At NewYork Jan 13 7PM

tv: FSN

Knicks are 9-26, Pistons are 28-9.

The Pistons will be playing their 4th game in 5 nights, all of them on the road, and the Knicks are...well...the Knicks. Will this game make the ugly win in Charlotte look like one of the greatest games in NBA history? Looks like it could be a rough night, regardless of the final result.

The Pistons will be playing their 4th game in 5 nights, all of them on the road, and the Knicks are...well...the Knicks. Will this game make the ugly win in Charlotte look like one of the greatest games in NBA history? Looks like it could be a rough night, regardless of the final result.

Lots depends on how bench performances. Not sure starters would have much interest in playing vs. Knicks, especially after the minutes they logged against Bobcats.

I hear New York has a nice State Fair..........Sorry..:)

If Flip is really upset about 29 3s, he could always send a message this game to those players. Start by Sitting Hamilton for the 1st period.......

I hear New York has a nice State Fair..........Sorry..:)

If Flip is really upset about 29 3s, he could always send a message this game to those players. Start by Sitting Hamilton for the 1st period.......

Sit Rip/ CB and Dice/ Sheed after 6 minutes of the 1st quarter I would say Flip is already sort of sending a message to them but Sit Rip in the 1st quarter??? Flip Sr do not have the guts.

i have my rotation all set 4 tonight (well at least in my dreams)...

............MP

F- PRINCE 22
F- MCDYESS 8
C- WALLACE 13....he aint gonna try tonight anyway
G- BILLUPS 24
G- RIP 19
F- JOHNSON 28
F-HAYES 13...Nothing to prove
F- MAX 15...nothing to prove
F- HERRMANN 20
C- BREZIC 28
G- STUCKEY 32
G- AFFLALO 21


.....nuff said:cold:

i have my rotation all set 4 tonight (well at least in my dreams)...

............MP

F- PRINCE 22
F- MCDYESS 8
C- WALLACE 13....he aint gonna try tonight anyway
G- BILLUPS 24
G- RIP 19
F- JOHNSON 28
F-HAYES 13...Nothing to prove
F- MAX 15...nothing to prove
F- HERRMANN 20
C- BREZIC 28
G- STUCKEY 32
G- AFFLALO 21


.....nuff said:cold:

It will be an ugly game for sheed & co. tonight. Hope they can get a win.
Otherwise, it will be a long day at work.

Chat is open

http://www.pistonsforum.com/misc.php?do=flashchat

Three quarters of that was more than enough of me. That's the worst game they've played in years.

Blown out by the Knicks?! Guess they were more tired than I thought. :doh:

AJ was our 3rd leading scorer...

That about sums it up.

It will be an ugly game for sheed & co. tonight. Hope they can get a win.
Otherwise, it will be a long day at work.
tHE VISION came true..................
OLDSKOOLHQ FOR COACH!!!

Three quarters of that was more than enough of me. That's the worst game they've played in years.


TAKE THE PAIN!! TAKE THE PAIN!!.....( Tom Berenger-Platoon)

Maybe we'll get active at the trade deadline now.

Something wasn't right, and I'm not buying fatigue.

Maybe we'll get active at the trade deadline now.

Something wasn't right, and I'm not buying fatigue.

Yup. Detroit media/columnists need to hit these boys hard.

Maybe we'll get active at the trade deadline now.

Something wasn't right, and I'm not buying fatigue.

I get the same feeling. This looked like a team that "quit" not a team that got outplayed.

Our lack of a center is really starting to hurt us.

Well what had happen was...

The Pistons knew they were given a gift last night so they made sure that they didn't win tonight and save Zeke's job...:) 65 points is enough to gurantee that the other team will win.

What happen to Tayshaun of the dead?> 0-10, no points, 3 boards and 0 assists. -23 in the +/-

Here are the hard fact folks on the 30.7% shooting.
Gay 0-10,
Ripped 1-7,
Stunkey 1-5
Allfull 1-6
Minxiel 1-3
Briczek 1-2
Fibbio 1-7
All Jayes 0-5
Player of the game AMir 3-3 who scored the last five and prevented the Pistons from setting a new franchise low in points

As bad as the bench was they still scored 23 points in the garbage time 4th qtr which was better than what starters did in any of the previous qtrs... half of those were on free throws as at least they know how to go to the paint

I get the same feeling. This looked like a team that "quit" not a team that got outplayed.

