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Detroit Pistons vs Miami Heat
October 22nd, 2005 ~ 7:30pm
The Palace of Auburn Hills, Auburn Hills, MI
TV: WB20 Radio: WDFN

http://www.pistonsforum.com/img/resources/pistons/flip_saunders.jpghttp://www.pistonsforum.com/img/resources/team/vs.gifhttp://www.pistonsforum.com/img/resources/heat/stan_van_gundy.jpg

Detroit Pistons vs. Miami HEAT (preview from NBA.com (http://www.nba.com/pistons/news/MIADET_051022_preview.html))
Preseason Preview: Game 6

The Pistons will face the Miami Heat on Saturday, October 22nd at 7:30 p.m. in a rematch of the 2005 Eastern Conference Finals. Saturday night’s game will be the last Pistons preseason game at the Palace of Auburn Hills before the 2005-06 regular season begins on November 2nd.

After coming up a game short of reaching the NBA Finals for the first time in franchise history at the hands of the Detroit Pistons, the Miami Heat made quite a few off-season moves. The Heat acquired swingman James Posey and point guard Jason Williams from Memphis, as well as forward Antoine Walker from Boston in a blockbuster five-team trade that sent Rasual Butler to the New Orleans/Oklahoma City Hornets and Eddie Jones to the Memphis Grizzlies. The team also signed free agent point guard Gary Payton from the Celtics and forward Jason Kapono from the Bobcats and lost point guard Damon Jones to Cleveland via free agency.

The newcomers are expected to be just the support staff that Miami is looking for to make it to the Finals in 2006. The Heat, who led the East with a 59-23 record last season, will still look to their core duo – breakout star Dwyane Wade and All-Star center Shaquille O’Neal – to lead the team to success. In Shaq’s inaugural season with the team, he averaged a double-double (22.9 points per game and 10.4 rebounds per game) for an NBA-record 13th consecutive season. Wade, who had a tremendous sophomore season, averaged 24.1 points, 6.8 assists, and 5.2 rebounds per game.

Even with great talent, the question still remains if this fresh-looking Miami Heat team will be able to develop the team chemistry that will allow them to play as well on the court as they look on paper. Judge for yourself on Saturday, as the Pistons look to make a comeback after two straight preseason losses on Tuesday and Wednesday night.

Detroit 87 Heat 66

BoxScore - From nba.com (http://www.nba.com/games/20051022/MIADET/boxscore.html)

PlayByPlay - From nba.com (http://scores.nba.com/games/20051022/MIADET/PlayByPlayPrint.html)

Player of the Game: Tayshaun Prince - 16pts 6 rebs in 28 mins
Sub of the Game: Carlos Delfino - 13 pts on 5-6 shooting and 3 assits in 16 mins.

I understand that the diesel is in the shop again getting repairs. Ah these old diesels constantly in need or repairs. Gotta love it.

I guess that is Why Motown has stuck mostly with gas guzzlers. LOL

Just found out; Shaq is "injured". He just doesn't want to face Darko. :peace: I was looking forward to seeing a little of DMC on the Diesel just to see if what I saw last season was true or not. Some of us thought he did pretty well against him and some of you did not.

We will just have to wait and see; maybe he will be better by the game in Miami. :eyebrows:

Well, anyway, we can see if any of our new guys can slow Wade down. Or is he playing hookey, too? :doh:

I love these icons. I hope you guys do, too. I keep downloading those programs into my email programs but when I run an AdWare program, it takes them right out so maybe they are "spies".

I understand that the diesel is in the shop again getting repairs. Ah these old diesels constantly in need or repairs. Gotta love it.

I guess that is Why Motown has stuck mostly with gas guzzlers. LOL

I had a feeling snaq wouldn't be playing tonight.... Likely miami doesn't want to risk injury and sort of not let their chief rival get too much of a good look or feel about them. However I did attend that big shaq party out @ Hoop City grille last night and he was indeed their with his buddy d. wade among other heat players. Didn't seem like much was wrong with him at all, he even looked like he had some discipline and didn't get fat over the summer as he did at times back in l.a. Irregardless I'm looking forward to a good game tonight! Our new revamped bench is truly going to be a real rude awakening to the rest of the league....

URGH... Another game with varying levels of competitiveness.

Well here I go again....

First Q.

Pistons showing some competitiveness. Tay still looks like he is coasting. The offense looks terribly disorganized at times, I still don't think these guys have the playbook down. Or maybe they are faking. yeah, that's the ticket. The Pistons are sandbagging...

Heat look terrible. Can't hit FTs, most of the offense coming through Shaq. You can see the talent the individual players possess, but they seem to have developed zero chemistry at this point in the pre-season.

Subs were Darko and Dice. Mourning and Payton for Miami.

23-14 Pistons

Play of the Q was a nice Ben block. Darko fouled Mourning as the Heat tried to post up on the young Piston center.

I'm not recapping the whole game, so someone else feel free to chime in.

Btw, THIS GAME JUST GOT A LOT MORE COMPETITIVE!

this is a pounding. i'm not watching the game but delfino seems to be doing well. anyone's first hand take on his game tonight?

I hope someone can get some clips online. I heard Delfino stuffed a putback. the folks over at realgm are calling delfino a pimp. lol.

glinny the new pre season HVC.

I hope someone can get some clips online. I heard Delfino stuffed a putback. the folks over at realgm are calling delfino a pimp. lol.

glinny the new pre season HVC.

i'm thinking this cigar should be left in the wrapper.

Miami's FTs and three-point makes were nonexistent. Man, it sounds like their offense, except for Shaq, sucked. I have a feeling Ron Jeremy Van Gundy doesn't make it through the season. I hope he still talks to his porn pals in SoCal so he can find work. :laugh:

Miami's FTs and three-point shots were nonexistent. Man, it sounds like their offense, except for Shaq, sucked. I have a feeling Ron Jeremy Van Gundy doesn't make it through the season. I hope he still talks to his porn pals in SoCal so he can find work. :laugh:

Maybe we can pick him up for the coaching staff.

I don't think Stan Van Gundy is going to last very long. I mean did you notice that half the time he wasn't even paying attention to the game? Here he is hamming it up for the crowd.

http://www.meltzner.net/images/jeremy2.bmp

[roscoe: Bills, I had to change your pic to a link. It was scaring folks from posting. Sorry.]

I have a major problem with that picture. For a coach of the team that wants to be the best team in the east, he's setting a bad example.

First off, he's thumbing his nose at the new dress code!!!

Just look at all that BLING on his arm. Other than that, he looks great.

I don't think Stan Van Gundy is going to last very long. I mean did you notice that half the time he wasn't even paying attention to the game? Here he is hamming it up for the crowd.

http://www.meltzner.net/images/jeremy2.bmp

[roscoe: Bills, I had to change your pic to a link. It was scaring folks from posting. Sorry.]


Man...I said "Darth don't you open that picture...don't do it...you know what you're gonna see..." But I just had to do it, ya know.

No worries. I should regain full use of my eyes before the season opener. :eek:

Is that VG's natural hair pattern? Or did he manscape?

Bills- I have also heard about some problems VanGundy is having. He is going to have a lot of them with Walker from what I could tell. Real fun watching Walker trying to take over a play only to get it blocked or stripped by one of the Wallace's.

Crucial mistake leaving Posey in during garbage time where he received what appeared to be a dislocated finger or a wrist injury.

It was the Shaq show for Miami but thats all they had. Only pre-season but the starters were at full steam and seemed to want to send Miami a message that they still are the team to beat. Rip talked about this in the post-game stating that everyone is favoring Miami.

Not too much to complain about from the Piston side. Rip and Tay got off to good games so all starters have had good games at some point during the 5 pre-seasons.

Delfino was very impressive off the bench and won Blaha/Lamb's sub of the game honors. Darko looked good but got some cheapies whistled against him on Shaq. Still Darko continues to show no fear at all when paired against 2 of the toughest front-line guys like Shaq and Zo.

Just a great entertaining game with the bench continuing to gell. Now pretty much just Dyess has to get his legs back and a choice has to be made between Dupree and Evans for the regular rotation spot. Evans is the clear leader.

On a minor note both Johnson and Acker played very smart out there in their limited time.

Dale Davis looks good getting rebounds, but no, he can't guard Shaq at all. Darko looks ok on Shaq though, but its going to matter a lot about how much respect Darko earns this year from the refs.

The game was dissapointing in that Miami looked so bad, other than Shaq, that you just can't tell a whole lot from the Pistons team from this game. Miami plays no D, does not play as a team at all on offense except for all those times they gave Shaq the ball. At least they did that right a lot.

We pretty much played the usual rotation, the starters then Arroyo, Delfino, Evans, Dyess, and Darko. I see some people don't like Arroyo tonight. Guess they don't understand what a point guard does. With Arroyo as our point guard to start the 4th, we went 8 for 11 to put this game away. The point guard is the one that dictates how the offense goes, and it went very well with Arroyo in.

Delfino had a good shooting night. Thats one, give us more. Great to see him hit his shots. Dyess was nailing his midrangers. Evans hit a triple. Tay hit a couple and did some scoring otherwise. Anyone notice that we constantly have a mismatch with Tay in our favor game after game? He is not just defense.

Darko also hit an outside shot and just barely missed a couple more. (One a forced shot from well outside the three line with time expiring.) You can see his confidence going up, and it is flat out a relief to not have Brown on the sidelines anymore to nay say those shots. Darko also put an offensive rebound back in nicely with a reverse. Another play where he received the ball from Delfino on a cut to the basket and slammed it down was called off due a bogus charging call against Delfino.

Maxiell played very little, along with Acker and Amir Johnson for the last few minutes of this blowout win. Dupree got in a bit too and did some scoring. Hit a shot from outside as soon as he entered the game.

Evans dribbled in once and kicked out. No assist there but it was the first time I have seen him do this right. But it was just Miami, a Miami not playing defense.

Flip praised Rip's defense on Wade for the game, saying he was surprised by what a wiry strong defender Rip was. We saw Evans play some on Wade too. But you can't say Evans did great or what since Wade was just not doing much all game.

Ok, based on this game, with Miami not even looking like a team that can make the playoffs, let alone even win a round in the playoffs, can't see a whole lot of need to keep Hunter on the roster to contend with Wade. Just does not look needed at all.

The starters looked a lot sharper today bringing the ball up, but once more, you got to realize that its Miami. One that let the Jone's twins leave. Along with all the defense Miami ever had. They got Posey, a guy Denver let go long ago. (And kept White instead.) They got some guard who never saw a shot he would not take. How about a power forward who thinks he is a guard. Not. Just don't see how Miami upgraded. Their backup point from last year is going to start for Orlando this year. Gone too is Rasual Butler, another promising young player. Gee, except for Wade, there went all their guards who were getting the minutes last year.

So we shouldn't keep Hunter on the roster because of a preseason game where Miami stunk. I see. That's quite an extrapolation.

I do agree that Miami has not upgraded itself. I think they will be better this year than they played tonite, but they have subtracted their two best perimeter shooters in favor of a bunch of players who all need the ball in their hands to be effective.

I didn't know the heat wpuld look so bad.

Watching the game now. We were out and I taped the game. For all of you who think Darko will not be able to play with Shaq, just check out between the 5 1/2 and 6 minute remaining mark in the first half. Darko was keeping Shaq from going deep and while doing so, reached around him and batted the ball out so that we got a fast break. Right after that, when Shaq bulldozed him, he came right back and bulldozed Shaq, but of course, got a foul called on him. He played Mourning tough, too.

Not a star but will be competent this year - - - this year!!

The whole Piston team looks more like a team, like ten times more, than Miami. They have a lot of work to do. Bet they don't get it done, either. Detroit wins home court in the east, all the way.

I know this is just a pre-season game. I know. But I think the Pistons will build up a lead and not relinquish it.

Davis is playing well as is Evans. Sheed and Rip. Heck, they all are.

Does Sheed have FatWanes number, :yo: :yo: or what!!

He is flat-out locked down.

So we shouldn't keep Hunter on the roster because of a preseason game where Miami stunk. I see. That's quite an extrapolation.

I do agree that Miami has not upgraded itself. I think they will be better this year than they played tonite, but they have subtracted their two best perimeter shooters in favor of a bunch of players who all need the ball in their hands to be effective.

TBird, you took what I wrote not as I intended. No, decisions are not made on one game. But from what we saw from this game, if that were all we had to go by, then we could leave Hunter off the roster. Miami simply, for this game, looked like no threat at all to us. I meant to say no more than that.

TBird, you took what I wrote not as I intended. No, decisions are not made on one game. But from what we saw from this game, if that were all we had to go by, then we could leave Hunter off the roster. Miami simply, for this game, looked like no threat at all to us. I meant to say no more than that.

Lee, using your logic then I guess based on THIS game Miami can leave Wade off the roster too. :crazy:

Seriously Lee, thanks for the recap. I've got League Pass but it seems that any exhibition game that's not carried by Fox Sports gets blacked out when there's a local (Celtics) game on. Good to read some game action.

Is Delfino going to be running that baseline scam on free throws all season? He was doing it in the early exhibition games and I thought the opponents would eventually catch on. :)

PS: check out the photo here. The camera perspective makes Gary Payton looks like a cartoon dwarf trying to pass around Darko.

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/sports/basketball/12974672.htm

Watching the game now. We were out and I taped the game. For all of you who think Darko will not be able to play with Shaq, just check out between the 5 1/2 and 6 minute remaining mark in the first half. Darko was keeping Shaq from going deep and while doing so, reached around him and batted the ball out so that we got a fast break. Right after that, when Shaq bulldozed him, he came right back and bulldozed Shaq, but of course, got a foul called on him. He played Mourning tough, too.

Not a star but will be competent this year - - - this year!!


darko showed that he can play shaq and play zo. i was at the game and darko posterized zo on that pick and roll. it was wiped off because of a charge call but it sent a clear message to zo. darko did not back down to shaq or zo. shaq thought he was going to just bowl darko over but darko didn't budge and gave shaq a bit of a hit right back. he just doesn't have the respect right now so he got the call against him. also the shaq didn't have to play darko in the pick and roll. but during the regular season if you put sheed in with darko shaq should have to guard the pick and roll every time down the court. i'm hoping as the season progresses that darko can play the role of shaq stopper that ec played last year.

I don't think Stan Van Gundy is going to last very long. I mean did you notice that half the time he wasn't even paying attention to the game? Here he is hamming it up for the crowd.

http://www.meltzner.net/images/jeremy2.bmp

[roscoe: Bills, I had to change your pic to a link. It was scaring folks from posting. Sorry.]

Where's Luigi?

THat was a great stuff by Delfino on the freethrow putback. :nod:

I guess we are losing the exciteent of the preseason. We were posting video of the wack games, but as the preseaon progresses we don even get the usual recap and we played the almighty Heat. What gives???

I guess we are losing the exciteent of the preseason. We were posting video of the wack games, but as the preseaon progresses we don even get the usual recap and we played the almighty Heat. What gives???
What's this "we" stuff? I missed your recap and video contribution. Don't look a gift horse in the mouth bro.

damn, Diesel becomes more and more fat each year. Been some years he looked like this or am I am wrong?

I needed to see for myself what the Heat looked like before I could really say what I thought, and I was right. Those were bad trades first of all the Joneses could make the outside shot consistantly, and Antione Walker, Posey, Williams, and Payton can't shoot for crapp. Eddie and Damon are pretty young, and they traded them off and got older. this team has no future except Wade and he can't do it all by himself, Shaq is going to be gone soon so take away those 28 points he had yesterday and look what you have.
Who did Tay gaurd yesterday? I know he didn't gaurd Wade because Rip did and he did a hell of a job, Rip's getting a lot better on defense.

I think we still had some great recaps of the game. Thanks Lee. I don't know why people keep busting on him for his opinions in this section.

Miami poses some interesting scenarios. They have talent but lack chemisty. Some people expect them to gel later. But how long until SVG get PR's shoe tattoed on his backside? Then they have to adjuct to the coach. I am not going to believe that this team is going to knock themselves out of contention. That would be too easy.

If the Pistons play as well as they can in my opinion the Heat won't be able to beat them in a 7 game-series.

That articles sheds some serious insight into the the state of the Heat right now. Reading between the lines, it seems that D Wade is extremely unhappy having to be the 2 guard. The question is, if they do start putting the ball in his hands as the PG, who does that leave at the 2? PAyton and J Will cant shoot, and maybe they throw Posey as the 2 and Walker the 3? Either way, the Pistons should feast on those mismatches.

Anyway what I really liked last night was the fact that Delfino and our very much slept on FA pick up Evans are going to definitely improve our 3pt shooting. It's no longer just Chauncey alone along with Sheed knocking one down every now and then. This season if Tay can continue to consistently knock some treys down (as he did last night) along with CD and Evans stretching defenses off the bench for us it will no doubt be a good look for Detroit. As much as many of us wanted to pick up a pure shooter over the summer I can truly see now that we didn't acquire an exact pure shooter... But we clearly have improved our overall team range from downtown, perhaps if Delfino was able to make it through the season last year he could of helped us in that dept then as well. Hopefully CA continues to shot the ball when he's open because I do believe he is a decent shooter as well. If he could evolve into a 3 point threat as well our squad would be even that much more dangerous!


BTW that charging call on Delfino was pure BS to say the least. He set up DMC beautifully (pick&roll) for the sweet SLAM over zo, to call a charge on CD well after he's passed the ball and is not even going towards the basket was just a bad call. Nothing worth crying about though, our squad did their thing anyway. GO PISTONS!!!!!!

You guys should of seen shaq on the bench last night he was probably saying " I wasted all this money for this BS." We have a rematch against Dallas this Tuesday.

You guys should of seen shaq on the bench last night he was probably saying " I wasted all this money for this BS." We have a rematch against Dallas this Tuesday.

He got plenty to waste. I wouldn't cry for him.

What's this "we" stuff? I missed your recap and video contribution. Don't look a gift horse in the mouth bro.

So, I deserve no answer, because I gave no contribution?? My fault. Where can I send my donation so I don't get slammed when I ask a question?? (That's prolly what the Pistons say when they read the forums..."What is all this WE ish??!!)

That articles sheds some serious insight into the the state of the Heat right now. Reading between the lines, it seems that D Wade is extremely unhappy having to be the 2 guard. The question is, if they do start putting the ball in his hands as the PG, who does that leave at the 2? PAyton and J Will cant shoot, and maybe they throw Posey as the 2 and Walker the 3? Either way, the Pistons should feast on those mismatches.

Wade was pretty excited to get JWill on the team. He said Jason is a good point guard and knows how to get people the ball. It sounded like a dis to Damon Jones. He now has to figure on how to make his team mates better, since he is considered to be an All Star ball player. He thinks it's Shaq's job.

So, I deserve no answer, because I gave no contribution?? My fault. Where can I send my donation so I don't get slammed when I ask a question??
No, my point was not to slam you but it takes time to generate the content you crave. You might want to consider that people do it when they can and when they can't, that's life. No point in complaining about the lack of coverage.

In the meantime, feel free to make your contribution if you feel the site is lacking info. I'd like to think we are doing a helluva job WITHOUT donations/advertising and a staff consisting entirely of volunteers.

No, my point was not to slam you but it takes time to generate the content you crave. You might want to consider that people do it when they can and when they can't, that's life. No point in complaining about the lack of coverage.

In the meantime, feel free to make your contribution if you feel the site is lacking info. I'd like to think we are doing a helluva job WITHOUT donations/advertising and a staff consisting entirely of volunteers.

I didn't take what you said too hard, because WE say "We won, we aquired, we let go, Our bench is getting better", and things like that when we really don't give any physical contribution. But what we are, are good fans. In saying that, I am a fan of this site. So, are we getting bored with the preseason??

Man, am I ever disappointed in Evans as far as his ability to cover Wade. Just flat out none. Now, Wade only shot 4-11 in the game, but he got to the free throw a ton vs. Evans. We are simply lucky Wade could not hit a free throw. Anyway, every time Wade made any move on Evans, he lost Evans instantly. Way too easy. On the other hand, Evans did manage to stay physical with Wade quite a lot. Maybe this helped some? Its a stretch. Right now I say cut Dupree and get Hunter ready to play against Miami. (This assumes Miami is still seen as a threat-they do have issues. And the problem is that if we keep Hunter for the playoffs, we have to leave a pretty darn good player off the roster. And its probably Mo Evans believe it or not.)

On the rewatch, the defense of Darko looked even better than at first glance. Lots of opposing players missing from altering their shots. Likewise, I liked the job Dale Davis did more the 2nd look. Now, Shaq did score on Davis too much, but there were good defensive sequences in there where Shaq did not try to score on Davis. We don't focus on these as much since the camera is always on the ball. And Davis' rebounding does look very solid. Davis did foul Shaq once and send him to the line, the most effective defense on Shaq quite often. And Dale Davis had a body on the guy, making him work, a large percentage of the time. Shaq did look like he got tired at the end of the 3rd quarter, so maybe things were working at least ok.

And here is a thought. With Davis giving us depth, the way to beat Miami is to simply let Darko come in to guard Shaq, and stay on him until Darko fouls out. Even if this means sitting Ben or Sheed real early. Now once Darko fouls out, Sheed and Ben take turns guarding Shaq. They will of course get into foul trouble but Davis then comes into the picture and we are ok.

I closely watched Arroyo's decision making. The best yet this preseason. We started the 4th at an 11 for 14 clip with Arroyo continually making sharp, quick decisions. His nice pass to Dyess for a score inside was the icing on the cake. (One of three buckets Dyess got in quick order off passes from Arroyo. Lots of people noticed the good connection last season.)

Delfino is just plain looking good out there. The scary thing is that this is just preseason and Delfino is nowhere near mid-season form, especially having just come off an injury.

I predict we will see more of Maxiell the next couple of games as Sheed has some tendinitis going on in the knee. (Or maybe Dale Davis will get extensive burn.)

Amir Johnson very impressively took down an offensive rebound. (One of three bounds in his 4 minutes.) The other team had a body on him, or two. But he waited until just the right moment, shot up and snatched that puppy with perfect timing. Despite being bodied up, he kept moving toward that rebound. Showed no fear of mixing up inside to get a bound.

The Heat never played without either Wade or Shaq in the 2nd quarter. We used all bench players and held our own. In the 4th, some starters played into the 4th, but soon it was our usual bench of Arroyo, Delfino, Evans, Dyess, and Darko. This was now vs. their bench. Payton, Kapono, Posey, Haslem, Mourning. Our bench slaughtered theirs. No contest. They might have got, what 2 buckets as we ran the lead to about 22.

Scouting Miami a bit. Yes, Walker still loves to shoot too much. But Shaq wants all the shots. But Williams wants all the shots. But Wade wants all the shots. Result? Shaq gets his shots and the rest of them throw up a crazy shot once in a while thinking they got to get theirs. No movement when Shaq has the ball. And the least impressive guy out there is Posey. Showed nothing.

Our starters look pretty darn good. They had about a 21-14 lead when a couple of our starters came off the floor. Sheed does an amazing job keeping Walker from scoring anything. Posey is nothing vs. Tay, on either end. Rip scored well while staying on Wade very well. CB is still knocking down threes and getting inside, despite nursing that sore back. Ben on Shaq? Not pretty. In a close game, Ben must refrain from shooting any shots away from the basket. We can't afford it. Crowd, never cheer for Ben to shoot that long shot. He is going to miss it far too often.

I didn't take what you said too hard, because WE say "We won, we aquired, we let go, Our bench is getting better", and things like that when we really don't give any physical contribution. But what we are, are good fans. In saying that, I am a fan of this site. So, are we getting bored with the preseason??
By "we" I (mis?)understood you to be asking why "we" are not kicking out the def jams for this game. If we can get enough people contributing to every game, we will have amazing content almost daily.

I don't think people are bored with the preseason yet. It's just very time consuming to get video and write recaps.

No hard feelings bro.

. . . say, "WOW", when Delfino skied for the putback on the missed free throw? :eyebrows: I thought that was pretty neat. He was impressed.

And I agree; Shaq wasted some of his millions by taking less to get more guys. They still can play only five at a time and their five can't match ours. :peace: No way! No time! They cannot beat us in a series.

just got around to watching it now. i don't think evans did a bad job on wade, he got physical with him and made him uncomfortable. wade didn't really show up for the game now...he looks lost. i think wade wants the ball in his hands and to be a PG, but now they have jwilliams and gpayton for that, and wade doesn't know what to do. it looks like the heat added players without any thought of the positions they'd play, time they shared on the court, etc.

whenever shaq had the ball the heat stopped moving around. posey and williams were nothing special, and walker just got abused by rasheed. complete mismatch come playoff time with those two. darko played good D on sheed and had that sweet slam over mourning, delfino finally got his free throw putback, and mcdyess was nailin down jumpers with ease.

most impressively our bench outscored there's something like 41-15. almost half our total points from the bench, nice. davis did great rebounding. not much else to say.

did he say And "Mo Evans" would be the one left off the roster. One ESPN guy thinks he might win 6th man award. Maybe I read it wrong, it is after midnight.

lee, couldn't see the game in LA but I think you got it right about guarding Shaq--maybe do it by committee. Not good news about Evans on Wade. I hope that he can guard Wade some. But if he can't, you are right, Hunter would probably come back.

did he say And "Mo Evans" would be the one left off the roster. One ESPN guy thinks he might win 6th man award. Maybe I read it wrong, it is after midnight.

Mo Evans is definently on the roster.

No WAY Lee, Evans is as good as in PERIOD! He clearly will be one of the bright spots off of our bench this season. Indeed his defense on wade was a bit disappointing but it wasn't hardly bad enough to where he would ever be considered off the playoff roster... Come on dude, cut out the overexaggerations and getting so far ahead of yourself. As a guy who played in the west last season he likely isn't as used to dealing with wade like rip and others are just yet. Not to mention with that second unit wade was a lot more assertive, where as while shaq was in the line up with him he didn't seem very interested in even shooting the ball as ole #40 Bill Laimbeer pointed out all night. Anyway I'm not going to judge the kid just yet from one measely pre-season game and just assume he has no defensive ability. I say give the kid a chance, especially to get used to a guy like d. wade before just writing him off like that.

Honestly I remember a time where d. wade often gave our own specialist Lindsey Hunter the business as well, however the veteran learned from those mistakes and now defends him a lot better on most nights.

Man, am I ever disappointed in Evans as far as his ability to cover Wade. Just flat out none. Now, Wade only shot 4-11 in the game, but he got to the free throw a ton vs. Evans. We are simply lucky Wade could not hit a free throw. Anyway, every time Wade made any move on Evans, he lost Evans instantly. Way too easy. On the other hand, Evans did manage to stay physical with Wade quite a lot. Maybe this helped some? Its a stretch. Right now I say cut Dupree and get Hunter ready to play against Miami. (This assumes Miami is still seen as a threat-they do have issues. And the problem is that if we keep Hunter for the playoffs, we have to leave a pretty darn good player off the roster. And its probably Mo Evans believe it or not.)

good analysis...but Mo Evans off the roster...HUH???????

No way. Mo is here to stay. Actually I liked when Rip gaurded Wade because Rip is the fastest guy in the nba, and he's got the best endurance so Wade couldn't shake him off like other players plus since rip never gets tired he'll still be effective offensively/

We only get 12 guys on the roster. Mo Evans was brought here partially at least to guard Wade. If he can't do the job, and Hunter can, then maybe Hunter replaces Mo Evans on the playoff roster. Anyway, its not enough to suggest that I am wrong. You got to give your own alternative about who gets left off the roster for Hunter. We only get 12 guys. Acker and Maxiell are pretty darn good players. I say no way Evans beats either of these guys out for a spot on that 12 man roster. Not unless he ends up doing a better job guarding Wade. Its just one game. Four more to go in the regular season before a choice has to be made.

I'll take you up on that, even though the idea of trying to develop a roster for the playoffs prior to the first regular season game seems, at best, premature.

Ben, 'Sheed, Tay, Rip, Chauncey, Dyess, Darko, Delfino, Evans, Arroyo, Davis, Hunter

Off the roster would be the three rookies (assuming Acker beats out Dupree, which is not a given right now).

I know you like Maxiell (I do too) but Ben, 'Sheed, Dyess, Darko, and Davis should provide plenty of depth at the 4/5.

I really expect J-Max to get a lot more playing time next year.

What happened to all the people calling for Delfino to be dropped? A couple of average games made up for everything?

As much as I like our draft picks I think they'll be left watching this year.
Everyone being healthy, I'd be hapy with Dyess, Davis, Evans, Arroyo, and Hunter
with Darko and Delfino too. It will be tough enough to develop darko and delfino while integrating Evans and Davis.

There was the arguement made that the pistons could have developed Darko while preserving their championship run. To me that has to happen this year. Delfino too. I think these two have the ability to make the bench something special. But its something you have to invest in. spread the minutes too thin and you underdevelop everyone.

I liked Rip on Wade. I am interested to see the matchup zone on miami. Also, reading the miami recaps, wade is playing off the ball a lot. With the ball in GP's or Jwill's hands, I think evans could make it difficult for them to get wade the ball.

What happened to all the people calling for Delfino to be dropped? A couple of average games made up for everything?
Delfino is on probation with me. I never doubted he could play. I doubted how much he wanted to be a Piston after all the things that came out in the latin press.

As long as he shuts up and plays his game, he's ok with me. The first time I read an article about him complaining about ANYTHING in Detroit, he can go join Rodney and Rufus in Clipperland.

What happened to all the people calling for Delfino to be dropped? A couple of average games made up for everything?
Maybe they're eating little crow appetizers.
I never knew what the fuss was over CD. The guy looked promising before the knee injury. What was the problem? He didn't come back quick enough? For what? to sit next to darko? I've had high hopes for Delfino. Just nothing to talk about. I hope this season will change that.

As long as he shuts up and plays his game, he's ok with me. The first time I read an article about him complaining about ANYTHING in Detroit, he can go join Rodney and Rufus in Clipperland.
I doubt you will. I think he was lashing at LB.

I doubt you will. I think he was lashing at LB.
I'm not worried about my integrity being called into question. I've always owned up when I am wrong and dispatched the necessary apologies.

Just the same, we "apparently" had a roster full of disgruntled players who were not crying to the press. Not Darko. Not Arroyo. Either of them could have given an off the cuff "pregnant dog session" by phone to their home media outlets.

They didn't and I respect them for that. Just like I respect Ben for not openly campaigning against the Cola.

If he did it once, thats one thing. But he did it twice and thats embarassing. Embarassing to the fans, the franchise and JD. It's what LB did on a lesser scale and from a guy without the credentials to back it up.

If he can keep the "I'll play for Real Madrid" quotes out of the press this playoffs, I am a Delfino fan.

There is a player performance prediction thread which I believe Micro said he would be stickying after the preseason. There, anyone who cares to, can write down their predictions on how each player will do. Me, I am going to add a guess at the playoff roster at that time. Just something fun to do. Something to talk about.

The vibes I am getting from what I am reading is that Hunter will retire. However, it makes me nervous seeing Hunter retire with no proven replacement to guard Wade. Anyhow, most likely, it will be Maxiell, not Hunter, on that playoff roster, and we will do just fine.

Now, Maxiell does give you foul proof depth at the 4/5. Not that he can play the 5 really, but him playing 4 with one of Davis, Darko, Sheed, Ben, and Sheed playing the 5 is an option. So he really does give us great depth at big man. But that is not why I want him on the roster so much. Its more I want to see him become a small forward, like Corliss, capable of flat out abusing the opposing small forward. I believe if we did have Hunter on the squad, Maxiell would be more of an asset than Evans. This is my prediction. Got a whole season to look at whats going on. To me, getting these issues out there just makes it that more interesting following how the season goes.

I can see it now. Lindsey Hunter retires and you write.."As you know, Ive always been one of Hunter's biggest supporters..."

No, that would not be true at all. Although I have been a fan of Hunters for a long, long time, I did not have much faith in him for much of last year, and I was pretty verbal about it. He proved me wrong toward the end of the year, and did an amazing job guarding Wade in the Miami series.

This does not mean I won't hope the Pistons find a good replacement for Hunter, one who can play D like Hunter (or at least somewhere close) and also hit shots. And preferrably, help run the offense.

Evans was brought aboard to play defense, and he can shoot too. But he does nothing to help run the offense. At least not yet. But Evans is just a 2nd year player really so we can hope at least. Meanwhile, his first game as a Piston against Wade did not go that well at all, in my opinion. Evans does not seem the greatest option at this time to replace Hunter.

I will add something to this discussion though. Hunter often played with the starters when guarding Wade. Ben Wallace was often backing him up. I would like to see Evans guard Wade while playing with the starting unit. (Or maybe with Prince, Maxiell, Ben, and Darko in the game with him.)

I'm not worried about my integrity being called into question. I've always owned up when I am wrong and dispatched the necessary apologies.


If he did it once, thats one thing. But he did it twice and thats embarassing. Embarassing to the fans, the franchise and JD. It's what LB did on a lesser scale and from a guy without the credentials to back it up.


I was simply saying that I believe the source of CD's bad attitude is not here anymore hence no foreign press drama. I don't question your integrity or your judgement. Its all just opinion anyway. Well, I'll save you a seat on the Delfino bandwagon. We roll right behind the Milicic wagon...caravan style. toot toot!

toot toot!
Thanks for the laugh. :D

What happened to all the people calling for Delfino to be dropped? A couple of average games made up for everything?
people are realizing that the problem with our bench was lb not the guys on the bench. isn't it weird we boosted our bench by get (http://www.pbase.com/jason_ramon/pistons_vs_heat)ting rid of 1 person??? a few people have realized that delfino would have been nice to have on the playoff roster instead of darvin ham. also his game against the heat wasn't average at all. he's playing great and contributing off the bench. he's dropping more dimes than our backup point guard and he's hitting the boards too. he's also the only guy driving to the hole and causing problems and he's not longer a defensive liability.

he also had that sweet tip dunk against miami. even shaq was impressed how can you not be. here are some pics of the game. i was wayyyyy up at the top so i couldn't use flash. the pics turned out pretty good. i was happy it was my first game at the palace. the last pistons game i saw in person was at the silverdome.

http://www.pbase.com/jason_ramon/pistons_vs_heat

I'm not worried about my integrity being called into question. I've always owned up when I am wrong and dispatched the necessary apologies.

Just the same, we "apparently" had a roster full of disgruntled players who were not crying to the press. Not Darko. Not Arroyo. Either of them could have given an off the cuff "pregnant dog session" by phone to their home media outlets.

They didn't and I respect them for that. Just like I respect Ben for not openly campaigning against the Cola.

If he did it once, thats one thing. But he did it twice and thats embarassing. Embarassing to the fans, the franchise and JD. It's what LB did on a lesser scale and from a guy without the credentials to back it up.

If he can keep the "I'll play for Real Madrid" quotes out of the press this playoffs, I am a Delfino fan.

his coach showed him that complaining to the press was the best way to communicate. if the leader isn't doing things in house why should carlos be held to those standards. i respect carlos for fighting back against the tyrant. does anybody have a clip of carlos cussing lb out that one game???

does anybody have a clip of carlos cussing lb out that one game???
Hit up FreshPrince22 nicely and he may be able to supply it. He's the video guru.

I don't think that its all "the unnameable one's" fault. Delfino needed to recover. Milicic needed time to develop which he never had until this off-season.
It would have sucked if he stayed and it was the same dog and pony show.

I agree with you, though, LB did a lot of talking in the press that made a lot of people go :confused: and then :P . It wasn't right for CD to do that too but hey it wasn't a capital offense. A LOT of people were calling for CD head.

Although I agree that LB didn't utilize the players we had on the bench as much as he should have, Delfino's problem last year (apart from his attitude) was that he was injured. He is a completely different player right now from the one he was three months ago now that he's had a chance to build up the strength in his knee. So to argue he should have had Ham's spot last year rings pretty false. Everyone knows he couldn't have contributed much for us in the postseason last year.

As for me, I was one of the biggest Delfino bashers last year for the same reasons Micro listed. Regardless of the problems he had with LB, he didn't have the right, especially as a rookie, to spout off the way he did. Darko had more reason to go off in public at LB and didn't. I also questioned Delfino's toughness.

At this point, I'm willing to give him a second chance with a new coach. The fact is that he has some skills that no one else on the team really offers (especially his ability to take the ball to the hoop), and can be a valuable asset for us. Hopefully he's learned a few things from his experience last year.

http://www.pbase.com/jason_ramon/pistons_vs_heat

what the hell is that your name? mine's exactly the same except swap the A and the O in your last name LOL

what the hell is that your name? mine's exactly the same except swap the A and the O in your last name LOL

nope. ramon is my middle name. don't want my identity stolen so i don't use my last name :eyebrows: it sucks to have such a common first name. when i went to school there would be at least 3 jasons in every grade.

nope. ramon is my middle name. don't want my identity stolen so i don't use my last name :eyebrows:

Don't worry, we've got Warthog's now so yours is safe. :laugh:

We only get 12 guys on the roster. Mo Evans was brought here partially at least to guard Wade. If he can't do the job, and Hunter can, then maybe Hunter replaces Mo Evans on the playoff roster. Anyway, its not enough to suggest that I am wrong. You got to give your own alternative about who gets left off the roster for Hunter. We only get 12 guys. Acker and Maxiell are pretty darn good players. I say no way Evans beats either of these guys out for a spot on that 12 man roster. Not unless he ends up doing a better job guarding Wade. Its just one game. Four more to go in the regular season before a choice has to be made.

He can give us a lot of bench points in the playoffs though, and Wade was 3-11 ao you can't say evans did bad even though rip gaurded him too.

people are realizing that the problem with our bench was lb not the guys on the bench. isn't it weird we boosted our bench by get (http://www.pbase.com/jason_ramon/pistons_vs_heat)ting rid of 1 person??? a few people have realized that delfino would have been nice to have on the playoff roster instead of darvin ham. also his game against the heat wasn't average at all. he's playing great and contributing off the bench. he's dropping more dimes than our backup point guard and he's hitting the boards too. he's also the only guy driving to the hole and causing problems and he's not longer a defensive liability.

he also had that sweet tip dunk against miami. even shaq was impressed how can you not be. here are some pics of the game. i was wayyyyy up at the top so i couldn't use flash. the pics turned out pretty good. i was happy it was my first game at the palace. the last pistons game i saw in person was at the silverdome.

http://www.pbase.com/jason_ramon/pistons_vs_heat

Nice game pics...and excellent site I might add. Well done.

I will be one of the first to admit that you never soured on Delfino. I've been impressed with what I've "heard" so far (since I haven't been able to catch any preseason games yet) and I can't wait to see one half of Los Dos go to work. The Brown "stifle talent" opinion is a very interesting one. Unfortunately, I think it is a question we will never truely have an answer for as we have never seen how a young player develops under his tutelage. Brown normally leaves a coaching situation before we can see the fruit of his labors. He just might be the Clint Eastwood "Million Dollar Baby" coach who cripples his young players and prevents them from reaching the next level. One thing is for certain, he definitely has a talent for making a moderate team good and a good team great.

I can see it now. Lindsey Hunter retires and you write.."As you know, Ive always been one of Hunter's biggest supporters..."

ROTFLMAO, LMAO!!!!!!

Although I agree that LB didn't utilize the players we had on the bench as much as he should have, Delfino's problem last year (apart from his attitude) was that he was injured. He is a completely different player right now from the one he was three months ago now that he's had a chance to build up the strength in his knee. So to argue he should have had Ham's spot last year rings pretty false. Everyone knows he couldn't have contributed much for us in the postseason last year.

As for me, I was one of the biggest Delfino bashers last year for the same reasons Micro listed. Regardless of the problems he had with LB, he didn't have the right, especially as a rookie, to spout off the way he did. Darko had more reason to go off in public at LB and didn't. I also questioned Delfino's toughness.

At this point, I'm willing to give him a second chance with a new coach. The fact is that he has some skills that no one else on the team really offers (especially his ability to take the ball to the hoop), and can be a valuable asset for us. Hopefully he's learned a few things from his experience last year.

The above highlighted quote says it all for me, the dude was flat out WAY out of line... ESPECIALLY AS A ROOKIE ACTING OUT LIKE THAT!!! Even his own fellow countrymen (Nocioni, and Ginobli) reprimanded him for those immature statements. Even a blind man could see from pre-season last season and before the injury that the kid could flat out play, but no man is above the law folks especially on a veteran squad like ours!
With that said you can just look at #20's frame and see how much better shape he's in coming into this season. Just by looking at him he appears a bit more chisled and likely no longer 230ishlbs. He no doubt brings a LOT of talents & skills we could use therefore as long as he continues to act like he wants to be a Detroit Piston he is fine by me.

GO PISTONS!!!!!!

Nice game pics...and excellent site I might add. Well done.

I will be one of the first to admit that you never soured on Delfino. I've been impressed with what I've "heard" so far (since I haven't been able to catch any preseason games yet) and I can't wait to see one half of Los Dos go to work. The Brown "stifle talent" opinion is a very interesting one. Unfortunately, I think it is a question we will never truely have an answer for as we have never seen how a young player develops under his tutelage. Brown normally leaves a coaching situation before we can see the fruit of his labors. He just might be the Clint Eastwood "Million Dollar Baby" coach who cripples his young players and prevents them from reaching the next level. One thing is for certain, he definitely has a talent for making a moderate team good and a good team great.

thanks.

you are correct brown can make a moderate team into a good one. he also made our great team even better. but develop talent and leaving a franchise in a better state than he got it isn't one of larry's strong points. he normally leaves a coaching situation after his tinkering has caused the ship to sink. then the young players bolt for other teams. joe dumars didn't allow this he's a great gm. we got the championship and we still have the young players and healthy franchise.

The above highlighted quote says it all for me, the dude was flat out WAY out of line... ESPECIALLY AS A ROOKIE ACTING OUT LIKE THAT!!! Even his own fellow countrymen (Nocioni, and Ginobli) reprimanded him for those immature statements. Even a blind man could see from pre-season last season and before the injury that the kid could flat out play, but no man is above the law folks especially on a veteran squad like ours!
With that said you can just look at #20's frame and see how much better shape he's in coming into this season. Just by looking at him he appears a bit more chisled and likely no longer 230ishlbs. He no doubt brings a LOT of talents & skills we could use therefore as long as he continues to act like he wants to be a Detroit Piston he is fine by me.

GO PISTONS!!!!!!

no man is above the law. guess who got kicked out of town?? it wasn't the loudmouth rookie. it wasn't the young player that kept his mouth shut. it wasn't the olympic player that kept his mouth shut.

we already got rid of the guy that wasn't acting like he wanted to be a detroit piston.