ESPN reporting (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/recap?gameId=261216018) 10 players were ejected.

That's awesome. Doesn't look like any of my fantasy players were involved. lol

Seriously though, Zeke and Mark Aguirre might have to suit up for the next game.

And Carmello is a punk for sucker punching that guy. 2nd game that got testy tonight. Pistons beat the living day lights out of the Nets.

That's awesome. Doesn't look like any of my fantasy players were involved. lol

Seriously though, Zeke and Mark Aguirre might have to suit up for the next game.

And Carmello is a punk for sucker punching that guy. 2nd game that got testy tonight. Pistons beat the living day lights out of the Nets.

Carmelo is a Lil "B". If you are man enough to punch someone then be man enough to fight him. Don't run clean to the other end of the court and hide behind your bench and security.

Just saw a few of these highlights...yikes. Apparently Karl was rubbing it in, with the Nuggets up 19 in the last two minutes, but Camby and Carmelo were still out there. Mardy Collins of the Knicks (I'd never heard of him, rookie guard from Temple) committed a thugtastic foul on J.R. Smith, and then it was on. Carmelo threw a crazy punch at Collins and nailed him in the face.

And I was just talking about how great Melo was the other day. I have lost all respect for him, and so has many of his peers.

It doesn`t matter what I think, but he better watch his back against his opponents. You just don`t sucker punch someone and run.

He just can`t get it right can he??

Just saw a few of these highlights...yikes. Apparently Karl was rubbing it in, with the Nuggets up 19 in the last two minutes, but Camby and Carmelo were still out there. Mardy Collins of the Knicks (I'd never heard of him, rookie guard from Temple) committed a thugtastic foul on J.R. Smith, and then it was on. Carmelo threw a crazy punch at Collins and nailed him in the face.

I was just thinking about this a little more and realized that Karl and Zeke don't like each other. Back last season Karl made some comments about the New York Knicks and Zeke concerning Lary Brown getting fired. Zeke responded to Karl by basically telling him to mind his own business and keep his name and the Knicks out of his mouth.

So this has been brewing for a while.

I saw the high----------uh, lowlights and absolutely agree about notsoMello. He better be glad he's not a hockey player.

Nuggets now will be on a 5 game losing streak.:yellowprison:

I think Mello gets at least 10 games Robinson gets 10 while Collins, Jefferies and Smith get 5 games out. The NBA made an example out of Ronnie they should do the same here.:yellowprison:

Just when it looked like Melo was about to be let into Stern's 'Golden child Club', he gets turned away for being under-age.

He is looking at 10 games easily, I wonder if he will now be snubbed for an all-star berth?

He just can't completely shrug his thug bevahiour that left him in the dust of lebron and wade in his first year. And now that he is almost back being mentioned in the same breath of those two he does this.

What an idiot. I mean, who needs help defending themselves from Nate Robinson? Really.

That Mardy Collins looks like a punk though, he just stared down JR Smith after that terrible foul. What is he trying to prove?

Melo, ooops, or should I start calling him 'COWARD', should not be in the All Star game after this, doesn't matter if Stern only suspend him 5 or 10 games. Instead of being a role model, he has become a THUG.

A thug in an All Star game???

I only saw one angle of this play and it looked to me like Collins was trying to bring Smith down, which he did, by forearming Collins at both shoulders. This was certainly not near as bad as what Malone did to Zeke in Utah that one night or what the Celtics used to do to everyone all the time.

On a Bab Boy Bill scale this would be about a 4 - 5 at best. In my opinion Smith deserved to be taken down on this play. It was clear that here he was on a breakaway up by 20 points on the road with less than 2 minutes to go and he was going to slam it in the Knicks face on their home court.

Karl should be suspended for 10 games for leaving his starters in.

Anthony for 10 + for the punch.

It remains unclear to me how Zeke could have ordered that take down foul on the breakaway play before hand. He had no way of knowing that Smith was going to get a breakaway, much less be a jerk and try and show up the Knicks in front of their home fans by slaming it like he was in the slam dunk contest, which everone is sure he would have done if he hadn't been fouled by Collins. And certainly Zeke didn't yell out for Collins to take him down during the play as everyone would have heard that.

This is just going to be another case of Zeke getting raked over the coals, unfairly, by the main stream press, which will hate him even after he is dead.

Sorry but that is how I feel about it. When you try and show up a team in front of their home fans and wipe their faces in the dirt of a humuliating home court defeat you deserve whatever the losers can give out by attempting to save some face. This is especially true in New York where everyone knows that the fans have been merciless in their booing and berating of the Knicks play this year.

Zeke was wrong the day he walked off the court without shaking Michael's hand. He was not wrong yesterday, even if he did order that foul, which I doubt.

:stirthepot:

I was just thinking about this a little more and realized that Karl and Zeke don't like each other. Back last season Karl made some comments about the New York Knicks and Zeke concerning Lary Brown getting fired. Zeke responded to Karl by basically telling him to mind his own business and keep his name and the Knicks out of his mouth.

So this has been brewing for a while.

Brown and Karl are both North Carolina alumni.

Nice picture in the NY Post.

It looks more like

1. WWF with a Collins about to apply the takedown
2. Two drunks leaving the court with one trying to hold up the other.
3. A poor imitation of roller derby action

Some other things which I won't post. LOL

New York Post Online Edition: (http://www.nypost.com/)

:hoops:

Another great post buddhafan.

Man, those NY rags really like to play it up.
"FURY & FISTS IN GARDEN OF UGLY"

From Yahoo Sports

For the Knicks, it's a sorry testament of Thomas' regime when the team's enforcer is 5-foot-6 Nate Robinson. As it turned out, the Garden hadn't seen this kind of midget mayhem since Vince McMahon had Sky Low-Low working the WWF undercard.

Counterpunch to Commish - NBA - Yahoo! Sports (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=Ap4dkD77vJcwPc.s0wM9iWKG0bYF?slug=aw-brawl121706&prov=yhoo&type=lgns)

:laugh: Actually Nate seemed to be playing the role of Stephen Jackson from the Palace brawl. It got crazy at first, but then he jacked things up by flying in and swinging wildly all over the place.

Now the truth comes out.

CA was just upholding an old Syracuse University Alumni tradition

Syracuse University Archives: Time Out Sports Exhibit - Boxing (http://archives.syr.edu/arch/exhibits/timeoutboxing.htm)

Got to live these guys that don't forget about their Alma Mater's, even when they don't graduate. LOL

:nerd2:

Heres a youtube link to it: YouTube - Knicks and Nuggets Brawl (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WbiPP4T6Jp8)

I think the media blows this type of stuff way out of proportion. Stain on the league?? Come on. In the late 80's early 90's there used to be 3 or 4 fights a year. That's how heated rivalries were built. The only thing that was bad was that these guy's ended up in the crowd again. The league will hand out there suspensions and righty so but these are grown men playing a emotional physical sport. No matter how steep the fines or suspensions you are going to have an altercation from time to time.