Our lack of a center is really starting to hurt us.

I see it more as a lack of a slasher and/or proper play calling to get high percentage shots. When this team struggles, they ALWAYS rely on the outside shot. We just do not have a coach that understands when the team needs to quit with the jump shot BS and attack the rim.

I see it more as a lack of a slasher and/or proper play calling to get high percentage shots. When this team struggles, they ALWAYS rely on the outside shot. We just do not have a coach that understands when the team needs to quit with the jump shot BS and attack the rim.

We have a coach who admits he doesn't care where the points come from. The Pistons shoot jumpers when they're tired, or when the defense gets tight or when they're cold. Just goes to show you how little emphasis Flip actually puts on the guys to get points in the paint. We're dead last in the points in the paint this year - and last year too, iirc.

I see it more as a lack of a slasher and/or proper play calling to get high percentage shots. When this team struggles, they ALWAYS rely on the outside shot. We just do not have a coach that understands when the team needs to quit with the jump shot BS and attack the rim.

When you are averaging close to 100 points a game and shoot only 30% against the Knicks and miss the Pistons all time low for points in a game by one point, it has nothing to do with taking jump shots and Flipper's offense.

They layed down on Flipper just like last night, but tonight was even more so. They don't want small ball.

:hoops:

I see it more as a lack of a slasher and/or proper play calling to get high percentage shots. When this team struggles, they ALWAYS rely on the outside shot. We just do not have a coach that understands when the team needs to quit with the jump shot BS and attack the rim.

I'll agree with that. I always thought that this team got by not b/c they were so talented, but b/c they maximized their talent in an intelligent and effective way. Rip after being at the "state fair" continued where he left off. It's telling that the bench even shooting that low of % get to the FT line and score enough PIP to outscore the Knicks.

But the need for a 4th big is pretty glaring too (if only as a band aid to our problems). Sheed is not Ben, and he doesn't want to be. We need a banger in the post. Or we need to play Amir and go a little more up tempo.

Something has to be done at the trading deadline.

And on a side note, Stuckey looks worse every game.

that was a scary game. Scary, because it reminded me of Detroit's poor play in the ECF against the Cavs last year. If the jumpshots don't fall, this team and its coach have absolutely no clue what to do.
Flip has a real problem if the starters can't get it done. Stuckey is still not ready to provide the spark off the bench many expected.
I'd love to see Flip try some adjustments, like benching Tay, who really has been in a slump for weeks. Just sending out messages. Try some stuff.
This team has been great this far, now is the ideal time to get prepared for the playoffs. I really don't want no other great season to see it ending the same way as last year. This team basically is good enough for a championship. The roster is awesome and JoeD has alot of trade material if JoeD thinks we need a slasher or a big. If the roster remains as it is, fine, the coach has tons of options. Herrmann has shown he can guard Nowitzki.
Afflalo and Stuckey can penetrate. JMax is getting doubled. Brezec can be solid. AJ is still a question mark but he surely doesn't hurt tha team.

With all these players, it should be possible to vary the rotations given the opponent. Get rid of the "starters get it done, bench tries not to give up too much of the lead"- attitude and this won't happen again.

This one was lost at exactly 4 minutes into the 2nd quarter, when Flip Saunders started subbing his starters back in. The starters who desperately needed some rest. On a 4th game in 5 nights, Flip Saunders still can't understand that he needs to go deep into the bench for the 2nd quarter. Pretty pathetic coaching.


Amir Johnson was our hero tonight, making a conventional 3 point play to give us our 65 point total, keeping us out of the record books for fewest points scored in franchise history.


Between Rip and Tay, they made one shot tonight. Pretty much 100% long range shots. I think Flip must have told them anything within 18 feet of the basket was called the forbidden zone. And they listened, avoiding the paint area like the plague.


Dyess got some rebounds, and made some shots. But his outside shooting really does not help us any. Somebody who could run down and impede Curry from getting right to the lane would have been more helpful.


Billups hit a few outside shots. But it looks like the team thinks that makes it ok for them to just shoot outside shots. Billups has to set the tone, and drive inside more to start games. Its ok to take the outside shot on occasion, but you can really go overboard on it.


