At Philadelphia Jan 23 7PM

tv: FSN

If the Pistons can't end the losing streak here then I don't know.

An unsullied thread...

Monday's effort would have beaten the Sixers fairly handily and I expect a little more tonight. Rip and Sheed like to play for the home folks.

Hopefully we can contain AI.

You aint funny TaS.
Run the bench, the starters don't need that much practice.

You aint funny TaS.


I wasn't joking. He's averaging 20/game and getting a lot of steals. He's had 10+ free throw attempts 7 times already this year.

They have had a lot of close losses to some good teams, so they are probably not as bad as their record. They recently beat Tor and Houston (on the road)

Do not attach any importance to whether we win or lose this game.

Instead, just look at who plays. If Saunders does not play the right people, with sufficient minutes and instead just continues to burn out our stars, we are in trouble.

Now, he will probably make some noise like, wow, we have to stop this 3 game losing streak, and want to shorten his rotation. But look, I will post here the boxscore of the Boston game, where we lost, while using an 8 man rotation. In the name of a big game.

"The big game" Its the excuse that started this bad streak. Nobody fall for it tonight, please.

ESPN - Boston vs. Detroit Box Score, January 05, 2008 (http://tinyurl.com/2htcad)

Lee, nice job posting a link. I agree we should be getting 10 guys onto the floor in the first half.

Hopefully the 8 man rotation idea is out the window. Love to see 10 men out there especially if Walter and Primoz aren't among them.

I'm tempted to say this is a big game.

Chat is open, I will be skipping chat tonight.

http://www.pistonsforum.com/misc.php?do=flashchat

nJoy!

AJ sighting in the first half. That collective thud was several Pistons fans falling off the couch at once.

AJ sighting in the first half. That collective thud was several Pistons fans falling off the couch at once.

Ha ha ah ah ha ah a a ha ha ah ha a ha ha

AJ sighting in the first half. That collective thud was several Pistons fans falling off the couch at once.

:MusicBigGrin:
Nice overall game for him, only 5 points, few rust-related misses, but a very solid game for him. Afflalo too. Stuckey got fouled on that missed dunk too.

Wll it appears that Amir finally got that picture of Flip in an uncompromising position and he had to play him. :)In fact both kids from California, AJ and AA got more minutes than both Max and Hayes, and they made the most of it. Although AJ missed a couple of ez putbacks in the 4th, he still scored 5 pts. grabbed 5 boards and blocked 2 shots. He may not be a prolific scorer like Hayes, but his defense and board work made up for it.

Well, well, look who got minutes tonight...Amir and AA each played 14-15, as 10 players in all saw the floor. The starters all played between 35 and 38 total, but not many together as a unit, as there were a lot of different combinations out there. JMax only played 10 minutes while Hayes had 6. The Sixers crashed the boards for a big advantage, 47-33, but the Pistons took advantage of lots of Philly turnovers and also had a big edge at the FT line. Rip and CB going 15-24 from the floor was the big factor on offense.

AA and Amir played together for much of the 2nd quarter, hustling on both ends and making a nice impact, mostly in a unit with Tay, CB, and Dice. That 5-man group turned an even game into a solid lead, which stretched out to 9 by halftime. The Sixers got back within 5 a couple of times in the second half, but never got any closer than that.

Wll it appears that Amir finally got that picture of Flip in an uncompromising position and he had to play him. :)In fact both kids from California, AJ and AA got more minutes than both Max and Hayes, and they made the most of it. Although AJ missed a couple of ez putbacks in the 4th, he still scored 5 pts. grabbed 5 boards and blocked 2 shots. He may not be a prolific scorer like Hayes, but his defense and board work made up for it.

He is a better scorer than Hayes.

:hoops:

He is a better scorer than Hayes.

:hoops:


I know, but we are waiting for Flip to let him prove it to us:)

That wasn't so hard now, was it? I was falling asleep on (Not falling off) the couch when the Amirgeddon happened. He doesn't have to dominate, just 5-8 minutes to help keep the main cogs fresh. Anything else is a bonus.

I almost can't believe the box score when I look at the minutes. It doesn't seem like the starters played that many minutes. Even when I win, I lose.

That was as close to resembling a rotation as I've ever seen from the Flipster. There is definitely room for improvement, but I'll take what I can get right now.