Perhaps the league should move the fans further back from the action. Fans can get hurt from a guy falling into the crowd to save a loss ball just as much from a flying fist.

A fight among the players is one thing, but players attacking the fans was much worse. And it sounds like the hard foul was Zeke's idea. I feel most of the blame belongs to the Knicks. The good news is maybe the Palace incident will stop getting so much media coverage. No one was seriously hurt so this is not the end of the world. Maybe the NBA should offer training in good sportsmanship. I don't feel that more than a five game suspension is warranted. And if Zeke instigated the flagrant foul, then he should be suspended too.

I agree with Winless. No matter how much they try and control the games these things are going to happen. And they used to happen a lot more.

I can imagine all the junk calls by the refs now. What new Stern rules will we have to endure? Hire a couple of bodyguards to help the refs break up fights before they escalate if they are that concerned about it.

Good posts Buddha. Rally 'round the family.
I think Stern gives Karl a good taking to.
Nates foul was clean. Were as Ron Rons was stupid---they were winning.

Nate didn't foul anyone; that Mardy Collins guy put a thug headlock on J.R. Smith for the initial foul. After some pushing and shoving, Nate flew in and started swinging.

A fight among the players is one thing, but players attacking the fans was much worse. And it sounds like the hard foul was Zeke's idea. I feel most of the blame belongs to the Knicks. The good news is maybe the Palace incident will stop getting so much media coverage. No one was seriously hurt so this is not the end of the world. Maybe the NBA should offer training in good sportsmanship. I don't feel that more than a five game suspension is warranted. And if Zeke instigated the flagrant foul, then he should be suspended too.

Why should Zeke be suspended? This is no different than a coach calling for the intentional foul when a team is behind. I highly doubt Zeke called for the foul during the game but this is a Zeke team and he has preached time and time again you don't get disrespected in your house.

I think you have to look at Karl's motive. You are up 20 pts had been up by as many as 30. Why is Melo, Camby, JR Smith, Miller and Najera on the floor? All 5 of those guy's are starters.

You also have to remember Zeke is from a different generation of player. Those players back in the day took the game and winning seriously.
Most guy's these days don't care if they win or lose as long as they get there check and can go to the club get their drink on and get some girls after the game. This is a generation of player where Sheed and Jermaine O'Neal watch boxing together and have dinner the night before a playoff game. In Zeke's generation you shook your friends hand and did not speak to him again until the series was over. He was the enemy.

In Zeke's generation you shook your friends hand and did not speak to him again until the series was over. He was the enemy.

Not always...Isiah and Magic had the famous on-court kiss thing, but I read that they would also drop each other off after the games (i.e. whoever was playing at home would drive the other one to his hotel).

Ordering that hard foul when you have already lost the game is stupid and wrong. The Knicks will get respect when they learn to play better, not because they commit a stupid flagrant fouls for some kind of weird sense of honor? Is this a sport or the Mafia? Poor sportsmanship has no place in professional sports. The Knicks get no respect from me for their macho, pointless, immature display of brute force. Zeke needs to be less concerned about who the opposition has on the floor, and more concerned about teaching his own team to play better. What if JR Smith had been seriously injured? If Zeke ordered that hit, he should be suspended along with his players. Or maybe Zeke should be a hockey coach???

My bad D4E, too many names for me to follow.

Interesting how the media has managed to successfully pull all the attention off of Anthony's sucker punch. Of course this in keeping with Stern's policy of protecting the stars, just like Kobe's victim was ostrocized by the press to pull the attention off of his dastardly act. After all he was and is married.

Like I posted before that foul was maybe or 4 or 5 on the Bad Boy Bill scale and probably only a 2 or 3 on the Ricky M. scale of hard fouls.

Regardless of what the foul was on Smith, Anthony was totally in the wrong throwing the sucker punch and then running away like a girl. If you are going to sucker punch someone at least be man enough to hang around and see if your victim is going to get up and then go from there.

Anthony, just another one of Stern's very wealthy spoiled brats

:gun1:

EasyB, it's unwritten code, you show me up at my house and anything goes.
Karl broke the unwritten rule. Baseball has them too.
But yeah, the league has done it's part to curtail this kind of uglyness.

Buddha it's possible Melo was just looking for punching room. I would've.

Ordering that hard foul when you have already lost the game is stupid and wrong. The Knicks will get respect when they learn to play better, not because they commit a stupid flagrant fouls for some kind of weird sense of honor? Is this a sport or the Mafia? Poor sportsmanship has no place in professional sports. The Knicks get no respect from me for their macho, pointless, immature display of brute force. Zeke needs to be less concerned about who the opposition has on the floor, and more concerned about teaching his own team to play better. What if JR Smith had been seriously injured? If Zeke ordered that hit, he should be suspended along with his players. Or maybe Zeke should be a hockey coach???


I don't know how long you have watched basketball but the hard foul has been around a long time way before Zeke's playing days. So are you saying the Jordan Rules were wrong? It is just a written rule that you don't give up easy uncontested dunks you make a guy earn it at the line. You also don't show a team up in their house. If you drive through the lane you are going to pay a price. That is just the way it is.

By your logic you are saying that the Jordan Rules are wrong and that we should just let Wade drive to the basket untouched and score at will. Giving that hard foul makes a guy think twice before driving to the basket among the trees and also makes a guy think twice about trying to show up another team.

The "protect our house" thing is pretty weak in the first place, but especially in this instance. How about not getting your a$%es kicked at home in the first place, Knicks? Then maybe you'll have a leg to stand on.

Buddha it's possible Melo was just looking for punching room. I would've.

fair enough

But don't ever confuse Melo with Kermit "One Punch and Ur Out" Washington!!!

Kermit Washington - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kermit_Washington)

:yellowprison:

It is 2006 not 1989, and the Jordan rules were helpful in their day. They were meant to keep MJ from scoring by a team that went on to win back to back ships. The NBA rules have changed and the Knicks are hardly a contender for anything right now.(last year they were a contender for the circus team of the NBA) I know Melo is not a good fighter, but this is basketball not boxing. Perhaps coaches could send their players to the Kronk gym, so they could learn how to punch, like Kocer and Probert.

I don't see how Isiah can be found at fault. How would you determine that? Collins won't say that he was told to by Isiah. Also it was an ugly tackle warranting a flagrant 2 but its better than letting him get in the air and pounding him...thats when people get hurt.

The League will determine that Isiah did not order a hit and this whole investigation is just smoke and mirrors to do some damage control.

