Sixers Nov 23 8PM

tv: tv20

Pistons always seem to have this day after Thanksgiving Friday home game. Always a great time for a Pistons game at the Palace, wish I was going this year.

Think its safe to say that the only thing that can beat the Pistons as they square off against the 3-7 Sixers is themselfs.

Should be another easy double digit win. Let`s hope Flip utilizes his bench..........correctly!!

don't make it hard game in the last quarter. hope Rip comes back to his game

hope rip comes back to his good game. don't make it a hard game in last quarter

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/sp/getty/fa/fullj.getty-76075605lm005_philadelphia_.jpg


NEW ORLEANS - NOVEMBER 14: Andre Iguodala #9 of the Philadelphia 76ers shoots the ball on Tyson Chandler #6 of the New Orleans Hornets on November 14, 2007 at the New Orleans Arena in New Orleans,
NEW ORLEANS - NOVEMBER 14: Andre Iguodala #9 of the Philadelphia 76ers sho... - NBA - Yahoo! Sports (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/photo?slug=getty-76075605lm005_philadelphia_&prov=getty)

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http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/sp/getty/fa/fullj.getty-76075605lm005_philadelphia_.jpg

NEW ORLEANS - NOVEMBER 14: Andre Iguodala #9 of the Philadelphia 76ers sho... - NBA - Yahoo! Sports (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/photo?slug=getty-76075605lm005_philadelphia_&prov=getty)

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AI currently leads the league in turnovers.

AI currently leads the league in turnovers.

Actually, Steve Nash has one more turnover (50) than AI and Jason Kidd (49).

Last year's turnover leaders:

1. Dwight Howard 317
2. Eddy Curry 295
3. Steve Nash 287
4. Allen Iverson 268
5. Andre Iguodala 261

Philly commits the 4th most turnovers per game at 16.9.

Detroit commits the 3rd least turnovers per game at 12.6. Dallas (12.2) and San Antonio (12.0) are the only teams better, at this point.

AI currently leads the league in turnovers.

Did you like the picture?

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Chat is open!!!

http://www.pistonsforum.com/misc.php?do=flashchat

83-78 Pistons WIN!

Did you like the picture?

:hoops:

That man dunking over me would give me nightmares.

Good win. Good use of the bench. Good amount of playing time for the young guys. Amir did not play much, but he got some important 2nd half minutes. With him and Afflalo in the game, we took some control of the game to end the 3rd quarter.


I guess some people would miss it, since maybe they don't pay attention to what Saunders says much. Saunders had kept talking about how Afflalo had to play within his game. Not try to do too much. Basically, he was saying it was not Afflalo's role to shoot the ball. This was over several interviews. Well, tonight, they let Afflalo shoot. The Pistons were looking for him to shoot. And the announcers were saying how Afflalo had to start looking for his shot more. Hopefully, this is a trend, as Afflalo is especially good at getting into the paint and making his short jumpers. (or getting fouled and making his free throws.) Afflalo was his usual outstanding self on D, although Williams scored on him some.


Jason Maxiell had a pretty awesome game. Dalembert is a fairly good center in this league, but he was defended just fine by Maxiell and Maxiell scored over him repeatedly. Jason basically just goes up into rarified air and cans those jumpers. Remember just a game or two ago Jason missed some shots. Thats in game practice, allowing him the success he had tonight. Jason got the start for Sheed who is still nursing a bone bruise in his knee. Supposedly, this is not serious and they expect he will play Sunday afternoon against Utah.


Mohammed played extensive minutes in this game. He did well on the boards. Not so great on D, not so great on offense. To my perspective, Flip Saunders at one point pulled just about the entire squad rather than embarrass Mohammed by pulling just him for his poor D.


Rip hit several shots in the second half after struggling in the first. He was a game time decision due to the flu.


Tay got player of the game with 15 points, just about all from outside jumpers - including our only two made threes for the game.


Billups had a solid game. Not a lot of scoring, but not many shots taken either. He ended up with about 8 assists. Thats pretty good, but even better when you consider all the scoring we got from Maxiell posting up. You don't get an assist for feeding the post. (The perfect offense would have no assists. You would just feed the post everytime.)


Murray did not do bad in this game other than some dead spots where he was pretending to be a point guard. He gave us a bit of scoring and was an ok matchup on defense for the most part. The play of the game was a nice assist for a Maxiell fast break dunk.


Amir did not play much. His highlight was a dunk to end the 3rd, on a nifty assist from Afflalo.


Hayes, other than getting that garbage time bucket last game - well, I can't remember him scoring a meaningful point in quite a while. He is shooting little and missing the shots he does take. He does receive a lot of defensive pressure, and he does play inside quite a bit. His most important function seems to be as a spare power forward - althoug Amir could be getting those minutes sometimes.


Dyess never went on any tear in this game. Instead, a bucket here, a bucket there. It all added up to about 12 points on good enough shooting percentage. Some of those buckets were timely ones ending scoring droughts for us. But I will still complain some because I believe Dyess should be playing more inside and getting to the line for us. (And that means drawing fouls that can be very helpful getting the opponent in foul trouble.)


Samb did not play. He certainly could have considering all the minutes Mohammed played.


The bench played a whole lot in this one. Including all but the last few minutes of the 2nd quarter. Why the starters came in then was a mystery to me. They did not do so well, and the bench was still doing just fine when they came out of the game. The announcers contributed this better performance to the fact that the subs were brought in one at a time, starting a bit early in the 1st - compared to an average Flip coached game. Afflalo came in early. Mohammed was in early too due to foul trouble.


8-4. Good. Young guys are playing. Good. Stuckey back in 10 days. Very good. Am I happy. Kind of. I still would like to see more of Amir playing, and I don't want to see Samb disappear from the rotation. Still in all, good job Flip Saunders.
GO PISTONS!!!!!

Good recap. Afflalo is seriously becoming one of my favorite Pistons.

I agree Amir needs more time as does Samb. Solid shot-blockers will go a long way to help us out in the post-season.

8-4. Good. Young guys are playing. Good. Stuckey back in 10 days. Very good. Am I happy. Kind of. I still would like to see more of Amir playing, and I don't want to see Samb disappear from the rotation. Still in all, good job Flip Saunders.
GO PISTONS!!!!!
There's a rotation?

1 assist total in 51 + minutes for Maxey and Nazr.

:hoops:

Lee summed this one up pretty good. I will mention one thing, Murray played a very good game tonight. The starters could not get anything going towards the basket. Murray came in and immediately began to attack the paint successfully, that's how we got up by 8 pts in the 2nd. The starters came back in and it was all perimeter play again.

Question:? with Maxey doing so well in the post, will Billups and Hamilton actually start giving him the ball when he establishes position on the block?? I swear they freeze that guy out sometimes.

Oh, 1 more point for my Start AA campaign. Notice in the 3rd qtr, the Pistons were struggling and Rip was forcing a bunch of bad shots, I'm not sure if Tay had even touched the ball on the offensive end of the floor. A timeout gets called and Tay is walking to the bench with his head down with a look of disgust on his face. Post t/out AA checks in (Rip out) and Tay goes off for like 8 straight points helping the Pistons take control of the game. Funny what happens when Tay actually gets to touch the ball. Too many chiefs in this starting lineup. We have guys who are good enough to be the 2nd&3rd option being squeezed into 4th/5th option players and it's hurting this team. Popovich noticed it in SA and made a gutsy move......can Detroit do the same.

Now, just so nobody thinks I'm picking on Rip. Rip comes back in the game with 3 bench players (Maxiel - normally a bench player, Murray, Hayes, Dyess) and played very good ball and helped the team big time.

1 assist total in 51 + minutes for Maxey and Nazr.

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Naz can't get an assist. Nobody ever double teams him. Why would they. Did you see just how bad some his shots were around the basket? And why would Maxiell pass the ball on a night where he can't miss? Maxiell had a great game, and the kind of game we need, all in the post.

We have been waiting for this from Maxiel. Good that he is not trying to dunk every time. He is still rushing his straight on shots. His post ups were impressive.

Murray had a good feel for this Philly team. He is often a poor point guard but he could get what he wanted with this team. He should have actually played more. Saunders plays too much by formula.

Afflalo is starting to look like a bargain pick so late in the draft.

We do miss Sheed win or no win.

We have been waiting for this from Maxiel. Good that he is not trying to dunk every time. He is still rushing his straight on shots. His post ups were impressive.

Murray had a good feel for this Philly team. He is often a poor point guard but he could get what he wanted with this team. He should have actually played more. Saunders plays too much by formula.

Afflalo is starting to look like a bargain pick so late in the draft.

We do miss Sheed win or no win.

Its more accurate to say we have been waiting on the coaching staff to let Maxiell shoot enough to get into a rythm. Maxiell could aways shoot the jumper fro the day he arrived to us.

Good Leecap as always! Was anyone else at the game? I took my wife to her first pistons game. She was able to score 2 tickets because her coworker couldn't go so she got them free. Didn't want the tickets to go to waste:MusicBigGrin:.

Anyway, I was really impressed with Afflalo. He is smooth, plays within the system, good shooter, and plays good defense. I wished Amir would have had a little more burn, but at least he got to play some. Maxiell, was really impressive. Even though he is undersized, a man with his girth, he powers it up around the basket well. He also can go up and over his defender to make his little shot in the paint. Nothing like going to a live game. Even scored some free door prizes. Pistons mousepad and a pistons headband for voting for the all star game.

Haven't been to one of the pistons games since 89-90, bad boys era. Anyway, after this I just may go to more of these games in person. I was in section 218, row 8. I know it is up there but I could see the action pretty well.

Vince

There's a rotation?

In the first 12 games, the Pistons four All-Stars have all missed games (Billups-2, Hamilton-2, Wallace-1, McDyess-3). The new guys (Hayes, Amir, Afflalo) are still showing what they can do. The backup PG (Stuckey) is injured. The fill-in PG (Murray) has shown flashes. There is no way to have a rotation at this point.

In the first 12 games, the Pistons four All-Stars have all missed games (Billups-2, Hamilton-2, Wallace-1, McDyess-3). The new guys (Hayes, Amir, Afflalo) are still showing what they can do. The backup PG (Stuckey) is injured. The fill-in PG (Murray) has shown flashes. There is no way to have a rotation at this point.

So what were the rotations the previous 2 years when none of these guys got hurt? You can't have a rotation when you consider making 3 shots in a row a once in a lifetime achievement that can't be disrupted. Flip plays he bench like a little kid learning to ride a bike. He starts of wobbly at first then he sees that the bench isn't killing him and it's, 'I'M PLAYING THE BENCH! LOOK EVERYONE - I'M PLAYING THE BENCH!'.

Can you honestly say you know when a player is going to come in and for who? Dysee has been the only player you could reliably predict when he might sub in going into year 3. Is there any coach in the NBA who sits starers until there are 2 minutes left in the half? Has that ever been done? How about having your starters sitting with 5 minutes to go in close games? 'I'M PLAYING THE BENCH!'.

If you look at the minutes per game averages, the bench plays. To me the bench plays just enough to lose, just enough to ensure that they need to lean on the starters, just enough that the starters will pick up nagging injuries along the way. That doesn't mean there is a rotation. Every game is a blank slate for Memento-man.

Sheed had to borrow this jacket from C-Bill LOL

http://cmsimg.detnews.com/apps/pbcsi.dll/bilde?Site=C3&Date=20071124&Category=SPORTS0102&ArtNo=711240400&Ref=AR&Profile=1004Q=100&MaxW=290&MaxH=290

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So what were the rotations the previous 2 years when none of these guys got hurt? You can't have a rotation when you consider making 3 shots in a row a once in a lifetime achievement that can't be disrupted. Flip plays he bench like a little kid learning to ride a bike. He starts of wobbly at first then he sees that the bench isn't killing him and it's, 'I'M PLAYING THE BENCH! LOOK EVERYONE - I'M PLAYING THE BENCH!'.

Can you honestly say you know when a player is going to come in and for who? Dysee has been the only player you could reliably predict when he might sub in going into year 3. Is there any coach in the NBA who sits starers until there are 2 minutes left in the half? Has that ever been done? How about having your starters sitting with 5 minutes to go in close games? 'I'M PLAYING THE BENCH!'.

If you look at the minutes per game averages, the bench plays. To me the bench plays just enough to lose, just enough to ensure that they need to lean on the starters, just enough that the starters will pick up nagging injuries along the way. That doesn't mean there is a rotation. Every game is a blank slate for Memento-man.

Coaching a basketball team is not like doing an accounting audit?

Best matchups, hot hands, cold hands, game situations, injuries, fouls are all critical ingredients of any coaches bench rotation. We complained because Flip wasn't flexible against the Cavs and couldn't vary the Pistons game. Now we are complaining when he is showing some flexibility. Complain, complain, complain.

Now I am complaining. LOL

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yeah KGreg it's called feeding the hot player.
Nice rant Ernie.

In the first 12 games, the Pistons four All-Stars have all missed games (Billups-2, Hamilton-2, Wallace-1, McDyess-3). The new guys (Hayes, Amir, Afflalo) are still showing what they can do. The backup PG (Stuckey) is injured. The fill-in PG (Murray) has shown flashes. There is no way to have a rotation at this point.

I say you are wrong. Players missing does not mean you don't have a rotation. You should have a depth chart, and try to stick to it. However, Flip (and the Pistons management in general) have too many things going on to maintain some kind of logic in their rotation. Its not the injuries. Its more showcasing Mohammed and Flip Murray.

Case in point. If you notice, Afflalo is getting all the backup shooting guard minutes at the moment. Where does that leave Murray, who depending on what week it is, people are saying he is or is not a point guard? It seemed to work well having Prince play the point, but instead, we are having Murray play the backup point the last few games. Why. Its just showcasing Murry, not to try to win games. And it throws off the rotation.

I am going to post a rotation we could be using so far this season. (in the rotations thread. And rest assured, Mohammed and Flip Murray won't be in it.

I say you are wrong. Players missing does not mean you don't have a rotation. You should have a depth chart, and try to stick to it. However, Flip (and the Pistons management in general) have too many things going on to maintain some kind of logic in their rotation. Its not the injuries. Its more showcasing Mohammed and Flip Murray.

Of course, the coaches have a depth chart. Unfortunately for you, the Piston coaches' depth chart doesn't match yours. There is a big difference between a depth chart and a rotation. You must have been confused for a minute. Perhaps that was why you mistakenly said I was wrong. It wouldn't be possible to have a consistent rotation with the injuries the Pistons have had in the first 12 games. They have been plugging different holes each game.

Of course, the coaches have a depth chart. Unfortunately for you, the Piston coaches' depth chart doesn't match yours. There is a big difference between a depth chart and a rotation. You must have been confused for a minute. Perhaps that was why you mistakenly said I was wrong. It wouldn't be possible to have a consistent rotation with the injuries the Pistons have had in the first 12 games. They have been plugging different holes each game.

Nope, there really is no difference. And don't bother reading further, or replying any further, if you want to take the approach that you are right, and why bother discussing anything. If you do want to debate the topic, read on.

Lets say Prince is 3rd on your depth chart for point guards. With CB and Stuckey out, Prince would automatically start at point. With one of them out, Prince becomes the sub at point. This is not esoteric, as indeed, Prince has acted as our 3rd string point guard in a few games already this season.

But there has been an inconsistency. Despite us doing just fine with Tay running the point, we have seen the Pistons not play Tay at the point, even in games where Billups did not even play (and Stuckey of course still being injured). He went from 3rd string to 4th string point guard behind Flip Murray.

This discussion started with the statement that you just did not know who Flip Saunders would play when. This is a very true statement. Whether Flip chose to use Murray or Prince as the the 3rd string point, at least we would know which one was going to play when if Flip Saunders used a consistent depth chart.

Other examples: You never know if Flip Saunders will go with Amir or Hayes as 4th string big. There has been no rhyme nor reason with that so far.

There has been no consistency concerning if Samb would play, or if Mohammed would get minutes. You just don't know, save maybe trying to base something on the last two games.

You do not know if Dyess will be limited in minutes (as per what most thought would happen) or if Flip will play him major minutes.

You do not know for any certainly whether Afflalo vs. Murray will get any given backup shooting guard minutes, basing on what has happened so far this season. Here, you could guess Afflalo based on the last couple of games, but you really would be guessing. And going forward, when Stuckey gets back, you really can't even begin to guess who Flip Saunders will choose then for a backup shooting guard.

And heck, you can't even tell me if Stuckey will actually be the primary backup point over Murray when he gets back in a week or so.

Believe it or not, there have been many seasons where for any given injury, or set of injuries, it could be easily figured out who would play what position. There would be no surprises. Nothing to guess at. Why? We were not showcasing any players as we are now.

And don't bother reading further, or replying any further, if you want to take the approach that you are right, and why bother discussing anything. If you do want to debate the topic, read on.
http://www.loc.gov/loc/lcib/9804/images/oliphant_3.jpg

http://www.loc.gov/loc/lcib/9804/images/oliphant_3.jpg
DUDE!!!! Now that is FUNNY. Whooooooo that's funny.

Aren't you the first option if you are the SG?
Afflalo aint shooting.

Shoot man, he can shoot man.