None of our bench did any good. Bad shooting from everyone, including Hayes. The closest thing Flip did to an "adjustment" was to bring in Fabio about mid 3rd quarter, after we were way, way behind. We played a unit featuring Hayes at shooting guard for the first time this season. Thats Billups, Hayes, Fabio, Maxiell, Dyess. How slow a unit can one concoct? It would be hard for any coach to put a worse unit on the floor. I am sure Flip will keep trying though.


So we played a game with a bench, due to little playing time of late, was not much good, and a group of starters that were too tired to play. It did not have to be this way. We have a very deep team, with never any excuse to overplay anyone. Someone needs to either tell this to Saunders, or fire the guy.

I'll agree with that. I always thought that this team got by not b/c they were so talented, but b/c they maximized their talent in an intelligent and effective way. Rip after being at the "state fair" continued where he left off. It's telling that the bench even shooting that low of % get to the FT line and score enough PIP to outscore the Knicks.

But the need for a 4th big is pretty glaring too (if only as a band aid to our problems). Sheed is not Ben, and he doesn't want to be. We need a banger in the post. Or we need to play Amir and go a little more up tempo.

Something has to be done at the trading deadline.

And on a side note, Stuckey looks worse every game.

I agree his performance has fallen off since his hand was re-injured.

Stuckey is playing hurt. I don't know how bad his ankle is bothering him but his hand is probably a lot worse than the press has let out.

:hoops:

I agree his performance has fallen off since his hand was re-injured.

Stuckey is playing hurt. I don't know how bad his ankle is bothering him but his hand is probably a lot worse than the press has let out.

:hoops:
Then he needs to sit. I know we want to get him acclimated, but those injuries are clearly bothering him. Let him rest and recuperate, and not risk further injury.

And on a side note, Stuckey looks worse every game.

It started when he got some real full-contact practice time with the team. It's like Flip was keeping it simple at first, running pick and rolls, etc, and Stuckey was clicking right away. Then Stuckey got in a practice, and Flip started implementing his playbook. Now all he does is dribble the ball up the court and pass around the perimeter looking for an iso, or some idiotic high-post flex offense garbage. He only gets to his strength (breaking down the D off the dribble) in late clock situations.

I could write a book on what I don't like about Flip Saunders as a coach.

I could right a book on what I don't like about Flip Saunders as a coach.

Why don't you.

I am sure you would sell a few. I am sure Glen Taylor would be first in line for a copy.

:hoops:

Maybe we'll get active at the trade deadline now.

Something wasn't right, and I'm not buying fatigue.

You're right. Distinct rumors of a trade going down.

You're right. Distinct rumors of a trade going down.
Trade one of the so called best starting five in basketball for somebody who is not afraid to drive, penetrate, slash or get in the paint when necessary..maybe Zeke will give us Jamal before he is fired. Does Letrell Sprewell need any more money to feed them kids? We could hire him as a coach to show how its done:stirthepot:

Trade one of the so called best starting five in basketball for somebody who is not afraid to drive, penetrate, slash or get in the paint when necessary..maybe Zeke will give us Jamal before he is fired. Does Letrell Sprewell need any more money to feed them kids? We could hire him as a coach to show how its done:stirthepot:

I don't believe that it is a matter of fear, but a matter of lack of ability. No one wants to keep trying to do something in front of thousands of people that they can't do very well and wind up looking terrible in the process.

:hoops:

It started when he got some real full-contact practice time with the team. It's like Flip was keeping it simple at first, running pick and rolls, etc, and Stuckey was clicking right away. Then Stuckey got in a practice, and Flip started implementing his playbook. Now all he does is dribble the ball up the court and pass around the perimeter looking for an iso, or some idiotic high-post flex offense garbage. He only gets to his strength (breaking down the D off the dribble) in late clock situations.

I could write a book on what I don't like about Flip Saunders as a coach.

I saw him get the ball, start to shoot up court, then it looked like something clicked. He pulled a Chauncey, put his hand up to slow it down, and got or tried to get into some odd set. He definitely isn't being used to his strengths. That could be said about a majority of the players on this team.