Isiah did actually order a hit. His players misinterpreted and thought that he just wanted them to just give a hard foul. That will be his defense.

Kermit has been trying to live that down for 20 years, he's mostly innocent.

I don't see how Isiah can be found at fault. How would you determine that? Collins won't say that he was told to by Isiah. Also it was an ugly tackle warranting a flagrant 2 but its better than letting him get in the air and pounding him...thats when people get hurt.

The League will determine that Isiah did not order a hit and this whole investigation is just smoke and mirrors to do some damage control.

Guess it depends on whether he really told Nuggets players to stay away from the basket. And whether anyone comes clean. And of course whether he really did it or not. Coaches shouldn't be talking to opposing players.

My POV is that Isiah was a thug when he played and still seems to be one. Maybe a little more time spent putting a team on the floor that doesn't get blown out rather than worrying about the opposition playing the whole game might be the better course of action.

Wren't they missing 2 starters due to injury? Or prison?

who would come clean? The guy barely hanging onto the league? Is the NBA going to put him in a stoolie protection program?

I think they move the stoolies to a team on the west coast. Maybe Portland.

My POV is that Isiah was a thug when he played and still seems to be one.
He's certainly a man with a lot of failings, but for myself, and probably a lot of people in the Pistons nation, he is a hero.

He's made mistakes, but none as egregious as Jordan's. It's all a matter of who is telling the story, and of course, the victors write history.

It's definitely an agree to disagree thing.

Since when was Zeke the thug? Just because he was the ring leader of the most villified championship team in NBA history doesn't make him a thug.
If Pistons were thugs, it's because that's what's the league demanded to be champion. It was a right of passage going from being playoff losers to champions. All softness had to be removed. Fear and intimidation had to be conquered. Result...you become the intimidator.

Melo got 15 games

Where did you find that?

Anthony suspended 15 games, no suspension for Thomas - Wire Services - NBA - MSNBC.com (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16268432/)

All I had to do was turn on Jim Rome.
The coaches weren't penalized.
But the teams were fined $0.5Mil. WOW!

Robinson went after JR Smith, who was the one who was fouled. They should not have gotten the same number of suspensions. Robinson should have gotten 15, at least as many as Carmelo. It ended up that the players on the team that started everything, Collins and Robinson, were penalized less than the Nuggets. The suspensions should have been more equal. Unfortunately, the Knicks won't be affected nearly as much as Denver, and they are more at fault. It was just a flagrant foul till Nate jumped Smith. Nate should have gotten at least as much punishment as Melo.

Nate escalated it and should have gotten more than JR.

I have been annoyed since last year when Skiles was trash talking Rip during a game.. Stern needs the shut the F up rule for opposing coaches who needle the other players during the game. Trash talking coaches are nothing but trouble.

I have been annoyed since last year when Skiles was trash talking Rip during a game.. Stern needs the shut the F up rule for opposing coaches who needle the other players during the game. Trash talking coaches are nothing but trouble.

Definitely a good rule if it isn't on the books already. And if it is, then it needs some teeth.

I have been annoyed since last year when Skiles was trash talking Rip during a game.. Stern needs the shut the F up rule for opposing coaches who needle the other players during the game. Trash talking coaches are nothing but trouble.

I agree with this, definitely. Karl shouldn't be using his players to settle his pissing match with Zeke. The NC-brotherhood thing, to me, is a little bit much. Brown probably already called Karl and sent him an extra Xmas gift. Go Blue!

Thoughts on the NBA Fines handed out today - Blog Maverick (http://www.blogmaverick.com/2006/12/18/thoughts-on-the-nba-fines-handed-out-today/)

Thoughts on the NBA Fines handed out today - Blog Maverick (http://www.blogmaverick.com/2006/12/18/thoughts-on-the-nba-fines-handed-out-today/)

AKA hitting the nail on the head.

He's certainly a man with a lot of failings, but for myself, and probably a lot of people in the Pistons nation, he is a hero.

He's made mistakes, but none as egregious as Jordan's. It's all a matter of who is telling the story, and of course, the victors write history.

Seems mighty funny no one wanted to talk about Jordan's heavy gambling problem. I find it hard to believe he was not beting on games.

Seem's like Zeke wears out his welcome where ever he goes but he still is a Piston.

I don't think MJ was betting on games.

I think the gambling was a by-product of his competitive nature, not a way to make money.

Most of these guys gamble to look like a big shot at the casino or in MJ's case, to assert his dominance over another man. That's why he is so into the golf gambling.

I don't think MJ was betting on games.

I think the gambling was a by-product of his competitive nature, not a way to make money.

Most of these guys gamble to look like a big shot at the casino or in MJ's case, to assert his dominance over another man. That's why he is so into the golf gambling.

I don't know about that. If MJ can blow 20K on a couple of games of Horse with RIP and then demand they keep playing until he wins his money back then the guy can be persuaded to bet on a game of two.

Robinson went after JR Smith, who was the one who was fouled. They should not have gotten the same number of suspensions. Robinson should have gotten 15, at least as many as Carmelo. It ended up that the players on the team that started everything, Collins and Robinson, were penalized less than the Nuggets. The suspensions should have been more equal. Unfortunately, the Knicks won't be affected nearly as much as Denver, and they are more at fault. It was just a flagrant foul till Nate jumped Smith. Nate should have gotten at least as much punishment as Melo.The way I saw it, Robinson was running his mouth, but Smith decided his best bet was tackling a 5'6" guy into the crowd.

Did J.R. Smith flop on that foul? It looks like he took a dive.

Who was it again that threw the punch?

I didn't know that Zeke played for the Nuggets!

Did Karl trade for him.

Hard foul. Heck I have seen Swish Cash give out harder fouls than that and not even get called on it.

:hoops::stirthepot:

...like Zeke wears out his welcome where ever he goes but he still is a Piston.

Not so much, it's just that when people expend extra energy just to hate you. Those people eventually get their way.

I think this entire thing is pretty silly. I listened to a report about the "violent NBA" on NPR this evening. There is a tremendous amount of handwringing and conspiracy theories about a 2 minute fight between a few athletes.

I think the Zeke thing is totally ridiculous. I read an article today talking about his rough South Side of Chicago upbringing, and his Mafia tendencies. Please. This is a bunch of goofy melodrama to sell papers and keep people tuned in to ESPN. Even if Isaiah told Robinson: "go down there and stab Carmello in the heart", Robinson is a grown man in an adult world. Ridiculous.

The only thing about this whole fiasco that is the least bit interesting is that, despite his recent "maturity" Carmello is obviously still a pretty immature and insecure kid. The way he suckerpunched that guy and ran off spoke volumes. He's a kid that plays basketball, not a hardcore street thug, despite the (childish) image he may wish to project.