Amir as the 4th big? AA playing small forward? I think it was take suggestions from the form night. Please keep it up.

AJ is an impact player.

:hoops:

Have to believe that Joe read Flip's comments about possibly benching Stuckey, and he realized that he better put his foot down and get some pt for the kids before they became the next Darko and Delfino's and started demanding one way tickets out of Detroit.

Great game. It was not perfect, but a great step toward playoff preparation. Tonight, I am only going with positives.


Stuckey did not play a ton in this game, but he played enough. He got some late 2nd quarter minutes along with about 5 minutes between the quarters each half. He was part of a shutout pitched against Philly to start the 4th quarter. He did not score, but he did not hurt us either while giving CB some rest.


Afflalo got 15 minutes. A fiery ball of energy out there. He got to the rack a few times for us for scores.


Amir was pretty awesome. Yep, he came short on his few post moves, but remember, those are like the first set of post moves he has been given to take in well over a month. Amir does normally make those shots. Amir also got 15 minutes. Five rebounds, 2 blocks, a bunch of shots they could not take or missed from his presence, and a few times where we got the ball from him fighting for a bound. He did make a couple offensive rebound putbacks and one of two at the line.


Hayes was limited to 6 minutes, and Saunder kept him off the floor when Stuckey was out there. Afflalo got his minutes in the 2nd half. (Which resulted in no points for Philly while Afflalo was out there.)


The Pistons took control of the game in the last minutes of the 1st half,with both Stuckey and Amir on the floor.


For the most part, despite some really hot shooting by both Billups and Rip in the first half, all our starters did all game long was trade baskets with Philly. In the first half, we scored plenty, but so did they with our starters in the game. In contrast, when guys like Afflalo and Amir were in, the Philly team just could not find a bucket except by shear luck upon occasion.


Tay had a decent game. So did Sheed, although his rebounding and points totals were low.


Dyess played about 35 minutes.


While Philly was manhanling our starters on the boards pretty badly, Amir and JMAX turned the tide our way when they were in. Stuckey and Afflalo also help on rebounding.


We did get to see Amir and JMAX together as a pair of bigs briefly. Other than Dalembert scoring on Amir the one time, it worked out fine. But it was a rather brief time. Maxiell only played 10 minutes in this game. He got stripped on a couple of post possesions, but he had some fine moments on the offensive glass too. I am not too worried about Maxiell playing short minutes in this game as he has been complaining about tired legs of late.


Hayes made a short shot on a cut to the basket.
Stuckey had a steal, and had an easy dunk attempt. He did not miss for nothing. A replay showed he was fouled. (His leg was hit to knock him off course.)


Feelings of elation were frequent and long from watching this game. A whole lot of people loved watching Amir play tonight. Like a cool drink of water in the desert after a long, long thirst.


If this keeps up, with the youngsters playing, I suggest everyone start buying tickets again, as they will go fast.


GO PISTONS!!!!!

Feelings of elation were frequent and long from watching this game. A whole lot of people loved watching Amir play tonight. Like a cool drink of water in the desert after a long, long thirst.



I wish I could have used this as my HS yearbook quote.........

AJ sighting in the first half. That collective thud was several Pistons fans falling off the couch at once.

You have no idea. I switched channels b/c the game was boring, and when i switched back i saw Amir/Afflalo. I thought i was dreaming. Seriously. I had to turn the tv off and on just to make sure.

Joe D definitely said something. There's no other explanation for Flip's schizophrenic rotations.

I like AA out there w/ Rip/Chauncey too.

:MusicBigGrin:
Nice overall game for him, only 5 points, few rust-related misses, but a very solid game for him. Afflalo too. Stuckey got fouled on that missed dunk too.

definitely rust-related. He usually makes those.

Sprocket Cap

Coming off a three game losing streak, the Pistons play a methodical game to beat the Sixers in Philadelphia 86 to 78. Superb play from the starting guards, who account for 40 of the Pistons’ points, and improved play off the bench proves to be too much for the 16 and 28 Sixers.

The Pistons start the game with a clear mission, to share the ball and to avoid long jumpshots. All five starters take one shot each in the first three minutes, a post move each from Sheed and Dyess, drives to the basket from Prince and Rip, and a short jumper from Billups on the break start the game. Only the backcourt actually manages to put the ball in the hoop, but still the intent was fun to watch. The starting guards continue to strike for the Pistons, scoring all 16 of the team’s points in the first seven minutes of the game. Billups then hits his third three of the quarter, but heads to the bench with his second foul at the 2:34 mark. A fairly long stretch of zone defense helps to hold the Sixers in check.

The bench struggles however to finish the quarter with Stuckey and then Maxiell committing the team’s first two turnovers of the game. The quarter ends with the Pistons up by two on a near airball from Stuckey. The Sixers dominate the quarter on the boards 12 to 4, with 6 on the offensive end, none for the Pistons.

The Sixers start the second half pressing and while they don’t produce any steals in the backcourt, the pressure leaves the Pistons little time on the clock to set up their offense and they continue to turn the ball over, giving it up two more times in the first two minutes of the quarter. Fortunately for the Pistons the Sixers also play fast and loose with the ball. Still, they make up the first quarter deficit and only an offensive board and dunk from Amir Johnson pulls the Pistons even at 36 at the five minute mark. The Pistons go back to the zone, and a nice stretch with Stuckey, Affalo, Prince, Maxiell, and Johnson in the game stretches the lead to nine on the back of an 18-5 run.

The Pistons continue their hot shooting in the second and end the half at 58%, on 11-19 from two and 4-9 from three. They make up a good part of the rebounding gap in the second, especially on the offensive end with three more offensive boards than the Sixers in the period.

A 4-0 start by the Pistons in the third continues the run and forces the Sixers to call timeout less than a minute into the period. The wheels come off the Piston’s game after that though and the Sixers respond to Cheeks’ tongue-lashing with a 10-2 run to make the score 64-58 Pistons at the 3:28 mark. The teams trade baskets the rest of the way, with the Pistons adding one point to the lead to finish the quarter at 70 to 63. After scoring 25 in each of the first two quarters the Pistons only manage 20 in the third, with the worst yet to come.

A soccer game breaks out in the fourth quarter as both teams combine to score one point (by the Sixers) in the first three minutes of the period. Stuckey shows he has been listening to Lindsey by coming up both with a very Hunteresque steal and a missed dunk on the run-out. At the seven minute mark of the period the teams have shot a combined one for eighteen for the period, with the sole field goal coming from the Pistons. The Pistons’ lead stays at seven the rest of the way until a Rip free throw ends the scoring for the 30th Pistons’ victory of the season.

The starters end up playing fairly heavy minutes, ranging from Dyess at 35 to Prince at 38. Still, four bench players have ten minutes or more with 26 from the rookie guards and 15 from Amir Johnson. The bench ends up shooting fairly poorly (37%) with a fair number of missed layups, but provide a nice spark on the defensive end and engineer a very nice run in the second.

Stuckey shows he has been listening to Lindsey by coming up both with a very Hunteresque steal and a missed dunk on the run-out.

LOL...how true it is. Thanks for another good Sprocket-cap.

Lee, nice job posting a link. I agree we should be getting 10 guys onto the floor in the first half.

If this doesn't prove Flip reads my posts, what does?

Flip came through for us!

The key is for Amir to take advantage of nights like this (which I would say that he did) so that Saunders starts to rely on him. He really does have a noticable impact on the game. True to his previous stats, he was our most productive rebounder and shot blocker tonight. And as anyone who watched will realize, his athleticism keeps the ball alive.

It will be fun seeing Amir and Maxiell have a breakout game as a tandem... ala the goon squad game last year.

Afflalo looks really athletic on offense too. He was displaying the aggressiveness that he had in the early season tonight.

And Stuckey, well, the PG spot is tough. If it took Chauncey 5 years to get it, then it's understandable that Stuck isn't clicking yet.


Overall, it is obvious to me that we have talented bench players with Piston DNA, and the most important thing is the way that Flip conducts. Tonight, he did it right. However, we got off to a great start with CB and Rip hitting shots, which made it easier to do.

Wonder if the Bobcat experiment with primofabio is over and Flip is now ready to give the A's the minutes needed to get enough experience get the on his "comfy" list.

You know how Flip is...if it worked well in one game or even one quarter, he forgets and reverts back to his old bad rotation habits.