I don't believe that it is a matter of fear, but a matter of lack of ability. No one wants to keep trying to do something in front of thousands of people that they can't do very well and wind up looking terrible in the process.

:hoops:
Every team needs somebody who can do it well with that ability. Our new guys try with limited success, but they are still learning. Get a vet who has the ability...I hate to lose Tay or Rip, but we can get more for them than Old Spidice

Come May a lousy loss in January will long be forgotten. I always just wonder how an elite team like the Pistons can keep their motivation up to beat the bottom feeder teams. Tonight a D-League team would have given Detroit a run for their money.

Flip is in a rut and he's just got to rearrange his team just a bit to get the best out of his players. Why is Sheed unhappy now? We live and die by Rasheed and his many moods so it pays to keep him happy if he's the horse we're riding. If Walter Herrmann is getting on his nerves than time to find a new home for Fabio, lots of teams would like him so package him with Flip Jr. and get a decent bench player.

It's certainly not a time to panic, other than Boston there's not a team out there that's clicking the way the Pistons are. Is it time to put Rip on the second unit and let Stuckey start? Would Rip throw a hissy fit and start sulking or would he see it as an opportunity to be the number one option anchoring the second unit.

The only player I'm worried about is Tay, he just has been so consistent and steady and now he's playing in a slump which is very unusual for him. He's got that consecutive streak going and maybe he's hurt and not letting on just to keep his streak going.

SAUNDERS: “I don’t know. Sometimes you go through series when you’re playing really well and there are points when you struggle. I think right now we’ve got some guys … who are not making some shots and I think it’s affected the rest of their game.”

And he called Jarvis one of our primary scorers :stirthepot:

Maybe we'll get active at the trade deadline now.

Something wasn't right, and I'm not buying fatigue.

Now you want to blow things up? They didn't look too bad 3 nights ago in one of their two best wins of the season, as we discussed at length in more than one thread. As disgraceful as tonight was, I don't see why it points to the need to trade someone. What trade will help you when 7 of your 9 primary rotation players are flat-out mailing it in for the night? Packaging Brezec, Herrmann, and Flip Jr. for the ghosts of Earl Monroe and Dave Bing?

And he called Jarvis one of our primary scorers :stirthepot:

What he said is totally BS. In fact knee high boots could protect you.

:hoops:

In the words of Jack Nicholson, "Somethings Got To Give" I'm in favor of adding something here, because if the half of the players continue to mail it in, and the 7 thru 9 players are playing inconistent then the 1-6 guys will be burned out by April...:(

In the words of Jack Nicholson, "Somethings Got To Give" I'm in favor of adding something here, because if the half of the players continue to mail it in, and the 7 thru 9 players are playing inconistent then the 1-6 guys will be burned out by April...:(

How about adding a real coach who coaches to players' strengths?

How about adding a real coach who coaches to players' strengths?

Do we fire Flip and promote from within, or get a Laimbeer, Fratello, Collins, Van Gundy, Skiles or bring back Brown or old man Daly? I know we are over reacting here, but I am giving you the authority to set up a poll.:)

At least the bench played, we all got to see the bench guys.

2 back-back sets in 5 days from Detroit to Texas and then Charlotte to NewYork. Do you all think fatigue could have something to do with it? Maybe if the team was younger or did not have to travel so far off an OT game. I don't know.

Lets see how they respond on the 2 game homestand before blowing any alarms.

The Bench played and they sucked as well so I don't know.

At least the bench played, we all got to see the bench guys.

2 back-back sets in 5 days from Detroit to Texas and then Charlotte to NewYork. Do you all think fatigue could have something to do with it? Maybe if the team was younger or did not have to travel so far off an OT game. I don't know.

Lets see how they respond on the 2 game homestand before blowing any alarms.

The Bench played and they sucked as well so I don't know.

Our bench outscored their bench in the 4th quarter by almost 40%.

:hoops:

i'm glad i chose football over this.

the pistons apparently didn't care too much, so why should we care as fans to watch them?

they won't generate any fan interest with performances like this. i'll never be a Flip supporter.

well, now you all know what it's like to be a knicks fan!

i don't see what people are complaining about - all 12 players played at least 12 minutes each! isn't that what everyone's been asking for????