The way I saw it, Robinson was running his mouth, but Smith decided his best bet was tackling a 5'6" guy into the crowd.

Actually, Nate had the take down in that little skirmish!

I have been annoyed since last year when Skiles was trash talking Rip during a game.. Stern needs the shut the F up rule for opposing coaches who needle the other players during the game. Trash talking coaches are nothing but trouble.

EasyB, I thought all of this was deja vu. We played Knicks twice in Nov. Pop, Zeke and Bowen got techs.

Well, Pop, Zeke and Bowen got in to it .Aware that New York guard Steve Francis sprained his left ankle after landing on Bowen's foot in the team's first meeting, Thomas became incensed when he thought Bowen stepped under Jamal Crawford while contesting a shot early in Saturday's game.

"Next time he does that," Thomas told his players, "break his (expletive) foot!"
Thomas started jawing at Bowen, who said he also heard the Knicks coach threaten to "break his neck." The referees gave them each a technical.
That brought Popovich off the bench. He shouted at the officials to tell Thomas to "stop talking to my players!" Popovich then told Thomas himself, yelling at him after marching to midcourt.
Thomas initially waved off Popovich before shouting back. Both coaches were restrained by their assistants as the officials tried to calm them

But, no sucker punches. Also in game on 11/6 Spurs were ahead 20 pts most of game. Then suddenly in 4th, Knicks exploded and in the final 3 minutes we were only 1 pt ahead. So, knowing Knicks history of kicking up the game a notch in final minutes was reasonable(?) to put starters in. Maybe not.:hoops:

The last time I checked and found that brawls were part of sport games which occurred every now and then everywher on this planet to have fans stay high, keep sport writers in busy and get all concerned parties excited. As long as every thing goes on their way inside the court, I'm Ok and got fun.

Great point brofmfa. It's our ESPN fast food media culture that makes each of these fairly regular events out to be much more than they really are.

Well, Pop, Zeke and Bowen got in to it .Aware that New York guard Steve Francis sprained his left ankle after landing on Bowen's foot in the team's first meeting, Thomas became incensed when he thought Bowen stepped under Jamal Crawford while contesting a shot early in Saturday's game.

It wouldn't be the first time that someone had done that, plant there foot under someone, especially Bowen.

:gun1:

Bowen's penchant for dirty play and causing sprained ankles.

It entilted "Bowen's Foot" and is half way down the page

HOOPSANALYST (http://www.hoopsanalyst.com/0607qt3.htm)

:gun1:

. . . It's our ESPN fast food media culture that makes each of these fairly regular events out to be much more than they really are.
Actually, media played one of the roles because they were also part of the scenario and . . . so somewhat do us.

The only thing about this whole fiasco that is the least bit interesting is that, despite his recent "maturity" Carmello is obviously still a pretty immature and insecure kid. The way he suckerpunched that guy and ran off spoke volumes. He's a kid that plays basketball, not a hardcore street thug, despite the (childish) image he may wish to project.

This pretty much sums up my feelings. He has hurt himself tremendously and you can blow this year off for him. Time will help him out (unlike a Zach Randolph), and his best bet, when he comes back, is to keep his mouth shut, kick-up the community PR efforts, and win the scoring title. He is going to take a lot of abuse the rest of the year and if he handles this the right way, it should make him grow up fast and become a better ballplayer.

The last time I checked and found that brawls were part of sport games which occurred every now and then everywher on this planet to have fans stay high, keep sport writers in busy and get all concerned parties excited. As long as every thing goes on their way inside the court, I'm Ok and got fun.

I can't understand this whole thing. All I can say about it is think for yourself and not what the media tells you to think.

When I started watching bball these things happened a few times a year and no one thought anything of it. Suspensions ranged from 1-3 games, a small fine, maybe a public apology and that was about it.

Thing that is different here is that Melo looked like a Wuss so perhaps they are trying to deflect attention as someone else wrote in this thread. I don't have a problem with Melo not knowing how to fight, why start one and then run away?

Yea, it techincally carried over into the 1st row. No big deal, those seats are too close to the court and its not like any fan was targetted. If you sit that close then be prepared to get out of the way.

Now que the drama.

The league should fine & suspend Karl for running his big mouth about Zeke. I think his accusations are unfounded and he has no proof.

I can't understand this whole thing. All I can say about it is think for yourself and not what the media tells you to think.


You're 120% right Max, that's the way we gotta carry ourself. Cool.

McCosky's comments:

I must say for once I actually totally agree with something he wrote.

Oh, please! 'Brawl' was a lame spat - 12/19/06 - The Detroit News Online (http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20061219/SPORTS08/612190336/1127/SPORTS0102)

:hoops:

True Hoop: A Blow Out, a Blow Up, and Blowing the Whole Thing Out of Proportion (http://www.truehoop.com/leaguewide-issues-66864-a-blow-out-a-blow-up-and-blowing-the-whole-thing-out-of-proportion.html)

Losing his Carolina Way - NBA - Yahoo! Sports (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-karl121806&prov=yhoo&type=lgns)

True Hoop: A Blow Out, a Blow Up, and Blowing the Whole Thing Out of Proportion (http://www.truehoop.com/leaguewide-issues-66864-a-blow-out-a-blow-up-and-blowing-the-whole-thing-out-of-proportion.html)

Out of proportion - maybe, maybe not - fights happen with more frequency in baseball, football, hockey... but we're still talking about events that could have seriously injured or crippled the participants. Just ask Rudy. And these guys are a lot stronger than Kermit.

"...--other than perhaps wholly altering the corporate culture of your typical NBA team. (What were they supposed to do--reverse the violent upbringings of so many kids? Not sign feisty players--including multiple title winners like Larry Bird, Maurice Lucas, and Bill Laimbeer--who intimidate with their fists?) And it's pretend, I believe, that basketball can be played year after year without the occasional fight."

I agree with Cuban. This is an issue for corporate culture and it is the owners, GMs, and coachs who need to take some responsibility for what happens on the floor. Did Karl pour gasoline on the floor? Did Zeke toss a match on a floor? Yeah, they did, and neither of them takes any lumps from the league. That part stinks.

I also don't buy that JO dropping chubby fans or Melo dashing in for a well timed sucker punch is anything even remotely like what Bird or Lucas or Laimbeer used to do. Neither of them, even Maurice, ever led with their fists. They played hard, they played dirty at times - holding, grabbing, shoving, the occasional well placed elbow, but they were hardly ever (never?) the first one to throw a punch. They knew how to play hard within the rules as they existed at the time. Robinson, Anthony et al are just punks with no adult supervision.

They're responsible for this, but they aren't the only ones. They're just the only ones punished.

