. 8.6 MPG, 2.5 pts, etc.

Excellent Comparison Ta! It is all about experience and playing time with Darko. He will be good if given the opportunity to grow.

Interesting stats. Players definitely can bloom late. Everyone isn't going to be a Wade, Lebron or Melo and bloom immediately. One big difference between Darko and Dirk though as that Dirk always had a killer instinct. This is imperative to get to the next level.

I remember Dirk's first season. The reason being was he was battling for minutes with an aussie; Chris Anstey.
Anstey's first season was the year before and he was starting to come along and be productive, but then Nowitzki came in the next year and took away all his minutes. I was rooting against Nowitzki back then. haha.
I was thinking, 'who is this guy? never heard of him. he doesn't seem that good. Anstey should be playing'.

Oh well.

It was a very interesting match-up between Darko and Will Bynum tonight. They are similar players, about the same age, and getting about the same amount of playing time, so I was curious how it would go.

After watching it, I would say that they both had very good games. They each got the better of the other at different times and they primarily guarded each other in the post.

Darko/Bynum
min 19/13
pts 13/13
reb 8/4
Ast 0/2
St 1/0
Blk 2/0
TO 1/1
PF 1/2

They each led their team in the production stat and didn't get in foul trouble, so it is sort of amazing that they didn't get more minutes. 13 players got more playing time that Milicic, yet he led the game in rebounds, free throws, and blocks.

You mean Andrew Bynum, not former Georgia Tech (and current Maccabi Tel Aviv) guard Will Bynum.

Oh yeah, thanks. Drew Bynum.

After watching almost every single Raptor game this season and enjoying the opportunity to scout #1 draft pick Andrea Bargnani - I gotta say its too bad Darko's gone. His original style that LB destroyed - fronting his man, shooting treys and driving would've fit well if it panned out something similar to the way Bargnani plays right now.

Bargnani has no post up moves, is a poor rebounder but has good defensive instincts (for someone his age and experience). Sounds kinda like Darko when Detroit first drafted him. He's the perfect example of the "what-if" that we ask if Darko got some adequate playing time to play the way HE wanted to play and was good at.

I wished that Bargnani had some of the post repertoire that Darko has, but its a better decision to teach him these things AFTER he gains confidence in what he does best. This'll probably help ease the transition later on.

Bargnani is what Darko was not. He was an elite European player, leading a club and scoring a lot of points and making a lot of plays.

It's like when people say that Delfino needs time to mature and learn and blablbla. I'll buy "adjust to the NBA game" but not mature. Some of these guys have been playing professional and international ball since they were 15.

Bargnani is the next Dirk.

We're getting almost to the halfway point and Darko has not given me any reason to believe that he will be any more than a great bench player. I just don't see it.

Bargnani is what Darko was not. He was an elite European player, leading a club and scoring a lot of points and making a lot of plays.

It's like when people say that Delfino needs time to mature and learn and blablbla. I'll buy "adjust to the NBA game" but not mature. Some of these guys have been playing professional and international ball since they were 15.

Bargnani is the next Dirk.
that's crap to not acknowledge the difference in development. darko was young and raw and we let him rot and lb tried to destroy his confidence. i think if we had just unleashed darko on the league instead of destroying his style of play and destroying his confidence we wouldn't be having this conversation.

players do need time to mature and learn. look at tracy, j o neal and plenty of other players. everybody doesn't make a huge splash as soon as they step foot into the nba. whether you are playing in the nba or international ball if you are 18 you still need time to mature. i was working 12 hours a day at 18 but i wasn't as mature as i am now.

We're getting almost to the halfway point and Darko has not given me any reason to believe that he will be any more than a great bench player. I just don't see it.
yeah. after about 70 games of nba experience we can see all that darko is going to be.

dude darko is simply being misused in orlando. he's being used in orlando more than he was in detroit but he's still being misused. he isn't being played with d. howard. he isn't the primary focus of the offense. his guards have no idea how to get thier big men shots. you probably won't see the full darko experience until he goes elsewhere in free agency or d. howard goes down with an injury. b. hill is being very cautious with how much he plays darko over battie but it already clear who is the better player and who is better for the team.

In fairness, Darko looked good against the Lake show.... he's gonna be a brut down low as he continues his development.... don't have to be a slappy to see the kid still has untapped potential.

When evaluating Darko's development, many neglect to mention that he studied under one of the best teachers in the game, Larry Brown. Played against some of the best defensive centers in the game in practice (Sheed, Campbell, B. Wallace). So he's had some time to match his game against NBA calibur competition. Other young players did not have that luxury. The Darko show is a boring show. Let's face it. I'm sick of excuses. Excuses follow this guy around. Everyone is out to ruin poor Darko's career. Still yet to see the definitive breakout game from this guy in a league where almost everyone is going off for big numbers these days. Even a "past his prime" Ben Wallace has erupted for some amazing numbers this year. There is no defense for the arguement that given similiar minutes a plethora of other players in the league have produced better numbers. Darko is the Michael Curry of bench players. If he gets a big contract next year, the GM who pulls the trigger needs to be shot. There is alot of great youth in the league these days and grabbing a player who can't push Battie away from the center position would not be on my list.

And he sucks at free throws. Just thought I'd mention that.

In fairness, Darko looked good against the Lake show.... he's gonna be a brut down low as he continues his development.... don't have to be a slappy to see the kid still has untapped potential.

Can you name a player in the NBA who can't boast that they've looked good against another team this season. Consistency is key, Merc.

After this much of the season and having watched most of their games, I do see consistency in Darko and a very definite improvement on that habit he had of wandering around and looking lost.

Game after game, he is doing something to help most all the time. Like last night, in the second half, he got a pass just inside the 3pt line and swished it. Right after that he took a pass at just about the same place and drove to the hoop and made the basket with a lefty hook. Very nice.

I had to talk to my guests a little bit and when my attention focused back on the screen, he was out of the game, never to return.

He is so clearly outplaying Battie that quite a few of the holdouts on the Magic forums are wanting him to start. The only reason to keep him on the second unit is that he give them a good lift, but like last night, his time was cut. People said it was because the Wizzers went small.

I guess the coaches do not feel that the Magic players can control the tempo so they surrender to the opponents and play small ball.

Darko does not challenge quite so many shots now. I believe he is keepiong his PFs under control that way. Still gets a block or two most games.

Because of the early success, people did not want to disturb thngs by starting Darko but now, clearly, something needs to be done. Remember, if they fall too low, the Pistons won't get the Magic's draft pick.:stirthepot:

The idea they werre espousing when DMC first got there was that high-low post combo with D-12. It would be good if they actually did some of that because Dwight's play has been hampered for quite a few games now by the defenders collapsing on him and tieing him up.

They could not even beat the Wizzers last night with Hedo throwing in 5 threes. So, trying to compete with them playing small ball didn't work either.

Yesterday was a rough day. Both my teams lost by one point.:ohwell: :frusty: :hanged2:

Can you name a player in the NBA who can't boast that they've looked good against another team this season. Consistency is key, Merc.
I'll give you that... DMC has hardly been consistent... similar to most young players with little game experience (can't believe i'm defending him)... Bynum is a young beast ... DMC made things tough on him
My guess is DMC will pan out to be somewhere between the DHOFer's opinions and Motown's.. a servicable big that can defend and get you some post points....yet falls asleep at the wheel sometimes... not that we could use that or anything.

My guess is DMC will pan out to be somewhere between the DHOFer's opinions and Motown's.. a servicable big that can defend and get you some post points....yet falls asleep at the wheel sometimes... not that we could use that or anything.

That's far from what I've been expecting. The last thing Darko should turn into with the amount of attention (along with pressure) is another Rasho Nesterovic.

One of the largest reasons why he's lost is because he's expecting something to happen: a play in the post, a pick and roll - something revolving around him. But he's not a focal point in the offence, that's the thing - he's got at least 2-3 other people ahead of him who deserve touches.

When he's posting up (from the games I've seen from him this year), his teammates are camping out on the perimeter for the kick out, or boxing out on the weak side for the rebound if he misses. In the end he ends up bumbling the ball cause he can't see the double team in time and he turns it over. Not a good way of developing his offensive awareness.

Ideally: the perfect play I could think that Orlando could do is a high-low like lazyberbs said earlier. Feed the post to Dwight, demand the double team, set a screen for Darko to come off and feed him while he's cutting down so he can throw it down or get fouled in the act.

Even a "past his prime" Ben Wallace has erupted for some amazing numbers this year.

he also threw up a double donut. i thought consistency was key.

If he gets a big contract next year, the GM who pulls the trigger needs to be shot.

the gm that traded him away for peanuts needs to be shot.


And he sucks at free throws. Just thought I'd mention that.
so does your boy. at least darko hits the rim when he shoots his. at least teams don't use fouling him as thier whole strategy to stop the other team. at least when darko gets fouled it's to stop a shot instead of a cheap way to get a free turnover.

darko doesn't shoot enough times to get his free throw percentage up. if you only shoot 1 or 2 per game it's hard to get the percentage up. if he was shooting 6 or 8 a game he would shoot 75%.

he also threw up a double donut. i thought consistency was key.

Actually he's had alot of good games this year. He's the anti-Darko as Ben has had some off nights but mostly good statistical showings. Darko has had some decent nights but mostly mediocre showings.


the gm that traded him away for peanuts needs to be shot.


Well, I wouldn't shoot Joe Dumars, but I agree with your point. Still doesn't take away from mine though. Thanks.


so does your boy.

Never said Ben was good. It was you who pointed out how good of a free throw shooter Darko was. That's why I mentioned it. lol. You've just forgotten again because it doesn't support your Darko is the chosen one arguement.

darko doesn't shoot enough times to get his free throw percentage up. if you only shoot 1 or 2 per game it's hard to get the percentage up. if he was shooting 6 or 8 a game he would shoot 75%.

So Darko doesn't draw fouls, isn't that his problem? ..and if you don't get many free throw attempts, you would think it would be easier to bump up your pct. just by making a series of free throws. Come on, bball jay, you have no proof of what Darko could do with those attempts so that just sounds like another round of man-love to me.

Whoa... this is supposed to be an impartial take on the young Serb... there doesn't have to be a right & left wing... to answer Rdang... Rasho is a complete stiff on defense... that ain't Darko... the offensive output is similar with room for improvement.
Yes he still fumbles inlet passes and throws the ball away... at the same time he pushes his man back for easy looks... he is not a wimp... just a confused young kid trying to find his niche amongst proven (and selfish) players.
He is not some athletic freak that some would have you believe... and he still plays stiff (typical of Euros)... but he is mobile and fairly agressive til he runs out of gas (which doesn't take long)...
this is not a pro or con opinion... somewhere in between.

Rasho is a complete stiff on defense... that ain't Darko...Really? Nesterovic is a well above-average low post defender and a very smart team defender. I'd agree with anything you say about his softness, but, like Dale Davis, he's rarely out of place. Darko still tries to block everything except his man from interior positioning.

Today I would rather have Rasho on my team than Darko. And considering Rasho's plodding unathleticism, allergy to rebounding, disgustingly weak offensive game, and complete lack of competitive drive, that says more about Darko than it does about Rasho.

Let's not forget Rasho's more consistent baseline jumpshot. Its the only shot he takes where I don't scream and throw things at the t.v. screen.

Actually he's had alot of good games this year. He's the anti-Darko as Ben has had some off nights but mostly good statistical showings. Darko has had some decent nights but mostly mediocre showings.

he's also had more oppurtunity than darko. when darko plays well it doesn't get him more oppurtunity. he is however even in his inconsistency outplaying the starter. so when your bench players off night in 16 minutes is better than the starter he should be getting more oppurtunity.



Well, I wouldn't shoot Joe Dumars, but I agree with your point. Still doesn't take away from mine though. Thanks.

i wouldn't shoot the gm that throws millions at darko. he's a smart gm.


Never said Ben was good. It was you who pointed out how good of a free throw shooter Darko was. That's why I mentioned it. lol. You've just forgotten again because it doesn't support your Darko is the chosen one arguement.

darko is a good free throw shooter. 3 seconds left in the game down by 1 who do you send to the free throw line darko or ben?? just like a few years ago when dice was missing lots of free throws because he wasn't getting a lot of attempts. his free throw shooting improved as his attempts went up because he is a good free throw shooter. bens percentage didn't go up when he got more attempts.


So Darko doesn't draw fouls, isn't that his problem? ..and if you don't get many free throw attempts, you would think it would be easier to bump up your pct. just by making a series of free throws. Come on, bball jay, you have no proof of what Darko could do with those attempts so that just sounds like another round of man-love to me.

darko doesn't get enough shot attempts to draw fouls. he only shoots like 6 times a game. and 2 of those are probably off offensive boards.

Really? Nesterovic is a well above-average low post defender and a very smart team defender. I'd agree with anything you say about his softness, but, like Dale Davis, he's rarely out of place. Darko still tries to block everything except his man from interior positioning.

Today I would rather have Rasho on my team than Darko. And considering Rasho's plodding unathleticism, allergy to rebounding, disgustingly weak offensive game, and complete lack of competitive drive, that says more about Darko than it does about Rasho.

actually it says more about your inability to judge talent than it says about darko.

is that why darko absolutely own rasho in head to head meetings??

actually it says more about your inability to judge talent than it says about darko.

is that why darko absolutely own rasho in head to head meetings??
I don't get why you have to dumb down posts to defend Darko. ahb actually agreed with much of what you wrote, and then you take a cheap shot at his knowledge.

I agree completely with ahb's post about Rasho. I don't watch Darko every single game. He's about as interesting to me as Chris Wilcox or John Salmons. All I care about is the Magic continuing to tank their season so we get a great pick.

Bballjay, everytime I asked you to produce Mr. Snufalu%%%us, he never shows up Big Bird. You live in the land of imaginary potential and excuses. The only thing that is obvious is that if Darko averaged 8 pts, 5 brds, 1 assist and 2 blocks for his entire career..you'd argue that he was never given a chance. You were gushing about Orlando before they stopped playing Darko too. My suspicion is that if you replaced any other player with Darko's current performance you would be far less enthusiastic.

So to put this in plain English for you...

You can't convince me that Darko is a good free throw shooter when he shoots a horrible free throw percentage.

You can't convince me that Darko is a good rebounder when he hasn't put together one dominanting rebounding performance.

You can't convince me that Darko is a great scorer when he has yet to have a dominate scoring performance.

You can't convince me that Darko is a great playmaker when he has yet to have a dominate assist game.

The only thing you can prove to me is that he is a great shotblocker and that he plays pretty good man to man defense.

This makes him a situational player in my opinion. That's all he's proven...everything else is speculation and wishful thinking.

I don't get why you have to dumb down posts to defend Darko. ahb actually agreed with much of what you wrote, and then you take a cheap shot at his knowledge.

i disagree. he didn't agree with much of what i said. he said he would rather take rasho who he himself said was plodding, allergic to rebounding, weak offensive game, no competitive drive over darko. i think that's a shot at darko. i stand by my statement that it shows his inability to judge talent if he would choose that over darko.


I agree completely with ahb's post about Rasho. I don't watch Darko every single game. He's about as interesting to me as Chris Wilcox or John Salmons. All I care about is the Magic continuing to tank their season so we get a great pick.

if you watched darko more you wouldn't be agreeing about taking rasho over darko. if you are interested in magic continuing to tank the season you should be happy that darko is being misused. i'm more upset at the pistons continued misuse and waste of young talent. darko is the ultimate example of that. that is why he will always be relevant to me.