:)

this isn't a game to analyze folks, it's a game to forget. this loss had nothing to do with flip's coaching, nothing to do with how good our team is compared to the knicks, and nothing to do with plays that were called. we just flat out sucked and got our @$$ kicked. let's leave it at that.

I suggest not letting the inmates run the prison. Time for Joe to tell the players to cut the crap. Deal with Flip when the season ends, if the team collapses in the playoffs. I'd rather see the malcontents traded.

Our bench outscored their bench in the 4th quarter by almost 40%.



Stucky 1-5, Afflalo 1-6, herman 1-6, Maxiel 1-3.
Only bright spot was Amir.

well, now you all know what it's like to be a knicks fan!

i don't see what people are complaining about - all 12 players played at least 12 minutes each! isn't that what everyone's been asking for????

:)

this isn't a game to analyze folks, it's a game to forget. this loss had nothing to do with flip's coaching, nothing to do with how good our team is compared to the knicks, and nothing to do with plays that were called. we just flat out sucked and got our @$$ kicked. let's leave it at that.

I agree. Especially given the context. But you had to know it was comming.

At least Flip had the guts to leave the bench in right?

It started when he got some real full-contact practice time with the team. It's like Flip was keeping it simple at first, running pick and rolls, etc, and Stuckey was clicking right away. Then Stuckey got in a practice, and Flip started implementing his playbook. Now all he does is dribble the ball up the court and pass around the perimeter looking for an iso, or some idiotic high-post flex offense garbage. He only gets to his strength (breaking down the D off the dribble) in late clock situations.

I could write a book on what I don't like about Flip Saunders as a coach.


Very good. As soon as flip started to coach him, he has regressed.

Just starting this off by saying I am an avid dallas cowboy fan and piston fan. How would you like to be me?

Mike Breen on the nyk network had the best line. They were interviewing zach randolph after the game. The reporter asked zach "what does this say about your team"? Zach replied "we are a great team, we just have to play hard and share the ball". To which breen said "obviously zach is delirious".

It is the best listening to walt frazier and mike breen. After the cowboys lost, frazier said that romo will be crucified and that you can have all the woman you want, but you better win the game.

Before the full practice, stuckey was playing on instinct and talent. Now that flip has introduced the infamous playbook, now he looks tentative and a little like billups without the outside shot. This is the real reason flip should be fired. You do not want another billups, you want contrast, you want a slasher, something different. Flip needs to stop playing him at two guard also. Let him learn one position.

Wish me luck at work tomorrow. It will be brutal.

Just starting this off by saying I am an avid dallas cowboy fan and piston fan. How would you like to be me?

Mike Breen on the nyk network had the best line. They were interviewing zach randolph after the game. The reporter asked zach "what does this say about your team"? Zach replied "we are a great team, we just have to play hard and share the ball". To which breen said "obviously zach is delirious".

It is the best listening to walt frazier and mike breen. After the cowboys lost, frazier said that romo will be crucified and that you can have all the woman you want, but you better win the game.

Before the full practice, stuckey was playing on instinct and talent. Now that flip has introduced the infamous playbook, now he looks tentative and a little like billups without the outside shot. This is the real reason flip should be fired. You do not want another billups, you want contrast, you want a slasher, something different. Flip needs to stop playing him at two guard also. Let him learn one position.

Wish me luck at work tomorrow. It will be brutal.
Good Luck!!! :gun1:

Stucky 1-5, Afflalo 1-6, herman 1-6, Maxiel 1-3.
Only bright spot was Amir.



I agree. Especially given the context. But you had to know it was comming.

At least Flip had the guts to leave the bench in right?

Our bench outscored their bench by 40% in the 4th quarter.

Go check the boxscore.

The bench consisted of 7 players tonight, not just the ones that played primarily in the first three quarters.

:hoops:

Our bench outscored their bench by 40% in the 4th quarter.

Go check the boxscore.

The bench consisted of 7 players tonight, not just the ones that played primarily in the first three quarters.



Still by you logic it would be 41 total points scored with a differential of 5 for 5/41 or 12% more. Factor in Amirs 3-pt play at the end and the fact that NY did not shoot on their last posetion and its pretty much even. I don't what can be made of garbage time anyway besides the fact that Amir got to play. I think its a natural tendancy to not want to run the score up too much. Besides our bench still got killed when it mattered before that.

