Indiana Feb. 13th, 7:30 OM

TV - FSDHD, NBALP


The final contest before the All Star break is against the lowly Pacers at the Palace. A win would extend the current win streak to ten. Two more wins are needed to better the win streak of late December early January!

AJ has played in 2 of our 3 games against the Pacers and put up some big rebounding numbers.

Totals for two games
---------------------
Minutes 26
Points 10
FGA 10
FGM 5
Rebounds 15

:hoops:

AJ has played in 2 of our 3 games against the Pacers and put up some big rebounding numbers.

Totals for two games
---------------------
Minutes 26
Points 10
FGA 10
FGM 5
Rebounds 15

:hoops:
Hopefully, he plays 26 minutes in this game and gets 10 and 15.

Both teams on a back2back and travel. Wonder who will survive?

Chat's open!

HOW SWEET IT IS! 10 IN A ROW AND Q IN CHAT!

Pacers didn't put up too much of a fight tonight after the first quarter. CB dominated the first half, as did Amir in big minutes--he played the whole 2nd quarter and had something like 7 points, 6 boards, and 3 blocks by halftime. Rip got hot in the 3rd quarter while the Pacers went ice cold, as the lead blew up to more than 20. The Zoo Crew had their (patented?) near-collapse in garbage time as the Pacers almost cut the lead down to 10 in the last few minutes, but they held on for a 16 point win. Nice distribution of minutes in the last game before the All-Star break...it looks like the only one who played more than 30 minutes was Amir!

For those of you obsessed with bench pt...124 minutes for the bench compared to only 116 for the starters.

I only caught the 2nd half. The third quarter was fantastic.

I have it DVR'ed and i can't wait to see Amir's 1st half. Kid almost got a triple double :)

Also, does anyone notice how Sheed is always making fun of Primo everytime he's in the game. Must be the whole diving thing. LOL

Good game. Dice got only 17 minutes as the refs just would not let him catch a break. That was probably a blessing in disguise, since it got Amir in early. Chauncey played the most of all starters with 30 minutes. Amir played the most minutes with 31, playing in all 4 quarters.

Rip with only 19 minutes, Tay 29, Sheed 21. The numbers are way skewed, but in a good way. Good game for our frontcourt. They did a nice job against Indy's midget frontcourt.

Chauncey - took over the role of stabilizer for the bench in the second quarter. Hit some 3's, playing fairly well. One can never undervalue CB's contributions. He's a great calming influence, both with the young guys and the starters.

Rip - He's ready for the 3-point shootout. He's hit more 3's these last 2-3 games than I've ever seen.

Tay - had a pretty good game, though he didn't play much. He's gonna be able to relax on his vacay.

Sheed - hit a couple 3's, had some nice passes. He owned Indy's frontcourt while he was in.

Stuck - he was cold early, but got hot at the right time.

Afflalo - Not the best game for him offensively, forcing a bit, but the D's always gonna be there.

Max - Played pretty well. More energy than he's had in the last few games, his best game in a while. Got a double double.

Amir - Earned Player of the Game honors, getting 8 pts, 9 boards, 7 blocks. Insane. Lee has to be happy.

If anyone's gonna go at the deadline, it'll probably be one of Flip Jr. and Brezec. I think they wanna keep Herrmann, at least for the rest of the season/playoffs.

I can't believe a starter played 30 minutes in this blowout win. Thats crazy. Oops. Check that. Amir came off the bench and played 30 minutes. Anyone want to guess what kind of grade I am giving Flip tonight for getting ready for the playoffs? Yep, A+, but only because there is no higher grade to give.


Amir responded with 7 blocks, 9 rebounds, and 7 points for getting some minutes. Not bad. But don't think for a moment you have seen how good Amir is. Let him get comfortable out there.


Maxiell had a double double with 11 and 11, plus 3 blocks. Stuckey got 12, about half going inside and half on outside shots. Afflalo got plenty of minutes but did little besides play good D. He did hit one outside shot of several taken.


Hayes hit an outside shot and got some scores on cuts to the basket.
Dyess did not play much. He hit his first shot in the 2nd half. He did try to go inside quite a bit, just no success. Rip played little, as he was in foul trouble in the 1st half and the bench came in real early in the 2nd half. Rip did manage to hit his first four shots on his way to a good scoring game for the short mintues he played.


Billups played extensively with the subs in the 2nd quarter, giving that unit some scoring punch. Tay hit a few shots here in and there. Sheed hit some triples if I recall.


In a huge contrast to any game this season, Flip went to the bench early and extensively in the 1st quarter, and then just the same in the 3rd quarter but even earlier. Most of the starters did return for the end of the 2nd quarter but Amir played that whole quarter.


Yeah, the lead shrunk a bit too much in that 4th quarter, particularly right after Hermann came into the game. So far, Herrmann coming into a game has seldom meant with good success for the Pistons. But Saunders stuck with the bench, even Brezec who was not helping either there real late in the game, and we held on to the win.


Part of the problem too was that Amir took a couple of "why not" jumpers a bit too early in the quarter. We should have probably been concentrating a bit more on winning at that point, but really it never hurts to let one of your players get a bit of in game target practice.
I think we posted up Amir twice and he missed rather weak looking hook shots. Nerves maybe. He was two of four at the line. Probably nerves again on his first shots as he made both his 2nd's. Amir just needs more time out there.


Yes, Amir did get backed down. But then again, a lot of people can get backed down. I would not worry about it. Amir slowed up the guy long enough that a guard should have been able to come over and help.
Ten in a row. Something special. Blaha mentioned on the broadcast that 34 teams now have had two 10 game win streaks in the same season. I plan on being at the Oralndo game after the break as we look to make it 11.


GO PISTONS!!!!!

Amir responded with 7 blocks, 9 rebounds, and 7 points for getting some minutes. Not bad. But don't think for a moment you have seen how good Amir is. Let him get comfortable out there.



I think that he is not in condition for 30 game minutes. He faded pretty bad in the last quarter.

As he gets consistent playing time of hopefully 15 + a game his game conditioning will improve.

:hoops:

Alexa/Lee - Thanks for the summaries. I only was able to catch the last 5 mins of the game.

Wow, I totally didn't realize there was a game tonight!

Thanks for watching chat (whoever did that)!

That was me saving your bacon, boss. :sssh:

HOW SWEET IT IS! 10 IN A ROW AND Q IN CHAT!
LOL:pound::pound:and here's my Q-lights for u RuffRider!!

1. Chat was pretty light tonight. Only about 10 people and Dlev chimed in. Buckeyes was able to pull away from watching the last quarter of the BCS game for the umpteenth time just long enough to join us!

2. With D4E in charge, we pretty much got to say what we wanted. Like me almost saying something nice about Flip tonight. Sorry u missed it, RC.

3. Pacers are the worst team from our rivalry days since they had Mel daniels. I think Mel 'Gibson' was out there tonight. If we gave a dam, we wouldve won by 50.

4. ArmyGirl said she sa Barrack a-bama in alabama , we think...

5. 3's were raining like they were from PacMan Jones. Rip was especially pretty 2nite.

6. