@ The Palace
8:00 PM
FSN Detroit, ESPN

A likely 1st round opponent... a game full of sidebars

http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/7255/expistonspq1.jpg

@ The Palace
8:00 PM
FSN Detroit, ESPN

A likely 1st round opponent... a game full of sidebars

http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/7255/expistonspq1.jpg


What a fun series that would be. Probably more competitive than people think.
I can almost hear the banter now! :whoosh2:

Sidebar #1
If Indiana gains just one game over the Magic before the playoffs that could make our pick # 12 instead of #15 (currently)... by being out of the playoffs they would pick ahead of Golden State, New Orleans & Atlanta ( Atlanta owns the Pacers pick).

This one game on Wednesday could have a long term effect.

A new fondness of the Pacers:inlove:
:puke:

Sidebar #2
As DRE pointed out the "Magic" number is 2... maybe wrap up HCA Wednesday and start the bench observations (Amir?)

The Magic had 15 dunks against Memphis yesterday!

Dwight Howard was +39 on the night (+21 in the 1st quarter)!


I have no real point. Just eye popping stats in a blow-out.


Indiana making the playoffs would be be hilarious. We will have the honor of putting the final nail in their coffin before things get real ugly over there.

Orlando April 11 8PM

tv: FSN/ESPN

Last game of the seasonal series as the Pistons try for a sweep over a potential 1st round matchup.

Time to give the starters a rest. Nobody plays for more than 22 minutes......:hoops:

Gotta pin a loss on the Magic. It could mean the difference between picking 12th and 15th in the draft.

I amost wish we could go back and lose a game to Indiana in order to help our draft position.

If the Magic are indeed the Pistons first round opponent, do not give them any false hope that they can beat us or they can even steal one game in the post season. On the other hand, don't show them all of your cards either.

Magic had 16 dunks last night. Howard-5, Milicic-3, Ariza-3, Battie-3, Dooling-1, and Turk-1.

32 points in the paint right there.

Again, my only point is that they dunk the ball a lot.


In comparison, even with all the posterizations going down, the Pistons only had 6.


So, what's the key to beating the Magic? Foul the bejeezus out of Dwight Howard. Sounds like a job for Dale Davis.

Darko had 3 blocks, but how many other dunks did he have blocked by the rim? :stirthepot:

Darko had 3 blocks, but how many other dunks did he have blocked by the rim? :stirthepot:

Darko is shooting well over 50 per cent on his dunks. When he goes up for a dunk now, more often than not he might make it. The ones he misses are usually very close to going in.

Darko had 3 blocks, but how many other dunks did he have blocked by the rim? :stirthepot:

He only had 1 block, but had a rare 100% shooting night.

32 Darko points in only 24 minutes of action.


Also, just to clarify, Darko is converting 96% of his dunks.
Darko Milicic of the Orlando Magic, NBA player stats and data from 82games.com (http://www.82games.com/0607/06ORL14A.HTM)

Dwight Howard is at 93%.
Sheed = 92%.
JMax = 80%.

I meant dunk, not block. I'm not feeling myself today. Low blood pressure in my legs.

I meant dunk, not block. I'm not feeling myself today. Low blood pressure in my legs.


Dunks...blocks...same difference...when it comes to Darko... just being close counts.:stirthepot:

He only had 1 block, but had a rare 100% shooting night.

32 Darko points in only 24 minutes of action.


Also, just to clarify, Darko is converting 96% of his dunks.
Darko Milicic of the Orlando Magic, NBA player stats and data from 82games.com (http://www.82games.com/0607/06ORL14A.HTM)

Dwight Howard is at 93%.
Sheed = 92%.
JMax = 80%.

Yeah...that was just off the top of my head but I knew he was over 50 %.....

It's also a little interesting that Darko has not been blocked on a single dunk attempt yet this year... yet y'all are joking about it.

Dwight Howard and Sheed have been blocked on 3% of their attempts.

I'm telling ya, the only reason I get caught up defending this guy is because of all the bad stats that get thrown out there by people making fun of him.

I'm telling ya, the only reason I get caught up defending this guy is because of all the bad stats that get thrown out there by people making fun of him.
That's ironic because I get caught up in all of the bad stats defending him. lol

I don't think 82games tracks blocks by the rim, so I would question those #s TaS.

That's ironic because I get caught up in all of the bad stats defending him. lol

I don't think 82games tracks blocks by the rim, so I would question those #s TaS.

Where do they track them? By the 3-point line?

And who has more dunks this year, Sheed or Darko? That's right, although Sheed has played 28% more minutes, he has 20% less dunks.

I'm just a little disgruntled still that our bust is providing more muscle (dunks, points in the paint, rebounding, and blocks) than our All Star PF.


Sheed better flip the switch in the Playoffs, that's all I'm saying.

I feel ya bro.

Man i wish we could get Dwight Howard. Oh, I must have been dreaming, lmao. :pray:

Magic had 16 dunks last night. Howard-5, Milicic-3, Ariza-3, Battie-3, Dooling-1, and Turk-1.

32 points in the paint right there.

Again, my only point is that they dunk the ball a lot.


In comparison, even with all the posterizations going down, the Pistons only had 6.


So, what's the key to beating the Magic? Foul the bejeezus out of Dwight Howard. Sounds like a job for Dale Davis.

Howard ain't none too good at the line, and we do have even Mohammed over on the bench to lay fouls on the big guy. Another strategy is to go after him on the offense. CWEBB and Sheed between them should be able to get it done. Live inside.

About those dunks by Darko. Milwaukee had most all their bigs out injured. The one they had left, after some foul trouble depleted them even more, they had to put on Howard, leaving Darko defended by a tall shooting gaurd. Orlando went to Darko several straight times at that point, and put the game away exploiting this mismatch. PS, Darko has shot two jumpers in the last two games. Swish, swish. You do have to play him on the perimeter.

What the s**t....

I have not been paying much attention to Darko.

He has modest but ok stats for 24 MPG

8.0 PPG 5.5 RPG 1.1 APG 1.7 BPG 1.57 TO he only shoots 0.449% with 0.614% from the line.

I just thought of a new stat.

The average number of minutes it would take a player to get a triple-double.

Jason Kidd: 45 minutes
Chauncey: 108 minutes
Rip: 98 minutes
Sheed: 185 minutes
Darko: 141 minutes

That's ironic because I get caught up in all of the bad stats defending him. lol

I don't think 82games tracks blocks by the rim, so I would question those #s TaS.
yeah. jmax has a couple of those. they don't track his either.

I just thought of a new stat.

The average number of minutes it would take a player to get a triple-double.

Jason Kidd: 45 minutes
Chauncey: 108 minutes
Rip: 98 minutes
Sheed: 185 minutes
Darko: 141 minutes

what about quadruple double?? i have darko on my fantasy team and i think he would be pretty high on that list. he racks up the points, steals, blocks, rebounds.

what about quadruple double?? i have darko on my fantasy team and i think he would be pretty high on that list. he racks up the points, steals, blocks, rebounds.

how far did that you get you this year? :stirthepot:

Same as me: in the non-winners pile.

how far did that you get you this year? :stirthepot:
not far but i won't hesitate to draft him again next year. he provides more than ben wallace though. darko wasn't my downfall in fantasy leagues anyway. this was my first year and i was much too balanced instead of focusing on winning certain categories. this was darko's first real year playing and it was my first real year playing fantasy basketball. me and darko's career will grow together.

this was darko's first real year playing and it was my first real year playing fantasy basketball. me and darko's career will grow together.

Did you bleach your hair and go with the earring?

http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/7901/sgejum81030906130331photp3.jpg

http://img292.imageshack.us/img292/1872/nba290104yg4.jpg

http://img409.imageshack.us/img409/381/outlawchatyg1.jpg

not far but i won't hesitate to draft him again next year. he provides more than ben wallace though. darko wasn't my downfall in fantasy leagues anyway. this was my first year and i was much too balanced instead of focusing on winning certain categories. this was darko's first real year playing and it was my first real year playing fantasy basketball. me and darko's career will grow together.

Jay.

I'm not trying to be mean or critical. I'm trying to help you here.

Your team was 63-123-3.

You ended up 57.5 games out of first place and were in dead last. The next closest person to you was 13 games ahead of you.

Your problem was not balance. Your problem was having a bunch of guys who had "potential" but very few proven players. The only balance you had was that you were weak in every single category.

Go ahead and draft Darko next year but do NOT waste your first round (second overall) pick on him like you did this year. Draft him a few rounds later if you really want him. He should still be there for you.

I'm glad you had fun in the league, but it's a lot more fun when you field a competitive team.

not far but i won't hesitate to draft him again next year. he provides more than ben wallace though. darko wasn't my downfall in fantasy leagues anyway. this was my first year and i was much too balanced instead of focusing on winning certain categories. this was darko's first real year playing and it was my first real year playing fantasy basketball. me and darko's career will grow together.

Drafting him first buried you, Ben was a better fantasy basketball player this year, and I have no doubt that you will get better. To be a good fantasy bball GM requires alot of attention to detail. You excel in that area. Good luck next year. Just don't let your love for your fav get in the way of your drafting. Had I done that, my squad would have been Pistons only and I would have surely been creamed by the competiton.

Jay.

I'm not trying to be mean or critical. I'm trying to help you here.

Your team was 63-123-3.

You ended up 57.5 games out of first place and were in dead last. The next closest person to you was 13 games ahead of you.

Your problem was not balance. Your problem was having a bunch of guys who had "potential" but very few proven players. The only balance you had was that you were weak in every single category.

Go ahead and draft Darko next year but do NOT waste your first round (second overall) pick on him like you did this year. Draft him a few rounds later if you really want him. He should still be there for you.

I'm glad you had fun in the league, but it's a lot more fun when you field a competitive team.


I know this was meant to be supportive, but you have the subtlty of a train ramming into a house of cards and the sarcasm of a hundred starving comics. :pound:

I know this was meant to be supportive, but you have the subtlty of a train ramming into a house of cards and the sarcasm of a hundred starving comics. :pound:

I'm working on it Mo.:sssh: These things take time.:)

Anyone care to throw a score out there?

I'll go with 100-88 Pistons.

Darko - 8 pts 5 rebs 1 stl 1 block 2 assists

Orlando wins 105-99.......Darko has 17 points, 11 rebounds............and I don't like him..............

Go ahead and draft Darko next year but do NOT waste your first round (second overall) pick on him like you did this year. Draft him a few rounds later if you really want him. He should still be there for you.

I'm glad you had fun in the league, but it's a lot more fun when you field a competitive team.

fantasy basketball represents something else to me. it's not fantasy basketball if i don't have darko on my team. i drafted him second because i would have had to pay high prices in trades to get him because everyone in my league knew he was my guy.

win or lose darko's my boy. i disagree about my picks though. i drafted great picks but i didn't trade and pick up free agents well. i'll do better next year.

102 - 99 pistons.

darko 15 pts, 11 rebs, 2 assists, 1 steal, 3 blocks. 2008 fantasy stud.

fantasy basketball represents something else to me. it's not fantasy basketball if i don't have darko on my team. i drafted him second because i would have had to pay high prices in trades to get him because everyone in my league knew he was my guy.

win or lose darko's my boy. i disagree about my picks though. i drafted great picks but i didn't trade and pick up free agents well. i'll do better next year.

102 - 99 pistons.

darko 15 pts, 11 rebs, 2 assists, 1 steal, 3 blocks. 2008 fantasy stud.

Maybe 16 mile would have grabbed him, but otherwise you could have waited. I'm pretty sure nobody would take him out of spite or to rob you later. I think Darko was ranked around number 100. (I could be mistaken). I also think I was going to draft him at around #80 (which was too high as it turns out). Anyhow, my point is that you still prolly would have got him plus had some studs to surround him with.

I understand you drafting Darko a bit higher than he's projected just to make sure you get him, but you're paying too much. I drafted a couple of Phillies in baseball a few picks higher than they were "worth", but by that I mean maybe 7 or 10 picks. Not 7 or 10 rounds.

But like you say...if that's what makes your season it's cool. As long as you have fun that's what counts in the end.

fantasy basketball represents something else to me. it's not fantasy basketball if i don't have darko on my team. i drafted him second because i would have had to pay high prices in trades to get him because everyone in my league knew he was my guy.

yeah but no one would have taken him in the first 5 rounds, so you would have been safe not taking him first.

For those of you that still don't believe the Magic are limiting Darko's minutes to keep his contract value down, please take a look at the following and realize that Battie "won" back his starting job:

Games with double digit scoring: Battie 13, Darko 28

Games with double digit rebounding: Battie 6, Darko 7
Games with at least 7 rebounds: Battie 17, Darko 26

Games with at least 1 assist: Battie 23, Darko 49
Games with 2 or more assists: Battie 6, Darko 20
Games with 3 or more assists: Battie 0, Darko 10

Games with at least 1 shot block: Battie 20, Darko 62
Games with 2 or more shot blocks: Battie 6, Darko 39
Games with 3 or more shot blocks: Battie 1, Darko 22

It's not because of foul trouble, as both players average 2.8 PF in 24MPG.

It's not because of FG%, because in the last 30 games (since Darko got his starts), Darko's FG% has been 49.5% (on par with Dyess, who leads the Pistons).

Turnovers? Battie's ast to turnover ratio is .54 while Darko's is .70

Must be the intangibles.

If you believe the Pistons are hiding Amir Johnson, then you must be open to the idea that the Magic are hiding DM. After all, there is a lot more $ at stake in his case than Johnson's. And Orlando knows that they don't have a shot at the Championship this year, so they don't have much to lose.

Honestly, I could care less. Just another season that does nothing but keep the question jar open for Darko. I'm just glad we are no longer the ones wondering if this caterpillar will ever change into a butterfly. I also get the feeling that Orlando is alot further away from being championship calibur than I gave them credit for at the beginning of the season. Darko isn't their savior.

I'm just glad we are no longer the ones wondering if this caterpillar will ever change into a butterfly.

The change happened too gradually for most people to notice. He's already taken flight.

Before, it was all potential, cause he didn't have the consistent PT to get comfortable.

Right now, all you have to do is look at actual performance. What is the worst part of his game? 3 months ago, I would have said FG%. Since then, it has become the best part of his game.

I also get the feeling that Orlando is alot further away from being championship calibur than I gave them credit for at the beginning of the season. Darko isn't their savior.

Let's see...

- they don't have a guard who could start for any other team in the league

- they have a big man who would rather dunk than win

- they have Hill who can't carry a team, and Darko who might one day, but they won't let him play.

Clearly a team the evil twin Pistons could manage to lose to.

I want to see Dale Davis get some burn in these final 6 games. He looked scare to touch the ball last game. He needs to get that confidence back and give us some more muscle. He's a perfect role player for the Playoffs.

In this game i look for the bench to play a little more especially in the first 3 quarters. Then I expcect Flip to integrate more of the starters at the end to salvage this game against a team we are more thatn likely to face in the 1st round. Can't give this team any kind of confidence going into the 1st round.

Since we have reached this plateau once again as far as 50 wins i really believe Flip should flirt with different rotations and focus on fundamentals before the playoffs as oppose to padding our record. Yes, I said it fundamentals such as rotating on D. contesting every shot, and last but certainly not least defensive rebounding. I believe that emphasizing these things will be the difference as far as advancing in the playoffs. I really hope we learned from last years debacle.

Jay was in a terrible place picking 2nd. He knew there were a few others picking down the line that would grab him with their 2nd picks (at least) before the position snaked back to him.

Darko was a good sleeper pick that didn't really pan out this season but he's going to be a hot commodity next season. I'd certainly go after him. IMO, he needs to work on his conditioning. He IS exciting to watch though. He's so agile.

This game is as important as the Cleveland game. We shouldn't be tossing this one away.

Darko is a dream
Human Victory Cigar
40 minute stats

Honestly, I could care less. Just another season that does nothing but keep the question jar open for Darko. I'm just glad we are no longer the ones wondering if this caterpillar will ever change into a butterfly. I also get the feeling that Orlando is alot further away from being championship calibur than I gave them credit for at the beginning of the season. Darko isn't their savior.

yeah. it's better to watch when our aging big men legs turn into dust. i am happy if we get orlando in the first round. this will give pistons fan 4 or 5 games in a row to see him play. i think a lot of pistons fan feel because he was the # 2 pick that he should be dominant in a bench role when he gets about 5 -7 shots per game in a low post role which isn't his game. i want pistons fans to see the truth that by just being the player he is now he could have helped us win championships. no scoring title's, no all star nods just winning championships. it's not about the stats folk although darko is able to rack those up.

orlando is a head coach away from being one of the up and coming teams in the league. yes contending for a championship. watch b. hill and see how he subs and slows the game down. he has the wrong type of players for that system. imagine if you were coaching the magic what you would do different. your list would be very long.

I can't remember the last time we had this many posts in a game thread before the game started. Fantastic.

Now, who is doing recaps? bball jay? LA Dre? BillLaimbeer? Motown Pride? The Low? lapeapod?

i'll be at the game so if anything interesting happens, i'll let you know!!

I can't remember the last time we had this many posts in a game thread before the game started. Fantastic.

Now, who is doing recaps? bball jay? LA Dre? BillLaimbeer? Motown Pride? The Low? lapeapod?

I wouldn't touch this one with YOUR keyboard.

Chat is open!!!

http://www.pistonsforum.com/misc.php?do=flashchat

I only saw the second half. We came out slow, established some dominance and then let the Magic back into the game.

But per our style, the Pistons gutted out the win in the last couple minutes and we clinched the Eastern Conference home court.

That game felt like 4 games. It's like we had to win over and over again. I long for a day we maintain a lead . . .

Things that stood out to me in this game:

The Pistons offense came out on fire. They took a 34-21 1st quarter lead. They shot 16-for-21 in the 1st quarter. That is not a typo. That is 76%.
Billups is really bringing up his game at the right time. The guy shot 10-for-13, 3-for-4 three pointers, 5-for-5 FT, 4 reb, 8 ass, 2 steals and 28 points. This included a HUGE 3-pointer to ice the game.
McDyess has also been looking good lately. He plays solid interior defense and seems to hustle every minute he is on the floor. Tonight, he shot 6-for-9 and had 6 reb, 4 ass, 1 block and 14 points.
Dale Davis has looked remarkably well after taking a couple of months off. He was 2-for-2 with 5 reb, 1 ass, 1 block and 5 points in only 15 minutes.
Grant Hill showed me a lot more than I thought he had left in the tank. He drove to the hoop and ran the break several times. He shot 10-for-12, with 4 reb, 4 ass, 2 blocks and 22 points in 35 minutes. I would be surprised if he could put up anything close to these numbers in a playoff game against Detroit.

Yeah, that was a strange game. The Pistons started as well as they have all season, and it felt like it was going to be a complete blowout. But, of course, we couldn't maintain the focus and started toying with them a bit. Since they are an average NBA team, they were capable of getting hot and proceeded to do so. So they close the gap, then Chauncey steps on their throat. So they close the gap again and Chauncey stabs them in the heart... then he puts the nail in their camel's back and the fat lady faints.

Only 22 points from Howard + Battie + Darko. That was a testament to some great D from the Pistons' big men, Sheed, Dyess, Webber, and DAVIS. And as well as Darko has been playing lately, the Pistons clearly intimidate him a bit. Sheed treats him like a little brother. Webber plays keep away with him. And the crowd's taunts seem to make him flashback to the bombs falling in Yugoslavia, 1989.

In all fairness though, our bigs did as good a job on Howard as I've seen all year and pretty much made Battie a non factor on both ends too.


Jameer Nelson got hot, but in the grand scheme of things, he can't score when he's covered. So, they get close off his buckets and then we cover him, game over.

Fun game and I'm really looking forward to the next 5 garbage games to see how Saunders handles it. Bring out Super Dup.

Worst game I've seen from Rip in a long time.

Grant played well.

Webber makes Darko actually look like a Serbian gangster. Even after all these years he's still shying away from contact when he's supposed to be setting screens.

^

Yea, that Rip shot in the final 2 min was pretty bad. His shot selection has been off lately, and it seems like he's forgotten how to pass. I do like that we saw more catch-and-shoot from him today though.

Well we blew a 18 point lead due to slacking off of the defense, but still put it together the last 2 minutes to pull it out. Funny the Rockets had a 25 point lead in the third qtr over the Blazers and had to hold on to win by 4 points after the Blazers came back within 2 pts with less than a second left. So other teams have mental lapses too when challenged by bottom feeders.

Hopefully Billups isn't hurt since he suffered that knee or thigh mishap in the last minute or so. Him playing the entire second half of the games on Sunday and Monday may have been a bit much so I would probably play him sparingly in the remaining four games. Don't sit him as he needs to be sharp for the playsoffs and not rusty. I dont recomned slakig off just because we clinched. I think that was what the down fall last years collapse vs the Cavs.

The Home Court is now set for the east, but we still need to learn how to treat it as an advantage and win those remaining two home games vs Philly and the Raptors. After if we win every home game in the first three rounds, the trip to the finals is automatic.:cheerleader:

Brian Hill does not coach a very good game. Bad defenders start for him. The Pistons took advantage. Billups had a great night, but it was on shooting over a tiny player in Nelson who let Billups have any shot he cared to take.

Rip got his. Hill is so slow Rip did not even need picks to get separation. That by the way was the best offensive game from Hill this year. Something maybe about returning to the Palace fully healthy for the first time. But he can't play D.

Turk was in there, and he can't guard Tay, but we were too busy exploiting even bigger mismatches. We were still at 60% shooting at the half. A near 60 point first half. Against little resistance.

We had a lot of practice in the NY game double teaming and rotating to cover the open guy. That practice came in handy in this game, as again Detroit played greast team D against their post up game. (Lots of teams have done the same though as Battie does not need to be guarded. Another rather bizarre choice by Hill to let teams do that to him. If he does not like Darko, then Ariza could start. Battie is an ok bench player, but he kills Orlando's offense while not being that good on D to make up for it.

Darko had an ok game. Nothing much statistically, but he was in there playing fine D on one end and drawing multiple defenders on the other-even when he did not have the ball. Orlando caught back up with Darko in. Its no coincidence. Ditto for Ariza.

Dale Davis got three medium length stints in this game. Man, he owns the territory under the basket. He is there for the rebound, always. Nobody pushes him around. He does the pushing around. On one sequence, there he was, under the basket, drawing defenders, and he hand off to JMAX for a short jumper. Maybe 5 or 6 feet out. Two times before that there he was dunking the ball. Dale is very good basketball player; good to see him get minutes, especially knowing he can build on these minutes in the next 4 games as our starters rest.

Dyess helped in the first half hitting 5 of 5 midrangers. But drew no fouls doing so. In the 2nd half, when he missed a few, it helped Orlando get back in the game. That midranger from Dyess simply does not help us unless he hits nearly all of them. He must do damage inside as much as he can to go with the outside shooting; something that we can count on the whole game. Yes, he has done that in several games of late. Just need more of it rather than him falling in love with that fall-a-way.

Tay was passive in the first half. But hey, don't call it a problem. Remember, we shot 60% or so in the first half. Nothing wrong with our offense at all.

Sheed was set up really nice for that triple by Flip Murray, who drove in from the mid right, drew defenders, and kicked out to Sheed. Just before that he had a good feed inside to Dyess for a score. Thats nice, but you need more from a backup point than a couple of plays like that. Mostly, between Hunter and Murray, what you got was outside shots from the point guards. Hunter did make one. Backup point remains our weak spot.

Webber did not do much. Orlando's perimeter defense, from its starters, is shoddy, but Howard and company can play good interior D. Other than contributing a couple of fouls, and about what, 4 points, not much else.

Its great that we won the game and can play our young guys some now. But the win does nothing to address the backup point problem. Basically, we can expect very little rest for Billups in the playoffs. We just had better hope he stays healthy and out of foul trouble. I hate seeing us vulnerable like that.

Still special to be at the Palace as we clinched the East best record. And just maybe I got a good preview tonight of the first round. I do not plan to go to any playoff games this year. Just two more game, Philly, and Toronto, to get a good look at the kids play.

Delfino played some good D, helped handle the ball, but I don't remember him even taking a shot tonight. No 2nd half action. It does irk me some that Murray did get a couple of 2nd half minutes. I still don't think its right to favor a guy who got run out of the rotation over someone who has hung in there all season.

I believe we could have done a lot better in this game if the starters had not come back into the game to end the 2nd quarter. The bench, despite its flaws, was doing well enough. We had a lead. Leave them in. The starters can win in the 2nd half. Especially with some rest.

Of note, we got a good long look at Davis and Maxiell paired up together. Most excellent. Orlando soon learned that getting to the basket was impossible. And our perimeter defenders knew it too, and could play 100% for the shot. What a combination. Flip has to have been saving this for the playoffs. He could have chose not to use it tonight when we got into foul trouble on our front line, as Mohammed was available. All I can say is I loved seeing those two play defense together. Awesome.

I hope that Flip keeps an open mind these last four or five games. If he sees something he can use from the youngsters, he should use it in the playoffs. GO PISTONS!!!!!

Looking at the boxscore, I see I failed to mention the three triples by Tay. Two of them cominng back to back almost in the 2nd half.

But he can't play D.
Hill played excellent defense when he was assigned to Chauncey in the 4th quarter and did a decent job against Rip when he wasn't in a broken field.

Along with Dooling and Ariza, he was probably the only Orlando player who wasn't a complete liability on D.

Orlando wins 105-99.......Darko has 17 points, 11 rebounds............and I don't like him..............
__________________
Pretty close Nemo
TaS I don't know what the problem was but when Darko was starting and playing a lot, they lost. When Battie and Ariza came back they had a little more success. This team really fell on it's face as the season went on.

Hill played excellent defense when he was assigned to Chauncey in the 4th quarter and did a decent job against Rip when he wasn't in a broken field.

Along with Dooling and Ariza, he was probably the only Orlando player who wasn't a complete liability on D.

My comments came from two things. One, the first half of the game where Rip too easily got away from Hill. 2nd, I have watched every Orlando game this year. I know he can't play D, even without checking out the stats on that, which show he is a horrible defender. I will say Hill had pretty much the best game for the season.

The offense and Billips looked good but this was Orlando...Still, we were much sharper in the first quarter.

I liked Tay waiting at the three point line and popping them. The guy is a good shooter and we should use him more like that.

Dyss has been money in the bank.

The score was close but we weren't playing playoff D. Orlando will be hard-pressed to score 80 points against us.

Webber makes Darko actually look like a Serbian gangster. Even after all these years he's still shying away from contact when he's supposed to be setting screens.

As far as I can tell, CWebb has never learned that you can in fact get open even after setting a solid screen. In my experience, he rarely actually sets a pick --- he's always looking to slip it. A man of his size should be willing to throw his weight around much more on the court.

Edit: I was really hoping that he would learn to correct this mistake as a Piston, what with the fact that he's at best the #3 offensive scoring option at just about any time, and arguably the team's most consistent offensive scoring option (RIP) relies heavily on running around *actual* screens. Unfortunately I've been disappointed.

The game didn't show much except when the team is focused, they are unstoppable, but they seem to have no killer instinct to put a team away. Hopefully, we won't have that problem come playoffs.

CWebb looked bored.

Watching Jameer made realize how much Flip Jr has improved and how good CB really is.

Orlando may have the worst pg's I've ever seen. Absolutely zero hoopsIQ. No court vision. Everyone stands around waiting for the guards to shoot.

Also, BHill makes me respect LB a little bit. LB may have been a bad person, but watching Orlando, you get to see what a bad coach will do to a team.

The game didn't show much except when the team is focused, they are unstoppable, but they seem to have no killer instinct to put a team away. Hopefully, we won't have that problem come playoffs.

CWebb looked bored.

Watching Jameer made realize how much Flip Jr has improved and how good CB really is.

Orlando may have the worst pg's I've ever seen. Absolutely zero hoopsIQ. No court vision. Everyone stands around waiting for the guards to shoot.

Also, BHill makes me respect LB a little bit. LB may have been a bad person, but watching Orlando, you get to see what a bad coach will do to a team.

Good points all.

Not sure what's going on, if anything is going on, with Webber. He said in an interview before the Cavs game that he had been diagnosed with pneunomia which could certainly take some time to get over. If he is still lagging from that though, seems like sitting him down for a few games would be a better choice.

Could just be that he will never match up well with Howard (along with 99% of the league). I wonder though how many fourth quarters he watches from the bench before that pained frown turns into a pout.

Well we blew a 18 point lead due to slacking off of the defense, but still put it together the last 2 minutes to pull it out. Funny the Rockets had a 25 point lead in the third qtr over the Blazers and had to hold on to win by 4 points after the Blazers came back within 2 pts with less than a second left. So other teams have mental lapses too when challenged by bottom feeders.


This is a good point, Dre. There are well over 1,000 games played over an NBA season and very few of those games involve a team getting blown out from start to finish. There are very good players on all 30 NBA teams. I'm surprised how many people complain that the Pistons should just win every game by 30 points without allowing the opponent to make a run the entire game. It's not going to happen.

The Pistons do have a relatively low point differential when compared to the other elite teams.

1) San Antonio +9.1
2) Dallas +7.7
3) Phoenix +7.3
4) Houston +5.0
5) Chicago +4.7
6) Detroit +4.3

Especially when you consider how good our recored is. That tells me that we are not as ruthless when we have the lead as these other teams. Chicago has 5 more losses than us and still beats us in the spread.

The one thing the Pistons have struggled with this year is consistency. Even now, we seem to be slinking into the playoffs, and have 3 meaningless games left to play against teams fighting for playoff positioning.

If we can develop a rhythm in the first round, we should be ok. But then again, if we demolish our early matchup, there will probably be a layoff waiting for our next opponent.

Wheels within wheels.

well, my buddy and i got to the game early and chilled for a bit. webber stopped during shoot around and went to sign autographs for the fans. we were at the palace tuesday since season ticket holders could go and get autographs and do a bunch of other things, and webber was great. he let fans stop and take pictures, he looked at you after signing and responded when you talked to him, and he looked genuinely happy to be there. he is really digging detroit.

anyway, not much to say about this game except orlando poses no threat to us and the refs let them back in the 2nd half. now yes, we did foul howard early (and smartly so), but some of the fouls being called in the 2nd half were just plain ridiculous. either way, we match up at every single position and have at least 3-4 mismatches at all times. if we play them in the 1st round they might make noise for a game or two (and possibly even steal one, although doubtful), but they absolutely cannot out-execute us down the stretch and have 0 chance of winning a 7-game series.

TaS I don't know what the problem was but when Darko was starting and playing a lot, they lost. When Battie and Ariza came back they had a little more success. This team really fell on it's face as the season went on.

Darko was getting backed up by bo outlaw and the likes. battie is backed up by darko so there goes your difference in success rates.

b. hill should have left darko starting it helped d. howard shoot about 70% from the field during that stretch. b. hill is sucking the life out of that team and i hope he is fired.

jameer should not be starting.
arroyo should not be getting dnpcd's
jj should be running off screens from the huge big man the magic have.
darko should be starting and the offense should be ran through him.
darko should be averaging 30 minutes a game and 10 shot attempts.

Nice profile pic, bballjay.

Looks like I was closest to Darko's statline. :stirthepot:

Darko was getting backed up by bo outlaw and the likes. battie is backed up by darko so there goes your difference in success rates.


Don't forget that Pat Garrity was getting a lot of minutes in the backup center role. Pat was a threat from the 3-point land at one point in his career, but this year he plays like a blindfolded Chris Webber after Thanksgiving dinner.

If Battie was truly a starter, then they would play him at the end. What they are doing is either playing Darko in cruch time, or they go small and neither plays.

Orlando was on the 1 yard line with the Milicic contract extension before they pulled out of it. They gambled this year and wanted to see what they had... but they didn't want it to bite them in the butt. Why wouldn't you massage the minutes and stats to keep other teams away? Starters get more attention as free agents... especially young starting big men.

You're naive if you don't think the Pistons are doing the same thing with AJ right now. And if it works, we'll probably be praising that strategic move for the next 4 years.

The Pistons do have a relatively low point differential when compared to the other elite teams.

1) San Antonio +9.1
2) Dallas +7.7
3) Phoenix +7.3
4) Houston +5.0
5) Chicago +4.7
6) Detroit +4.3

Especially when you consider how good our recored is. That tells me that we are not as ruthless when we have the lead as these other teams. Chicago has 5 more losses than us and still beats us in the spread.

That is an interesting stat. It does always seem that even if we jump out to the lead we will let the other team back. How much of this can be attributed to coaching? Leaving the starters in too long? Not having a solid bench unit to build leads?

Or having an older squad with less athleticism than some of the other contenders.

Darko was getting backed up by bo outlaw and the likes. battie is backed up by darko so there goes your difference in success rates.

b. hill should have left darko starting it helped d. howard shoot about 70% from the field during that stretch. b. hill is sucking the life out of that team and i hope he is fired.

jameer should not be starting.
arroyo should not be getting dnpcd's
jj should be running off screens from the huge big man the magic have.
darko should be starting and the offense should be ran through him.
darko should be averaging 30 minutes a game and 10 shot attempts.
I saw that.
Grant was out some to during that time.

"Not having a solid bench unit to build leads?"
I'd blame it all on inconsistant bench rotations.
But you gotta like how we played just hard enough to get the one seed.
We did the blowing people off the court thing last year.

In the interest of fairness. Did anyone really think Nelson fouled Chauncey on the 4 point play?

Here is the other thing about San Antonio, they started off very slow, so their overall stats don't do justice to their recent play.

If you look at the last 26 games, the Spurs are 23-3 and the Pistons are 19-7. Both good right?

But the point differential for SA is an incredible +13.38 while Det's is +4.85.

During this stretch, the Spurs beat teams by the following margins:
41, 37, 31, 25, 24, 23, 19, 18, 16, 16, 16, 15, 14, 13, etc.


I'm pretty confident in saying that they are the best team in the NBA. We need them to get upset in the West.

Not only are they good, but they match up well against us. Bowen shuts rip down. Tony Parker gets by Chauncey. Duncan makes us collapse and Barry/ Finley make us pay for it.

With Dal and Pho, at least we can take away some of what makes them successful against other teams... and while their D is underrated, it is nothing compared to SA.

At the start of the year Pop was trying a lot of bench players due to injury.

Tashawn, Agree the Spurs are scary.


Doubt Orlando is any threat to us and Micro, it will be hard to gauge our team from the pending series with them. I think that many have the Magic overrated just as the Clippers were overrated. Every year, the buzz goes to some seemingly up and coming team. It is not that easy to reach the top.

My view on Darko is that if he is to be very successful, he needs to get away from Howard and be the starting center for a team (get 35 minutes) where he can roam and see if he can really be a force. After 3 years of that, we would know. I know that this is against the conventional thinking. If I were his agent, I would move him.

If you're his agent, you want to get him the biggest possible deal now, because there are no guarantees he will ever be a full time starter or won't suffer a career ending injury.

Also no guarantees he doesn't dump his agent for a new one at any time.

The Magic can pay Darko the most based upon needs and cap space of the other teams. The question is not just the starting salary, but will it have maximum raises and how many years will it run.

Has anyone seen lazyberbs? It's not like him to miss a Detroit/Orlando matchup.

In the interest of fairness. Did anyone really think Nelson fouled Chauncey on the 4 point play?

Jameer had a legit complaint

We all feel pretty good about this Orlando game, but let me point out some counter points:

The Magic have been a horrible road team and they almost won.
They shot 50% on a night when their best player was 3 for 12.
They missed 14 free throws, and we missed 2.
Webber got outscored by Darko, who didn't exactly have a good night.
McDyess was on fire.
Chauncey had one of his best games of the season.

And we barely won.


One of the strangest stats from the game was that we had more turnovers than Orlando. They are the worst and we are the best in this stat. Now we only turned it over 11 times, which is below average, so the real question is why were they so solid with the ball against us? Hopefully the answer is just that we weren't putting our normal pressure on the ball.

Conclusion: if we don't play well, we could easily lose a couple and get a little scare in the 1st round.

I have reason to believe that we can make them turn the ball over 20 times per game in the playoffs if our energy is there. That is the way to beat them handily.

We didn't play a lot of defense. We got by with our clutch shooting from the floor and the line.

It's scary when we don't rebound or defend. Feels a little unnatural as a Pistons fan to win that way. And I am sure THE LOW will be the first one to say, that we need defense to win a championship.

Here is the other thing about San Antonio, they started off very slow, so their overall stats don't do justice to their recent play.

If you look at the last 26 games, the Spurs are 23-3 and the Pistons are 19-7. Both good right?

But the point differential for SA is an incredible +13.38 while Det's is +4.85.

During this stretch, the Spurs beat teams by the following margins:
41, 37, 31, 25, 24, 23, 19, 18, 16, 16, 16, 15, 14, 13, etc.


I'm pretty confident in saying that they are the best team in the NBA. We need them to get upset in the West.

Not only are they good, but they match up well against us. Bowen shuts rip down. Tony Parker gets by Chauncey. Duncan makes us collapse and Barry/ Finley make us pay for it.

With Dal and Pho, at least we can take away some of what makes them successful against other teams... and while their D is underrated, it is nothing compared to SA.

The team with the best record has not won the title since the Spurs did it in 2003. With Pacers, Suns and Pistons all falling victim in the conference finals the past 3 years, I thinking the Mavs suffer the same fate themselves if they meet the Spurs. I'm thinking its a rematch of the Spurs and Pistons for the title.

We all feel pretty good about this Orlando game, but let me point out some counter points:

The Magic have been a horrible road team and they almost won.
They shot 50% on a night when their best player was 3 for 12.
They missed 14 free throws, and we missed 2.
Webber got outscored by Darko, who didn't exactly have a good night.
McDyess was on fire.
Chauncey had one of his best games of the season.

And we barely won.
Wouldn't worry about that game. After the big lead, you could tell that the Pistons were only looking to go home with a W and take the next 4 games off.

Also, I get the feeling a lot of the matador D had to due with players not willing to risk injury this close to playoffs.

Come playoffs, our starters ('cept C Webb) will be playing 40+ min of basketball without letup, and hopefully without the fatigue that they had last year.

We didn't play a lot of defense. We got by with our clutch shooting from the floor and the line.

It's scary when we don't rebound or defend. Feels a little unnatural as a Pistons fan to win that way. And I am sure THE LOW will be the first one to say, that we need defense to win a championship.

Kinder Gentler Low Says:

I don't have anything to add to the discussion. I'm just looking forward to seeing how our guys perform this coming post season. Go Pistons!

Right. We didn't play defense. They will have trouble reaching the 80s in the playoffs. Their scoring options are limited.

Right. We didn't play defense. They will have trouble reaching the 80s in the playoffs. Their scoring options are limited.

We played spectacular D on DHo though. He got "worst of the day" on the daily dime. This dude always shoots > 50%... because he doesn't really shoot so much as "use the rim as a gymnastics aparatus." to quote Bill Walton.

He only dunked twice on us last night, which tied his season low.

(On a side note, Dwigt's scoring average is 30% higher in games when Darko starts. And his FG % is > 70%. )

My view on Darko is that if he is to be very successful, he needs to get away from Howard and be the starting center for a team (get 35 minutes) where he can roam and see if he can really be a force. After 3 years of that, we would know. I know that this is against the conventional thinking. If I were his agent, I would move him.

i disagree. i think darko can be successful in any system with the right coach. i do however think that him and d. howard would be the ultimate tandem for years to come with the right coach. ben wallace isn't as good defensively without rasheed. darko and d. howard in the paint shuts things down. the offense just needs to be ran through darko at this point in thier careers. darko is the more willing and capable passer. if the magic played it right d. howard and darko would be playing with single coverage the majority of thier careers. i'm sure they would get about 6 - 8 points off each other misses every game.

although i would love to see him get 3 years by himself as our starting center. s & t with orlando again i hope. nazr, dale, and webber are aging to aged.

We played spectacular D on DHo though. He got "worst of the day" on the daily dime. This dude always shoots > 50%... because he doesn't really shoot so much as "use the rim as a gymnastics aparatus." to quote Bill Walton.

He only dunked twice on us last night, which tied his season low.

(On a side note, Dwigt's scoring average is 30% higher in games when Darko starts. And his FG % is > 70%. )

I will add two things. The media loves Howard. One night, he had the two dunks, and not another basket made that night. Several players outdid Howard that night in an Orlando win, but the highlight real pretty much consisted of the two dunks by Howard-with no mention that he scored only those two dunks.

The 2nd. We played some outstanding D mid-2nd quarter with Dale Davis and JMAX in together. I would dare say that we could have gone nearly undefeated this year if we had featured this pair heavily from the start of the season. They are that good together.

i disagree. i think darko can be successful in any system with the right coach. i do however think that him and d. howard would be the ultimate tandem for years to come with the right coach. ben wallace isn't as good defensively without rasheed. darko and d. howard in the paint shuts things down. the offense just needs to be ran through darko at this point in thier careers. darko is the more willing and capable passer. if the magic played it right d. howard and darko would be playing with single coverage the majority of thier careers. i'm sure they would get about 6 - 8 points off each other misses every game.

although i would love to see him get 3 years by himself as our starting center. s & t with orlando again i hope. nazr, dale, and webber are aging to aged.

Recently, Darko and Howard played about 20 straight games together, and Orlando did not do that great. Some people not familiar with what was going on take that as meaning the combination does not work. What they are missing is that Tony Battie was out the whole time save a couple of games of that. So they were very thin up front, and very prone to foul trouble. If they went back to these two starting together, with Battie available, they could have a good, dependable rotation and fully exploit the problems they cause other teams when in together.

The Pistons do have a relatively low point differential when compared to the other elite teams.

1) San Antonio +9.1
2) Dallas +7.7
3) Phoenix +7.3
4) Houston +5.0
5) Chicago +4.7
6) Detroit +4.3



You have to keep in mind that point differential factors in points scored and given up for wins AND losses. The Pistons got HAMMERED in several games this year (2x to GS, once to CHI). If you take out just the two Golden State games, for example, the Pistons move up to 4th on the list.

You have to keep in mind that point differential factors in points scored and given up for wins AND losses. The Pistons got HAMMERED in several games this year (2x to GS, once to CHI). If you take out just the two Golden State games, for example, the Pistons move up to 4th on the list.

Yeah, but you would then have to take out the losses for the other teams as well. If you take all of the losses out of the Spurs and Pistons record for the past 26 games, then you get a pt differential of +16 for the Spurs and +9.6 for the Pistons. If you count the losses as 0 instead of ignoring them completely, then SA would be +14 per game and we would be +7 per game.

We are good. They are gooder.

We played spectacular D on DHo though. He got "worst of the day" on the daily dime. This dude always shoots > 50%... because he doesn't really shoot so much as "use the rim as a gymnastics aparatus." to quote Bill Walton.

He only dunked twice on us last night, which tied his season low.

(On a side note, Dwigt's scoring average is 30% higher in games when Darko starts. And his FG % is > 70%. )
Darko may have 1/2 of Dwights physical ability, but he crushes DHo when it comes to the fundamentals. All Detroit had to do with DHo was make sure he got the ball more 5 feet from the rim. Since Dwight can't dribble, shoot, or make a move, so he usually turns it over, or passes.

Even Shaq can dribble once, and do spin move to the basket.

Darko has a bit of range and my opinion about he and Howard is based on the notion that Darko is not allowed to roam as he would if he were the starting center on a team playing a lot of minutes. He would then get a chance to assert himself offensively as well. Whether or not he would be successful, I would imagine, would take several seasons to assess.

Orlando has chosen Howard as their franchise guy. It is a big question whether or not Darko can fit in with what that choice entails. I doubt if any coach can go into Orlando and diminish Howard's role.

Tashawn, I would follow Bill Walton's assessment of Howard. He needs to develop a shooting touch around the basket. Sheed can block his shot and he tends to miss free throws. Many people throughout his career knock Shaq. But Shaq has a touch around the hoop. He is not just big. Every year they hype up players and Howard is a coming star. The media has little use for the Pistons or the Spurs who show excellence and results every year.

Grant Hill has been really doing well lately as he is hitting the mid-range shot. But I would envision the Pistons taking much of his game away. Nelson makes a lot of errors and is inconsistent offensively. I would be surprised if Orlando did not have trouble scoring against us when all the possessions really matter in the playoffs.

Bball, yes, our bigs are showing age which will eventually close our window (hope not yet). But some of the teams with a youthful front line that looked so good early in the season have faded. Youth is great but skill level is even more important. Athletically, many guys are better than Dice but few have his shot. Amir and JMax will have to prove their worth. I was hoping Jmax would come through this year but for now, I have more faith in Dyss. I hope the coach is willing to use Davis and even Nazi (to foul) on Shaq.

Yeah, but you would then have to take out the losses for the other teams as well. If you take all of the losses out of the Spurs and Pistons record for the past 26 games, then you get a pt differential of +16 for the Spurs and +9.6 for the Pistons. If you count the losses as 0 instead of ignoring them completely, then SA would be +14 per game and we would be +7 per game.

We are good. They are gooder.

Yea, but San Antonio gets to play Memphis 4 times. The Pistons only get to play them twice.

Yea, but San Antonio gets to play Memphis 4 times. The Pistons only get to play them twice.
Exactly. You have to account for the fact that they only play in the Western conference.

Exactly. You have to account for the fact that they only play in the Western conference.
:rofl: :rofl:

I'm struggling to think of a single play where we dumped it into one of our bigs in the post and scored on an individual post move.... that's sad