It started when he got some real full-contact practice time with the team. It's like Flip was keeping it simple at first, running pick and rolls, etc, and Stuckey was clicking right away. Then Stuckey got in a practice, and Flip started implementing his playbook. Now all he does is dribble the ball up the court and pass around the perimeter looking for an iso, or some idiotic high-post flex offense garbage. He only gets to his strength (breaking down the D off the dribble) in late clock situations.

I could write a book on what I don't like about Flip Saunders as a coach.
So So So true. Stuckey is thinking way to hard out there. Why wont Flip let the kid just play the drive and kick game. Put AJ on a high screen and roll and when the defense adjusts to AJ hit Max on the low post, swing the ball weakside to Hayes or AA, it ain't that deep.

I had this great idea last night that I would chart each possession based on how many seconds there were on the shot clock when the Pistons got the ball across half court. Unforunately they didn't make enough shots to measure anything.

Stuckey does get the ball up faster than CB, by nearly two seconds, especially after CB has been on the floor for more than eight minutes. At least this game.

I'm already well on my way to forgetting this stinker.

cats with their usual overreaction. The Knicks/Hawks/Sonics/Wolves will beat good teams 4 times a year. Could be anyone. Just happened to be us this time. Although I would like a change, it isn't based on one darn game.

I find the team to be too settled in--always believing they can get out of any situation and not trying terribly hard because they're so 'cool' - so in that regard, I've wanted a change for some time now. But we might win the east by default because Boston's the only good team to play.

So So So true. Stuckey is thinking way to hard out there. Why wont Flip let the kid just play the drive and kick game. Put AJ on a high screen and roll and when the defense adjusts to AJ hit Max on the low post, swing the ball weakside to Hayes or AA, it ain't that deep.

I would LOVE to see Stuck, and Amir in the high screen and roll.

AA has shown a knack of being a great penetrator as well. Hopefully, Flip doesn't jump shot him to death. I've already noticed Stuckey taking more.

I would LOVE to see Stuck, and Amir in the high screen and roll.

AA has shown a knack of being a great penetrator as well. Hopefully, Flip doesn't jump shot him to death. I've already noticed Stuckey taking more.
Stuckey and J-Max ran pick-and-roll very well in the first games after Stuckey came back from injury with a pretty high success rate. J-Max either dunked or went to the line. Where did that whole thing go? Flip seems to hate pick-and-roll chosing to do pick-and-pop instead. Jump shots all the way, baby. :yellowprison:

Where did that whole thing go? Flip seems to hate pick-and-roll chosing to do pick-and-pop instead. Jump shots all the way, baby. :yellowprison:
When I played, I specialized in the wide open 3 point shot, the free throw and the post entry bounce pass. I was also good at running backwards.

When I played, I specialized in the wide open 3 point shot................. I was also good at running backwards.
One would have to be when you only shoot .1000 from beyond the arc....BRICK CITY BABY!!!!!

I would LOVE to see Stuck, and Amir in the high screen and roll.

AA has shown a knack of being a great penetrator as well. Hopefully, Flip doesn't jump shot him to death. I've already noticed Stuckey taking more.

I love watching AJ with Stuckey and AA on a fast break.

AJ blocks the shot. Stuckey grabs the lose ball throws it up court to AA who throws a allyoop to AJ for a throw down.

Now that is exciting.


:hoops:

Maybe this is better than a win because of Amir's good game.

Very interesting thoughts. And some dillusional ones. Here's the deal:

1. The pistons can only fire Flip if he loses the championship. True, we have a 29-10 record(which is pretty ludacris if you ask me), but the team development isn't there...or is it? I have to admit that we ALL can be some of the most selfish-spoiled fans in the NBA. We had LB gone 'during' the trophy presentation! Will there ever be ANY satisfaction? I hated the Knick loss as much as anyone (except Du4ev and Low), but as of tonight...I guess it WAS only one loss. But Flip aint goin nowhere, no time soon. The day of reckoning will come in only one way: if The Pistons end the season with a loss!

2. The rotation HAS to develop. BUT Brevic, Herrmann and Hayes will not be the answer. They play to dflip's gfailure to have a playbook that works to people's talents. His playbook only includes the starters strenghts and THAT"S why the bench cant run any plays for each other.
I hope practice isnt being wasted on developing THE STARTERS who dont need a coach to run their offense. They been together 5 freekin years. Give this team some life. Start someone else NOT just because of injury, for heaven's sake.

3. Maybe Rodney stuckey is a younger Flip murray(yeah I said his name).
He has truly regressed to the point where I see him doing exactly the same role #6 had. He's too eager to create his own shot and I 'know' he can pass the ball. It goes back to saunders.

4. And maybe this is all Joe D's fault. Where's his voice? Have the players tuned him out? Shouldnt they 'feared' the repercussions from a loss like that? If my kids did something to the equivalent of that effort, I would have(insert Flintstone's whistle here) !!! I need to here more from Joe, cuz right now , it's looking like we blew it on Nazr deal(again a sign of Flip's under-development).

5. Maybe BIG BEN saw the writing on the wall !?!

5. Maybe BIG BEN saw the writing on the wall !?!Yes...he got the cash, but he had better reason to leave.

Yes...he got the cash, but he had better reason to leave.


Wonder if Ben would like a "do over"........
I think he would jump at the chance..........

4. And maybe this is all Joe D's fault. Where's his voice? Have the players tuned him out? Shouldnt they 'feared' the repercussions from a loss like that? If my kids did something to the equivalent of that effort, I would have(insert Flintstone's whistle here) !!! I need to here more from Joe, cuz right now , it's looking like we blew it on Nazr deal(again a sign of Flip's under-development).

Wilson, or another of Davidson's flunkies, should slip a copy of the interview Joe D gave to Stoney and Wojo after the postseason onto Joe D.'s desk to remind him how low things can get when this team underperforms. Dumars needs to be reminded of what he said about the accountability of the starters.

I have to admit that we ALL can be some of the most selfish-spoiled fans in the NBA. We had LB gone 'during' the trophy presentation! Will there ever be ANY satisfaction?

Nope there will NEVER be any satisfaction. Some posters (most notably 356) MUST have someone to hate. It's the LAW!

Maybe Rodney stuckey is a younger Flip murray (yeah I said his name). He has truly regressed to the point where I see him doing exactly the same role #6 had. He's too eager to create his own shot and I 'know' he can pass the ball.

It's clear to me that Stuckey is worried about his hand. I understand he broke bones in what...three fingers? That can be HUGE for a rook who's game is driving to the hole. He ain't been the same since the injury.

4. And maybe this is all Joe D's fault. Where's his voice? Have the players tuned him out? Shouldnt they 'feared' the repercussions from a loss like that?

I bet Joe ain't too worried about this loss. The Knicks were pumped playing Zeke's former team on their home court, especially after a back to back. No Starbury, so they played loose. Zack and Curry are nightmare matchups for us and Balkman played outta his mind. Throw in good games by Lee and Crawford and the Knicks showed they are capable of surprising anyone.

Our guys were out of it early. We had a lid on our basket as nobody could hit a dayum thing; bench included. This was "one of those nights," hands down.

Wonder if Zeke will gift us Balkman for Fabio or Hays? He (Balkman) looks like he should be in a Piston's uni.

Wonder if Ben would like a "do over"........
I think he would jump at the chance..........Likewise, I wonder if Joe would like a "do over" in choosing a coach. If all choices in life were granted mulligans, we might all be satisfied.

I need to here more from Joe, cuz right now , it's looking like we blew it on Nazr deal(again a sign of Flip's under-development).

Dude, put that crack pipe down. You've known this league long enough not to fall for the old trick where some guy immediately starts putting up better numbers once he joins a crappy team.

And did you really just blame Flip for the "under-development" of a guy who'd already been in the league for 8 years before he signed with the Pistons?! What's next, Flip Sr. being responsible for the "under-development" of Flip Jr.?

Good post Schoo, but don't you need to blame the starters for not including Nazz? I thought he got a fair chance (only because he is a vet).
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How about this, the starters stink up another , oh say to the Wolves, so the bench can get some serious burn. You know the starters talk about the situation amongst themselves all the time. It's CB's team and Sheed is sargent at arms.
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I liked CB's answer after the game,"I washed it out in the shower".