Losing his Carolina Way - NBA - Yahoo! Sports (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-karl121806&prov=yhoo&type=lgns)

His comment "Nobody likes Thomas, true", says it all. That is was this whole thing has turned out to be about. Another chance for the main stream media to stick it to Zeke. What a bunch of a**holes.

:hoops:

I thanked Adrian Wo.

Written By: Preacher Man On December 19, 2006 11:48 AM
Fighting in the NBA is like unexpected Karaoke at a bar. Terrible at the time to my ears, but meaningless to the taste of my beer....

Stern is a joke. His constant pandering to be the #1 sport is pathetic. The NBA will never over take Football. If Stern really was concerned about the game there is only one thing he needs to do to stop fights from getting out of hand. Heavily suspend anyone who is a third man and beyond that jumps into a fight or altercation. By heavily suspend I mean 25 games.

It is crazy to me that these players claim they are defending there teammates. Unless they are getting beat down two on one or Shaq just dropped kicked Earl Boykins into the 10 row their is no reason to jump into a one on one altercation.

If this rule was in effect Mardy Collins and JR Smith would have had words and shoved eachother the refs would have got there and seperated them and that would have been the end of it. Mardy would have gotten his lame flagrant 1 foul and it would have been the end of it.

What's kinda lost in all of this, is that JR Smith was going for another highlight dunk when he got hard fouled. And I watched it several times, that was a safe hard foul. Rough, but not meant to injure.

If JR Smith, a known malcontent keeps his cool on the hard foul, this never happens.

Again folks, physical play is allowed, and I did not see an attempt by Collins to hurt the other player. When we played on ashphalt, it was much rougher and blood was drawn but no fist fights ever broke out.

And I agree with Zeke, that if someone is going to keep showing you up in your house, they should expect what they have coming to them.

Maybe I am a philistine, but I am also a born and bred Bad Boys fan and will not apologize for that.

Grabbing a player Around the neck and throwing him to the floor, is more than a hard foul.

Grabbing a player Around the neck and throwing him to the floor, is more than a hard foul.
Watch the replay again.

What's kinda lost in all of this, is that JR Smith was going for another highlight dunk when he got hard fouled. And I watched it several times, that was a safe hard foul. Rough, but not meant to injure.

If JR Smith, a known malcontent keeps his cool on the hard foul, this never happens.

Again folks, physical play is allowed, and I did not see an attempt by Collins to hurt the other player. When we played on ashphalt, it was much rougher and blood was drawn but no fist fights ever broke out.

And I agree with Zeke, that if someone is going to keep showing you up in your house, they should expect what they have coming to them.

Maybe I am a philistine, but I am also a born and bred Bad Boys fan and will not apologize for that.


Roscoe

The bottom line is no one likes Isiah. So it is all his fault. A similar event happened in the NFL a couple of years ago with T.O. Remember how he spiked the ball on the Dallas star in the center of the field? The second time he tried to do it again and he got speared. Everybody praised the guy that drill T.O. and thought they should have beaten him to a bloddy pulp. A similar scenario in which one guy is trying to showboat and everybody forgets.

Grabbing a player Around the neck and throwing him to the floor, is more than a hard foul.

Watch the repaly and don't go by the slowmotion or still photo which makes it look worse. In real time he grabs to prevent the ball from going up and then lets go. JR Smith seemed to flop to the ground making it look worse.

It was probably a flagrant 2. A hard foul would be running into him, not grabbing him around the neck. Raja Bell got suspended during the playoffs for his clothesline on Kobe. Also the Knicks committed a hard foul at the end of their previous game. Is this going to be their new game plan? Beat the you know what out of an opposing player every time they lose? How would we feel if one of these pointless hard fouls were committed against one of our starters, and took them out for the season? And I still think the respect in our house business is a joke. I realize men think this stuff is important, but it's pointless if it doesn't help win games. I think the coaches should act like adults and set an example for the much younger players. I also think NY started the whole mess and Denver is getting the worst of the punishment as it involves two of their top scorers. The punishment is way too severe. Stern is a nerd. They fight in football, hockey, soccer,and baseball, whats the big deal???? Isiah was wrong to talk to Camby and Anthony, and his apology on camera after the game was a huge joke. Anthony had enough manners to apologize. Zeke and Nate should apologize too.

PS. I have always adored Isiah, so don't call me a hater!

Stern is a joke. His constant pandering to be the #1 sport is pathetic. The NBA will never over take Football. If Stern really was concerned about the game there is only one thing he needs to do to stop fights from getting out of hand. Heavily suspend anyone who is a third man and beyond that jumps into a fight or altercation. By heavily suspend I mean 25 games.

It is crazy to me that these players claim they are defending there teammates. Unless they are getting beat down two on one or Shaq just dropped kicked Earl Boykins into the 10 row their is no reason to jump into a one on one altercation.

If this rule was in effect Mardy Collins and JR Smith would have had words and shoved eachother the refs would have got there and seperated them and that would have been the end of it. Mardy would have gotten his lame flagrant 1 foul and it would have been the end of it.
-------------
Good post WW
But---you can't stand around and not throw when everyone else is thumping. You'll get a bad rep. And what's more important: having a rep. or having guys in your lockerroom look at you like you're soft. :nerd2:

After watching the foul several times, it was a Flagrant 1. Flagrant 2 was an after brawl overreaction by the worst officials in pro sports.

That was a very clean hard foul, 20 years ago, it wouldn't even have been a flagrant, and Smith would have picked himself up, shot some trash talk at Collins and ran back up the court.

The wussification of the NBA is ridiculous.

I posted on TrueHoop.com that there was no reason for karl to put Camby in when his team was up so much with so little time left. It was petty and sparked the entire encounter. When Collins came in for Marbury, that was Karl's clue to pull his starters and enjoy the victory.

A quote from Red Auerbach...

It all boils down to this. I used to hate these college coaches or any coach that was 25 points ahead with three minutes left to go, and they’re up pacing and they’re yelling and coaching because they’re on TV, and they want their picture on, and they get recognition. To me, the game was over. The day’s work is done. Worry about the next game.

So I would light a cigar and sit on the bench and just watch it. The game was over, for all intents and purposes. I didn’t want to rub anything in or show anybody what a great coach I was when I was 25 points ahead. Why? I gotta win by 30? What the hell difference does it make?

EasyB you are really coming across as professional, logical and feminine. This is nutso guy stuff.
Now go ahead and release. I want to hear from you how someone should've grabed a chair.

What do you mean be release? Don't you know that feminine professional logical people can love the Pistons? However if you are going to be suspended fior 15 games, you should make that foul count. Kinda like the ones that Meatball Shaq gets away with. I wouldn't mind seeing someone punch Shaq and knock him cold. He has pounded other players for too long, with impunity. I don't like the BIG FELLA. He is a conceited windbag, and his biggest skill is using his 300 plus pounds to push the other players around. The diesel needs to go down.