Bballjay, everytime I asked you to produce Mr. Snufalu%%%us, he never shows up Big Bird. You live in the land of imaginary potential and excuses. The only thing that is obvious is that if Darko averaged 8 pts, 5 brds, 1 assist and 2 blocks for his entire career..you'd argue that he was never given a chance. You were gushing about Orlando before they stopped playing Darko too. My suspicion is that if you replaced any other player with Darko's current performance you would be far less enthusiastic.

i disagree. delfino's stats aren't that good either but that doesn't mean i don't support him. i've always said fino was a good player. i judge talent i don't judge stats. i know that when given a chance darko is going to be a great player. you're the type to wait until they are a great player then post about it. i can see it before it happens.


So to put this in plain English for you...

You can't convince me that Darko is a good free throw shooter when he shoots a horrible free throw percentage.

he only shoots 2 free throws a game. just wait until he gets enough shots.


You can't convince me that Darko is a good rebounder when he hasn't put together one dominanting rebounding performance.

it isn't his role on the team. dwight is the dominant rebounder on that team. darko's job is to contest every shot.


You can't convince me that Darko is a great scorer when he has yet to have a dominate scoring performance.

it isn't his role on the team. his team's style of play isn't suited toward this. if he was in phoenix it would be a different story.


You can't convince me that Darko is a great playmaker when he has yet to have a dominate assist game.

it isn't his role on the team. he has had a 5 assist game as a c/ pf.


The only thing you can prove to me is that he is a great shotblocker and that he plays pretty good man to man defense.

agreed. he's been given the chance to do this.


This makes him a situational player in my opinion. That's all he's proven...everything else is speculation and wishful thinking.


this boils down to a difference in thought process. you can only see what a player is doing now. so therefore you should not even be posting in a thread about seeing potential.

i disagree. delfino's stats aren't that good either but that doesn't mean i don't support him. i've always said fino was a good player. i judge talent i don't judge stats. i know that when given a chance darko is going to be a great player. you're the type to wait until they are a great player then post about it. i can see it before it happens.

You are unrealistic about him as well.

I'm a Delfino fan, but I can admit when he isn't performing well. You haven't mastered that skill.

I'll just disregard your excuse section.


this boils down to a difference in thought process. you can only see what a player is doing now. so therefore you should not even be posting in a thread about seeing potential.

I disagree completely.

First, this is a thread designed to discuss his performance not his potential. Reread please.

Second, I do love to see/evaluate the potential in players. ..and I like my track record as far as spotting talent. Unlike you though, I judge potential by results. Maxiel and Delfino are not proven stars by any stretch of the imagination. However, they've shown that given time they can produce numbers. Am I so far off by calling someone a good rebounder because they've actually snatched rebounds? Calling someone a good scorer because they've actually scored points? My only criteria is that I'm shown something. I've had NBA League pass now for the past 4 years. I watch young talent on a daily basis. Last year I was a big fan of David Lee out of New York. Kevin Perkins out of Boston. Marcus Banks, currently riding the pine in Phoenix. These are players that when given the opportunity with a limited amount of minutes exploded. You can't name a player that I haven't scouted the past 4 years in the NBA.

This is why I judge Darko so harshly. I'm not comparing him to Battie. I am comparing him to a league with new emerging talent that enters the league annually. Players who like Darko, enter the league with alot of hype and sometimes not. They fight for time and respect. As a result they try to out work everyone on the court. Your boy does not stand up favorably to them as it pertains to results. So...he still gets no love from me.

I'm a Delfino fan, but I can admit when he isn't performing well. You haven't mastered that skill.

have you watched the last 3 games?? delfino is becoming the man right before our eyes.


I disagree completely.

First, this is a thread designed to discuss his performance not his potential. Reread please.

this thread was started to predict his performance based on his potential. reread please

I've had NBA League pass now for the past 4 years. I watch young talent on a daily basis. Last year I was a big fan of David Lee out of New York. Kevin Perkins out of Boston. Marcus Banks, currently riding the pine in Phoenix. These are players that when given the opportunity with a limited amount of minutes exploded. You can't name a player that I haven't scouted the past 4 years in the NBA.

yeah that kevin perkins guy is good.


This is why I judge Darko so harshly. I'm not comparing him to Battie. I a