We still need to figure out what to with the old Bobcats so even if the our newbies somehow or another show brilliance over the 3 weeks, we still need somebody to stop the penetration when Turkaloo, James, Labron and Nocioni are ready to penetrate in the 4th quater and Dice and Tay get tired and Flip ain't feeling AJ....

http://t4.images.live.com/images/thumbnail.aspx?q=1475927614351&id=39afb5336dc258a9b3be6ef07494f914 http://t3.images.live.com/images/thumbnail.aspx?q=1501733853722&id=ad65550750e2e185767e27fbeb6b851a

Ugliest most unimpressive win of the year......yet the BEST win of the year. Flip said he told Joe that a 4th big was needed......not sure if Joe said, "Gee Flip, ya think....Maybe that kid we gave a frickin contract extension to, that I hyped up all OFF SEASON!!!!!"

McCosky talked him up on his game writeup. So perhaps this is permanant. I hope Flip has the patience to endure some growing pains.
Pistons find their groove (http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080124/SPORTS0102/801240327/1127)


Nice to get the win.

McCosky talked him up on his game writeup. So perhaps this is permanant. I hope Flip has the patience to endure some growing pains.
Pistons find their groove (http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080124/SPORTS0102/801240327/1127)


Nice to get the win.

Flip is a retard. Just a few days ago he said that Amir is not ready. Now he's saying: "I just thought the way Amir had practiced, things he'd done, his length, blocking shots, I thought he was a guy we'd start giving some minutes to see what he'd do in the right situation. "I thought he was dynamite."

Is he on some kind of drugs with frequent brainwave swings???

Flip is a retard. Just a few days ago he said that Amir is not ready. Now he's saying:
Is he on some kind of drugs with frequent brainwave swings???

nah, Joe straightened Flip out. Flip is just talking this up like it's his idea to save some face.

Considering AJ hasn't truly played in months, he was very impressive. Definitely gave us that energy that this team needs. Max can't be our sole source of energy. Sometimes he isn't enough, and there are nights when he just won't have it. He and Afflalo were a good tandem.

Flip's gotta get him in there consistently though, now. You can't tease him by talking him up saying things like "he was dynamite", and then not work him in for at least 5 minutes a game or so every single game.

I just wish it hadn't taken this long. 3 months of the season wasted, and now he's got to catch up quick. Kind of like Max last year. Flip waited too long to get him into regular minutes, and it hurt us in the playoffs.

Wow.........Flip gets hammered for changing his lineup. I just figure that they lost 3 in a row and Flip just shook things up. His Psychologist said he didn't go schitzo on us. Just the right move by a good coach. Seeing Afflalo and Amir go plus 12 and plus 8, while the rest of the reserves registered minuses was refreshing for me. Just like I said, give Flip til February to start playing the reserves. Hopefully both guys see an increase in their minutes.

nah, Joe straightened Flip out. Flip is just talking this up like it's his idea to save some face.

Considering AJ hasn't truly played in months, he was very impressive. Definitely gave us that energy that this team needs. Max can't be our sole source of energy. Sometimes he isn't enough, and there are nights when he just won't have it. He and Afflalo were a good tandem.

Flip's gotta get him in there consistently though, now. You can't tease him by talking him up saying things like "he was dynamite", and then not work him in for at least 5 minutes a game or so every single game.

I just wish it hadn't taken this long. 3 months of the season wasted, and now he's got to catch up quick. Kind of like Max last year. Flip waited too long to get him into regular minutes, and it hurt us in the playoffs.

Apparently, Flip's remarks are open to interpretation. Two sites, detnews.com, and mlive.com, reported it as Flip saying he suggested playing Amir. But, freep.com put it different, saying Flip and Dumars had a conversation and Flip and Dumars came to an agreement that they should play Amir more.

Apparently, Flip's remarks are open to interpretation. Two sites, detnews.com, and mlive.com, reported it as Flip saying he suggested playing Amir. But, freep.com put it different, saying Flip and Dumars had a conversation and Flip and Dumars came to an agreement that they should play Amir more.


Wouldn't it be nice to have full access to all of the conversations between the Piston players, coaches, administrators, scouts, and owner...kind of like a reality show?

Only saw short stretches of the game last night, but did see AJ a bit. Glad to hear that he had a good performance overall, because from the evidence I saw I was liking Sixers Jason Smith much better than AJ.

AJ dosen't box out his man - at least not for very long. We gave up a bunch of second and third opportunities during the stretches I saw. He may bring an occasional second chance for us on the offensive end, but it was very frustrating watching him work on the defensive boards.

Given what I saw, I was even more shocked to see Flip's comments about his performance. His performance seemed to confirm to me what Flip has said in the past about AJ, especially about defensive rebounding. It was AJ's man that was getting the rebounds - because AJ didn't sustain his box out effort. I thought "effort" was what he was supposed to bring. Maybe he still dosen't get some of the fundamentals.

Flip said the same thing about Max early on this season ("you have to be better on the defensive glass.") Max went out and showed him some improvement. I didn't see the same improvement from AJ.

But let me repeat, I only saw limited glimpses of his play last night. Just wasn't too impressed with what I did see.

Only saw short stretches of the game last night, but did see AJ a bit. Glad to hear that he had a good performance overall, because from the evidence I saw I was liking Sixers Jason Smith much better than AJ.

AJ dosen't box out his man - at least not for very long. We gave up a bunch of second and third opportunities during the stretches I saw. He may bring an occasional second chance for us on the offensive end, but it was very frustrating watching him work on the defensive boards.

Given what I saw, I was even more shocked to see Flip's comments about his performance. His performance seemed to confirm to me what Flip has said in the past about AJ, especially about defensive rebounding. It was AJ's man that was getting the rebounds - because AJ didn't sustain his box out effort. I thought "effort" was what he was supposed to bring. Maybe he still dosen't get some of the fundamentals.

Flip said the same thing about Max early on this season ("you have to be better on the defensive glass.") Max went out and showed him some improvement. I didn't see the same improvement from AJ.

But let me repeat, I only saw limited glimpses of his play last night. Just wasn't too impressed with what I did see.

You know, there are a lot of guys on the Pistons that don't rebound very well. Next time you watch a game, look at all of the Piston players when an opponent's shot goes up. There is more standing around watching the shot then there is finding a guy, putting a body on him, and seeling out. Some of the Piston starters were much worse at this last night than Amir.

The biggest problem I saw with Amir last night was his lack of size and strength. In a half-court set, he was getting pushed around and dislodged from his position on both the offensive and defensive end.

You know, there are a lot of guys on the Pistons that don't rebound very well. Next time you watch a game, look at all of the Piston players when an opponent's shot goes up. There is more standing around watching the shot then there is finding a guy, putting a body on him, and seeling out. Some of the Piston starters were much worse at this last night than Amir.

The biggest problem I saw with Amir last night was his lack of size and strength. In a half-court set, he was getting pushed around and dislodged from his position on both the offensive and defensive end.

All a good debate. But the main fact, that other team could not score a bucket if their lives depended on it while Amir was in the game, says volumes. Amir more than covers up any mistakes with a combination of great speed and quickness, length, and seriously good ups.

First of all, why does Flip need to ask permission from Joe to play Amir... or even suggest that he's thinking about it? That is the coaches job.

That is why this is BS. They met and Joe told him to play Amir. Flip spun it to seem like it was his idea.

As far as the rebounding goes, Amir was up against some pretty good rebounders, especially Reggie Evans. But Evans and Dalembert got 0 rebounds in the last 5:00 minutes of the second Q when Amir was in. Smith and Young each had 1 rebound in the 4th when Amir was in. So most of the rebounding damage came from the guards during those stretches. Meanwhile, our stud pseudo-rookie pulled down 4 offensive during those stretches. A few great rebounders do it without boxing out.

I don't buy Flip's explanation that he talked to Dumars about needing a fourth big either, TaS. Not at all. I think it was more Dumars telling Flip that we need to develop Amir.

Flip simply can't be this stupid. Seems like he's trying to "save face."

Either way, I'm glad that something happened. I have always thought that if Joe is going to have a coach like Flip, that Joe needs to take some control.

If you hire LB, it's hard to tell him what to do. But Flip is maleable.

I trust Dumars' judgment completely. I was just worried that he wasn't mandating certain things to the coach. And now it looks like he probably is. All is well.

As far as the rebounding goes, Amir was up against some pretty good rebounders, especially Reggie Evans. But Evans and Dalembert got 0 rebounds in the last 5:00 minutes of the second Q when Amir was in. Smith and Young each had 1 rebound in the 4th when Amir was in. So most of the rebounding damage came from the guards during those stretches. Meanwhile, our stud pseudo-rookie pulled down 4 offensive during those stretches. A few great rebounders do it without boxing out.