That's what I'm talkin' about.
Unfortunately there's not much one guy can do to the Diesel.

Thee, try telling that to Jerry Stackhouse.

Back to my nutso guy point.

After watching the foul several times, it was a Flagrant 1. Flagrant 2 was an after brawl overreaction by the worst officials in pro sports.

That was a very clean hard foul, 20 years ago, it wouldn't even have been a flagrant, and Smith would have picked himself up, shot some trash talk at Collins and ran back up the court.

The wussification of the NBA is ridiculous.
definition from the David Stern NBA unabridged dictionary of penis envy

wussification [wous a fik a shun] 1. to make traditionally competitive games more feminine 2. to chastize physical contact in games because you never had the nads 3. to impose rules to a game because YOU CAN in hoping to glorify yourself while praying that no one is looking 4. to force your underlings to make concessions to your golden boys 5. to kiss corporate asses and make plain to the world that your only interest is money
antonyms Bill Laimbeer, Charles Barkley, Rick Mahorn, Robert Parrish

Dead on f4t

The four players listed as the antonym of wussification are 4 of my six all time favorites. Put Ben Wallace and Dennis Rodman in there, and you have all the bases covered!

The four players listed as the antonym of wussification are 4 of my six all time favorites. Put Ben Wallace and Dennis Rodman in there, and you have all the bases covered!I'll go along with Rodman, but Ben doesn't really fit in with that group of bad azzes...he's too much of a nice guy. ;)

I'll go along with Rodman, but Ben doesn't really fit in with that group of bad azzes...he's too much of a nice guy. ;)

Someone has to send out the Christmas cards!
:)

After watching the foul several times, it was a Flagrant 1. Flagrant 2 was an after brawl overreaction by the worst officials in pro sports.

I'm not sure these guys know how to give a good old hard foul these days. They've never really seen it done. It's not the arms, it's the body that works best.

When they try the only thing they know how to do is from a WWF commercial.

Giving a hard foul if someone tried that at the end of a blowout used to almost be a guarantee. I have seen that several times in the past.

Shaq? Laimbeer once sent Shaq to the floor in Shaq's rookie season. It was the only year where the 2 played in the same season. Shaq was not too happy about it. Lamb wanted to send the arrogant rookie a message.

Wasn't the fight between Kobe and Indys 3 shooter because Kobe shot a 3 in GT? He didn't go to the hole. I don't remember if the Lakers had a 20 pt lead or not.

PTI reports that Northwest Airlines pulled all of their December inflight (backseat pocket) magazines that had Carmelo featured on the cover?? I guess they thought they would lose customers.......:confused:

PTI reports that Northwest Airlines pulled all of their December inflight (backseat pocket) magazines that had Carmelo featured on the cover?? I guess they thought they would lose customers.......:confused:


Perhaps they wanted to be Sucka Free!! :pound: :pound: :pound:

PTI reports that Northwest Airlines pulled all of their December inflight (backseat pocket) magazines that had Carmelo featured on the cover?? I guess they thought they would lose customers.......:confused:

Absolutely ridiculous. Laughable. Escape goating to the nth degree.

Yeah and Philly just wiped AIs image from their programs. Slightly diff. reasons.

ESPN.com - NBA - Refs suggest summit on conflict; commish, union say no (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2704334&campaign=rss&source=NBAHeadlines)

Foul image bugs Collins - Newsday.com (http://www.newsday.com/sports/basketball/knicks/ny-spmardy215023975dec21,0,7863291.story?coll=ny-knicks-print)

Mardy Collins admits his hard foul on J.R. Smith was the result of what he was instructed by his coach. But Collins isn't talking about Knicks coach Isiah Thomas. He meant John Chaney, the former Temple coach for whom Collins played the past four years.

"That's just the way I was brought up," Collins said yesterday before he served the second of his six-game suspension for his role in the brawl with the Denver Nuggets last Saturday night, which started with his flagrant foul on Smith. "With Coach Chaney, we don't just give guys layups. It's anybody in basketball, it's not like I'm trying to intentionally hurt a guy. That's just something I did growing up. In Philadelphia, that's how we play."

ESPN.com - NBA - Refs suggest summit on conflict; commish, union say no (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2704334&campaign=rss&source=NBAHeadlines)

Highly weird. Branch three of the dysfunctional NBA family chimes in.

Unwritten rules.
You don't steal bases with 5+ run leads late in a game.
You don't admire home runs too long from the batters box.
You don't fling 30 yard passes with 4 TD leads in the 4th qtr.
You don't invoke the no-layup rule when leading by 20 late in a game (Artest)
So on and so forth.

In decoded form, DON'T EMBARRASS YOUR OPPONENT.


There are consequences and reprocussions. And so there should be.

Highly weird. Branch three of the dysfunctional NBA family chimes in.

Not weird, just no shame. It's like the turret door at the Waldorf, the sliding muffled rubber sound from the bottom of the doors announcing the grand entrance of yet another cue for fifteen minutes of fame.

I am embarrassed for McMorri.

ESPN.com - NBA - Refs suggest summit on conflict; commish, union say no (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2704334&campaign=rss&source=NBAHeadlines)

from article -
"How do we address the culture so a message is sent to fans that it's OK to bring their kids to games? We are addressing this issue so the culture is changed, and this behavior isn't acceptable."



In all honesty though. That probably was the most excitement fans at the Garden had in a long time. If there were any school age kids there they probably went to school the next day bragging to their friends that they were there.

Not saying it was right. Its a basketball game not the WWF but I am sure the fan reaction was more of an extra bonus entertainment deal rather than this conception that anyone was mentally disturbed by it.

Who are we kidding here?

"How do we address the culture so a message is sent to fans that it's OK to bring their kids to games? We are addressing this issue so the culture is changed, and this behavior isn't acceptable."
I, for one, am grateful that someone has the courage to be looking out for America's youth. It's just not acceptable for the NBA to expose our children to the grotesque spectacle of a bunch of dudes running around in their jammies making tough guy poses, pushing and slapping at each other, and running away. If we can't change the culture so that it's OK to bring kids to NBA games, then parents need to just keep them home where they can engage in more wholesome activities, like watching violent movies, playing first-person shooter games, and getting into all kinds of trouble on the Internet.

I, for one, am grateful that someone has the courage to be looking out for America's youth. It's just not acceptable for the NBA to expose our children to the grotesque spectacle of a bunch of dudes running around in their jammies making tough guy poses, pushing and slapping at each other, and running away. If we can't change the culture so that it's OK to bring kids to NBA games, then parents need to just keep them home where they can engage in more wholesome activities, like watching violent movies, playing first-person shooter games, and getting into all kinds of trouble on the Internet.

Great post. I appreciate your moral outrage!

:pound:

My friend's wife doesn't want their son to play sports because she doesn't dislikes "all that...competativeness" This rubs my pal the wrong way because he was a tough competitor.

People who complain about the fights don't recognize the value of something like this. 1. Stand up for yourself. 2. When things do bad, you deal with the consequences. 3. The best way to avoid getting punched is to back pedal like a maniac.

One of the best lesson someone can take from this is that your role models (melo) can be fallible. and its something the NBA marketing machine seems to want to whitewash.

For crying out loud!!!!! I have read alot of articles about the brawl and to me it is bordering on down right insanity.

First of, that melee in New York was not a brawl. It seems strange to me how players rush out of the dug out in baseball push, shove and swing at eachother and no one cries how it is a stain on the league. It is played on Sportscenter everyone has a good laugh and a few guy's are suspended a couple of games. It is all in competition. Stuff happens.

So why is it different in basketball? I hate to bring this up but is it because a lot of these basketball players come from rough environments? Some of the neighborhoods these basketball players learned to play in many people are afraid to even drive through in fear that something bad might happen to them. That same fear is why David Stern wanted the dress code because the image his players were reflecting in their hip-hop attired scarred the crap out of a lot of upper class fat cats with silver spoons in their mouths.

No matter how much you try to change these players and dress them up you can not hide where they came from what they have went through growing up and what they are. These players have to be accountable and have to want to change their ways. These players have to realize on their own that maybe some of the people they associate with may cause them conflict. I am not saying forget where you came from or get new friends but you have to be smart. If you are a star player worth millions of dollars you can't be in a car with your friends with drugs and loaded guns.

The league sold itself to the darkside the day its owners decided it was okay to not test its players for weed, overlook a troubled past or excuse a guy who has been in and out of the criminal system simply because he can play basketball.

So David Stern please spare me your high and mighty act.

Human Pride...double Sided blade.
OK we've seen this over and over. How about faulting the system. The Refs and the league they semi manage.
The Knicks took the beating fair and square until GT. THEN they hard fouled. Why didn't the refs in a blowout situation have the power to limit Karls players to bench guys. The 2 minute warning rule. The Garbage Time Rule. Speak to the issues.
Don't say you're in charge if you're oblivious to Human Pride!

We should be rooting for the Knicks... the last thing we need is for them to have the worst record and Chicago swap picks... Greg Oden in Chicago would be sick.

We should be rooting for the Knicks... the last thing we need is for them to have the worst record and Chicago swap picks... Greg Oden in Chicago would be sick.

Can't believe they got 2 picks for Curry.

Can't believe they got 2 picks for Curry.

If they get Oden, no one will ever remember who the other pick was!! LOL

:hoops:

Brawls? I love em. Long as nobody get's seriously hurt. Has there ever been a serious injury in a brawl other than Rudy T?

Brawls lite fires....create rivalrys....generate "drama." Clear out the bad blood by identifyin the men AND the boys. Plus they tend to make me get outta my chair and enjoy the festivities.

This may wake up the "sleeping giant" in the Apple.

Whatever "morality" might be, I doubt you'd be runnin to the beer stand while one was goin on.

Go Pistons! Go Knicks! Go Bulls! Go east (except the Magic)! We want our lottery pick!

knicks on a 3 game win streak after the suspensions.

knicks on a 3 game win streak after the suspensions.

I was just thinking about that when I saw the box score from last night. Nothing like a fight to get your team united and on the same page. Perhaps getting hammer at home and having a team try to rub it in turned on a switch.

Seems like something weird has to happen to some teams before they get on a roll:-

1. The Bulls - since the 'Headbangate' issue, they went on a streak.

2. The Knicks - 3 games winning streak (longest this season for them) since the brawl.

3. The 76ers - broke a 12 game losing streak the day AI debuts for the Nuggets.

More to come...

Btw, Thomas is coaching his azz off during this streak. He should be applauded. Great overtime victories and due to the recent suspensions, I think he's found a good consistent rotation.

they have too many guys. lose a few and its a competative team. lol

I'll go along with Winless and Hatter on this...
Surely brawls are a negative influence for the kids... so is a lot of what they experience on school playgrounds (cussing, fighting, verbal cruelty etc)... I don't believe in sheltering the kids to the point that when they do see or hear something outrageous that that are tramatized:dizzy2:.... the real world is not enjoyed in a protective G rated bubble.
Reminds me of some of them 15 year old kids that still hang onto their mommy's purse straps... they eventually receive a cold hard slap of reality.:loser:
I hope my kids can defend themselves ... as long as they are taught not to seek out abusive behavior.

What qualifies as acceptable violence?
Boxing
Hockey
Wrestling (pro or armature)
Football
Arm wrestling :^)

Someone care to draw the line for the kids eyes?
:focus:

Good post Merc.
As for your last question...porn and "Saw" type movies.

Btw, Thomas is coaching his azz off during this streak. He should be applauded. Great overtime victories and due to the recent suspensions, I think he's found a good consistent rotation.


For the heat Zeke has taken he does have a lot of talent on that team although all the pieces do not compliment eachother. He needs to trade Q. Richardson. You don't need Q if you have Crawford. Trading for Francis was just plain stupid. No one is going to trade for a broken down Francis especially with his bad contract but he needs to be set free. David Lee has put up better numbers at Small Forward than Power Forward.

What qualifies as acceptable violence?
Boxing
Hockey
Wrestling (pro or armature)
Football
Arm wrestling :^)

Someone care to draw the line for the kids eyes?
:focus:


Unfortunately we have to add to acceptable violence:

1. TV
2. Movies
3. Video games

:gun1::gun1::gun1:

Bunch of bull. The only ones who were tramatized were the refs for looking like a bunch of dorks everytime a fight breaks out that they are too small to stop. Thats why the refs wanted that summit to address the violence issues.

Bunch of bull. The only ones who were tramatized were the refs for looking like a bunch of dorks everytime a fight breaks out that they are too small to stop. Thats why the refs wanted that summit to address the violence issues.


That's why I think Stern is full of crap. He should have met with the refs. I still say that to stop the violence from getting out of hand they need to increase the leaving the bench penality from 1 game to 5 games. They also need to add heavy suspensions for instigaters guy's that jump into a fight between two people and make things worse and are not trying to break it up.

If the NBA really wants to stop fights and violence they need to include some type of clause in player contracts indicating a very stiff penalty for fighting.

That way a player will be aware of what the consequences will be and it will surely be a deterrent. For example, if Carmelo and Nate Robinson were aware that they would be suspeneded and fined for perhaps MORE that they actually were, I guarantee we would have not seen what we did.