I hear you - maybe AJ will be a great "offensive" rebounder. That would be a great asset to the team. But only one defensive rebound in 15 minutes from an interior forward? (I can't call him a 4, lest all the "AJ is a 3" proponents chime in.) Even Sheed does better than that. AJ can do better, and it's the coaching staff's job to make sure that he understands that he must do better.

We need defensive rebounding help - especially when the playoffs arrive.

That is why I think that he and JMax should be split up. They are too similar in the way that they rebound and score.

Dyess and Sheed are similar as well, but in an opposite way.

I don't really care who starts and who comes off the bench, but I would suggest that JMax and Amir get split up. They both like to hang around the paint, clean up garbage, get offensive boards and get unconventional defensive boards. Sheed and Dyess both like to float outside, yet they do a nice job of holding their position and boxing out on defense.

Combining the young athletic rebounding with the old traditional box outs could give us the best of both worlds.

Also, Sheed and Dyess need somebody to clean up all their missed jump shots on the weak side.

I don't buy Flip's explanation that he talked to Dumars about needing a fourth big either, TaS. Not at all. I think it was more Dumars telling Flip that we need to develop Amir.

Flip simply can't be this stupid. Seems like he's trying to "save face."
Joe knows politics as well. Maybe he told Flip to play Amir, but spin it like it was Flip's idea so that he doesn't totally lose whatever he's got left of players respect. Imagine newspaper article with heading "Joe mandates Flip to play Amir".

Joe knows politics as well. Maybe he told Flip to play Amir, but spin it like it was Flip's idea so that he doesn't totally lose whatever he's got left of players respect. Imagine newspaper article with heading "Joe mandates Flip to play Amir".

Yep. The "improving in practice" angle was a nice touch too. It makes it seem like he wasn't worthy before, but through Flip's disciplined approach, he has been building his skills behind the scenes and has finally proved himself to his sensi.

Whatever the reasons for Amir. I wish it would have happened earlier. I don't think Wally did anything to deserver to be ahead of Amir, that was a joke. But it did happend so thats the main thing.

We need a 4th big? New flash there is this thing called foul trouble that has been partly why you lost the last 2 ECF's because Dyess and Sheed are both very prone to it.

Anyway. He is finally getting it right so this is really going to help. Better late than never.

Whatever the reasons for Amir. I wish it would have happened earlier. I don't think Wally did anything to deserver to be ahead of Amir, that was a joke. But it did happend so thats the main thing.

We need a 4th big? New flash there is this thing called foul trouble that has been partly why you lost the last 2 ECF's because Dyess and Sheed are both very prone to it.

Anyway. He is finally getting it right so this is really going to help. Better late than never.
True dat. Just not sure why Wally is not ahead of Hayes at this point. We get nothing, absolute zilch from Jarvis. When he is on - he is a help, when he is off - he is a hindrance to the team. The problem is that he is on 2 games off 6.

True dat. Just not sure why Wally is not ahead of Hayes at this point. We get nothing, absolute zilch from Jarvis. When he is on - he is a help, when he is off - he is a hindrance to the team. The problem is that he is on 2 games off 6.

I'm down for giving his minutes to Herrmann for a little while to see how it goes. But I'm definitely not convinced that he'll do much better. I just don't think we've seen enough from him to know yet. He's hit a couple 3's, made a couple reverse baseline lay-ups and played some good D in stretches. But he really hasn't seen many extended minutes like Hayes.

I have seen enough of Hayes to know what he brings. Basically, he's the streakiest shooter on the team, who can post up with mild success on smaller defenders. He tries hard on D, but the other team sees him as the weak link and attacks him constantly.

I'm down for giving his minutes to Herrmann for a little while to see how it goes. But I'm definitely not convinced that he'll do much better. I just don't think we've seen enough from him to know yet. He's hit a couple 3's, made a couple reverse baseline lay-ups and played some good D in stretches. But he really hasn't seen many extended minutes like Hayes.

I have seen enough of Hayes to know what he brings. Basically, he's the streakiest shooter on the team, who can post up with mild success on smaller defenders. He tries hard on D, but the other team sees him as the weak link and attacks him constantly.
Yep, exactly my thinking on this. I wonder if they ever give Herrmann a chance.

I like how the Det News stated that one of the reasons the bench played so well was because of a talk with the coaches. They just thought of talking to them and explaining what they want? These guys are really on the cutting edge!

Calling Flip a retard is an insult to retards.

DET gets killed on the boards because they have one of their bigs show on pick & rolls. Then, instead of having said big take the roller back, they switch with the other big. If a shot goes up quick enough, they are outmanned on the glass. That happened all game long, not just when Amir was in.

If Flip Murray took some of the shots that Stuckey did, this place would be burning.

That is why I think that he and JMax should be split up. They are too similar in the way that they rebound and score.

Dyess and Sheed are similar as well, but in an opposite way.

I don't really care who starts and who comes off the bench, but I would suggest that JMax and Amir get split up. They both like to hang around the paint, clean up garbage, get offensive boards and get unconventional defensive boards. Sheed and Dyess both like to float outside, yet they do a nice job of holding their position and boxing out on defense.

Combining the young athletic rebounding with the old traditional box outs could give us the best of both worlds.

Also, Sheed and Dyess need somebody to clean up all their missed jump shots on the weak side.

I agree w/ this. It seems from what i've seen so far, Amir plays better with Sheed and Max plays good with either one. Amir will balance out Sheed's lack of aggressiveness at times (and maybe make him more energetic), and Dyess' rebounding will help offset the times Max isn't boarding well (and help Dyess' defense).

I don't think you need to switch the starting line-up, but take either one out mid-first quarter, and put Amir or Max in depending on who you leave in.

That also needs to be done with Afflalo as he plays better with Chauncey, or put Chauncey/Afflalo in to finish the half. Rip/Chauncey can finish the game, start the quarters; they don't need to be in together all the time. Also when Stuckey gets more comfortable, Afflalo/him together will work, but our forwards in the game need to be aggressive (*cough" Tayshaun).

The only negative i saw last night were the starters still played heavy minutes, and Amir's time seem to cut into Max's. We can and should play them both 15-20 min.

Someone should tell Flip blowouts are not the only way for the starters to rest.

Everybody plays better with Billups.

If this doesn't prove Flip reads my posts, what does?
Well, it's long been proposed on this forum that you are the superior coach.

Wouldn't it be nice to have full access to all of the conversations between the Piston players, coaches, administrators, scouts, and owner...kind of like a reality show?
If I was on the other team, for sure. :)

Regards,

Bill Belichick

Gotta admit I love the fact that Flip remembered he has more than 2 guys on his bench last night. But based on the minutes the starters played it is obvious this was a Joe mandate. I really see no reason why we should be playing any of those guys close to 40 minutes a night. Since we supposedly we have a great bench, one of the deepest in the league...

I'm down for giving his minutes to Herrmann for a little while to see how it goes. But I'm definitely not convinced that he'll do much better. I just don't think we've seen enough from him to know yet. He's hit a couple 3's, made a couple reverse baseline lay-ups and played some good D in stretches. But he really hasn't seen many extended minutes like Hayes.

I have seen enough of Hayes to know what he brings. Basically, he's the streakiest shooter on the team, who can post up with mild success on smaller defenders. He tries hard on D, but the other team sees him as the weak link and attacks him constantly.


Makes me wish that Fino would have gotten the same consistent minutes while he was here.

If Flip Murray took some of the shots that Stuckey did, this place would be burning.

That's because Flip Murray still takes some of those shots that Stuckey took last night or worse. Stuckey is a rookie with 18 games of experience at 15 minutes per.

Murray is not!!!

Makes me wish that Fino would have gotten the same consistent minutes while he was here.

Yeah, I think that at this point it is fairly obvious that Delfino is more valuable that Hayes. Not sure if that would have been the case if he would have stayed here though.

Delfino is shooting better with a .506 eFG%. He rebounds better. And he definitely is a better defender. Also, Carlos gets in the paint for 24% of his attempts vs. only 17% for Hayes.

Live and learn.

Yeah, I think that at this point it is fairly obvious that Delfino is more valuable that Hayes. Not sure if that would have been the case if he would have stayed here though.

Delfino is shooting better with a .506 eFG%. He rebounds better. And he definitely is a better defender. Also, Carlos gets in the paint for 24% of his attempts vs. only 17% for Hayes.

Live and learn.
And he stayed at Holiday Inn Express...
:stirthepot:

True dat. Just not sure why Wally is not ahead of Hayes at this point. We get nothing, absolute zilch from Jarvis. When he is on - he is a help, when he is off - he is a hindrance to the team. The problem is that he is on 2 games off 6.

Wally for Hayes is a different scnerio. Your description of 2 on and 6 can equally describe Hayes as well. I believe SF is more Wallys natural position so that may be worth a shot. Maybe try 1 in any given game and if they don't have it try the other. Or just double Amir or Maxiel also as the backup SF kind of how Corliss was used.

There is a theme here, the same theme as with Flip Murray. Min contract players usually play like min contract players.

I really don't don't know what people expected from Hayes. He was dumped by the Wiz and replaced by a rookie.

His pay is at about the bottom of the NBA totem pole for a player with 4 or more years in the league.

He is actually shooting better this year than he has for his career.

You get what you pay for.

Maybe he just isn't the same player that he was before the injuries or maybe his college game didn't translate into an NBA game. He wouldn't be the first nor the last guy that that has happened to.

:hoops:

I really don't don't know what people expected from Hayes. He was dumped by the Wiz and replaced by a rookie.

His pay is at about the bottom of the NBA totem pole for a player with 4 or more years in the league.

He is actually shooting better this year than he has for his career.

You get what you pay for.

Maybe he just isn't the same player that he was before the injuries or maybe his college game didn't translate into an NBA game. He wouldn't be the first nor the last guy that that has happened to.



True but he was really hyped by the Pistons. I don't know why they always feel as though they have to hype new players so much because it builds up expectations too high but they always do.

He is a better scorer than Hayes.

:hoops:

flip will play amir because he doesn't want any part of webber

flip will play amir because he doesn't want any part of webber

Interesting theory.

:hoops:

If Flip Murray took some of the shots that Stuckey did, this place would be burning.
I agree. Flip Murray right now is a better option than Stuckey. Lindsey has actually PROVEN that the 2nd unit is better with Lindsey on the floor. Stuckey needs soem time, he's struggling big time with the transistion of position and leagues.

I agree. Flip Murray right now is a better option than Stuckey. Lindsey has actually PROVEN that the 2nd unit is better with Lindsey on the floor. Stuckey needs soem time, he's struggling big time with the transistion of position and leagues.

Stuckey needs to get the playing time. We get no advantage by playing Murray. Stuckey is way better defender than Flip could ever dream of being. Pistons need to get Stuckey ready for the playoffs.

Stuckey needs to get the playing time. We get no advantage by playing Murray. Stuckey is way better defender than Flip could ever dream of being. Pistons need to get Stuckey ready for the playoffs.
the contrast between how well the 2nd unit plays with hunter as the backup compared to Stuckey is glaring to say the least. now flipM...well....sometimes his dribble penetration is refreshing, he can finish rather well, when the ball doesn't grow wings and fly out of his hands from time to time.

the contrast between how well the 2nd unit plays with hunter as the backup compared to Stuckey is glaring to say the least. now flipM...well....sometimes his dribble penetration is refreshing, he can finish rather well, when the ball doesn't grow wings and fly out of his hands from time to time.

But what does Murray give to Pistons that makes him better than Stuckey? Yeah, he had a few nice drives. But he also has turnovers, and was constantly abused on defense. And his jump shot is not any better than Stuckey's.

But what does Murray give to Pistons that makes him better than Stuckey? Yeah, he had a few nice drives. But he also has turnovers, and was constantly abused on defense. And his jump shot is not any better than Stuckey's.
I TOLD YOU, THE BALL GROWS WINGS AND FLIES OUT OF HIS HAND!!!! Go watch the tape 3x's - backwards - in ultra slow motion and then come back and we can discuss this:pound:

I TOLD YOU, THE BALL GROWS WINGS AND FLIES OUT OF HIS HAND!!!! Go watch the tape 3x's - backwards - in ultra slow motion and then come back and we can discuss this:pound:

Actually, if I do that, I'll see him catching a lot of offensive rebounds and then passing the ball. :pound:

Actually, if I do that, I'll see him catching a lot of offensive rebounds and then passing the ball. :pound:
Check-Mate, I'm done....I know when I'm beaten' :pound:

Check-Mate, I'm done....I know when I'm beaten' :pound:

Flip can do that to anyone. That's why he's in the street clothes.

did anyone else notice how quiet it was? it seems like philly has no extra sounds or jumbotron features or anything to try and help the fans get into the game