I am watching game 5 of the 2004 finals and around the 8 minute mark of the 1st period Prince goes to the hoop for what could have been a slam. Shaq gives Prince a forearm shiv across Prince's neck while Price is in mid air knocking Prince to the floor.

No flagrant and no fight.

:gun1:

Buddhafan, as the days wear on, something is becoming obvious to me.

The escapegoats are

Isiah Thomas
Carmelo Anthony
George Karl
Mardy Collins

when in fact the real bad guys are

JR Smith (overreacting)
Nate Robinson (3rd man in)

That's why I think Stern is full of crap. He should have met with the refs. I still say that to stop the violence from getting out of hand they need to increase the leaving the bench penality from 1 game to 5 games. They also need to add heavy suspensions for instigaters guy's that jump into a fight between two people and make things worse and are not trying to break it up.

My point was that I don't think its a big deal as long as it stays on the court and does not involve the fans. Getting punched by Stephen Jackson is not exactly my idea of a holesome family event.

With that said the refs do have a point in that the participants are rather large individuals and there is no way they can effectivly break up on court brawls on their own.

My point was that I don't think its a big deal as long as it stays on the court and does not involve the fans. Getting punched by Stephen Jackson is not exactly my idea of a holesome family event.

With that said the refs do have a point in that the participants are rather large individuals and there is no way they can effectivly break up on court brawls on their own.

I totally agree. Fights happen it is part of the game. For the media to act like it is the end of the world and that it is a stain on the league is a total joke.

You have to admit though things can get ugly when you have 5 or 6 fights break out on each end of the court. It is not only hard to break them up but control what intoxicated fans might do when they are within an arm's length of a fight and there favorite player is getting a butt whooping. That's why trying to limit fights to just the original patricipants and stopping the 3rd and 4th man in is the only way to control the fights from getting out of hand.

As for Stephen Jackson yeah it kind of ruins the excitment when you end up with a knuckle sandwhich and drenched in diet coke.:cold:

Buddhafan, as the days wear on, something is becoming obvious to me.

The escapegoats are

Isiah Thomas
Carmelo Anthony
George Karl
Mardy Collins

when in fact the real bad guys are

JR Smith (overreacting)
Nate Robinson (3rd man in)

Unless the foul drew blood no reason to get bent out of shape. I have seen guy's take forearm shivers to the head and not react like JR Smith. They will look at a guy and maybe have words but that would be the extent of it.

I think Nate should have gotten 25 games in my opinion. He really has a Napolean complex and was the 3rd man in to a altercation that had calmed down between Mardy and JR Smith.

Unless the foul drew blood no reason to get bent out of shape. I have seen guy's take forearm shivers to the head and not react like JR Smith. They will look at a guy and maybe have words but that would be the extent of it.

I think Nate should have gotten 25 games in my opinion. He really has a Napolean complex and was the 3rd man in to a altercation that had calmed down between Mardy and JR Smith.

Again, stiff, I mean stiff penalties that are included in your contract would be a sure deterrent.

That would probably never happen, however, it would possibly eliminate fighting.

Again, stiff, I mean stiff penalties that are included in your contract would be a sure deterrent.

That would probably never happen, however, it would possibly eliminate fighting.


The players association would never go for that. Also teams know that altercations occasionaly happen and they do not want to be without their players and extended amount of time. I think that's why when you see these guy's get into to it they throw open handed fists or shove each other around to avoid throwing real punches. That is a loophole the league needs to close.

It is kinda in every contract. The league reserves the right to deal out penalties for misconduct.

When you get suspended, you lose a game's pay. When you get a technical, you get fined. Team's can also deal out "discipline".

This is a big stink right now between the Player's Association and League. All of those "no crying" technicals under Zero Tolerance, dealt out earlier this year cost the players thousands and thousands of dollars.

The PA doesn't like that the league can claw back money through fines at their own discretion behind the guise of "enforcing" ambiguous rules.

You have to admit though things can get ugly when you have 5 or 6 fights break out on each end of the court. It is not only hard to break them up but control what intoxicated fans might do when they are within an arm's length of a fight and there favorite player is getting a butt whooping. That's why trying to limit fights to just the original patricipants and stopping the 3rd and 4th man in is the only way to control the fights from getting out of hand.

I know what you saying. In the entire history of the NBA the only time fans got physical with the players was when the players went into the stands swinging. As long as the players stay on the court things will be fine.


It is kinda in every contract. The league reserves the right to deal out penalties for misconduct.

When you get suspended, you lose a game's pay. When you get a technical, you get fined. Team's can also deal out "discipline".

This is a big stink right now between the Player's Association and League. All of those "no crying" technicals under Zero Tolerance, dealt out earlier this year cost the players thousands and thousands of dollars.

The PA doesn't like that the league can claw back money through fines at their own discretion behind the guise of "enforcing" ambiguous rules.

This is a good point. I would imagine the league gets more than enough from the yearly franchise dues, or whatever they pay, so perhaps they can donate the proceeds from fines to charity.

I know what you saying. In the entire history of the NBA the only time fans got physical with the players was when the players went into the stands swinging. As long as the players stay on the court things will be fine.




There have been times where fans have gotten physical with players. Remember the Allen Iverson incident at the Palace when some goof ball hit him in the head with a quarter? Barkley had numerous incidents both on and off the court with fans. Most of the on court issues he handled correctly off the court well lets just say he beat the pulp out of them. Also there have been other incidents involving verbal abuse of the players from fans.

The Pacer incident was the only one where you had two combustible personlities " nutcases" involved where they felt they had the right to swing on people because someone did something to them. If you act perfessional like Iverson point the guy out to security and have him escourted out then there is no disruption to the game and no one is hurt. That is the right way to hand it.

I finally saw the fight on YouTube.
I liked the Melo punch!
Collins or whomever was still jawing and Melo shut his mouth down. Period. Nice practice.
As for Jeffeys trying to get a piece of Melo, I'm glad he was never able to engage. Cause if Melo chills him out too, how is the league going to say anything to him then?
His new name might be "Two in one Night".
Hockey teams might want to hire him.

I finally saw the fight on YouTube.
I liked the Melo punch!
Collins or whomever was still jawing and Melo shut his mouth down. Period. Nice practice.
As for Jeffeys trying to get a piece of Melo, I'm glad he was never able to engage. Cause if Melo chills him out too, how is the league going to say anything to him then?
His new name might be "Two in one Night".
Hockey teams might want to hire him.

His sprint after the sucka' punch was impressive as well. I heard the first 40m where he ran off like a coward, he broke 4 seconds. We could use him on the Lions.

His work was done ...
Jeffreys might want a match.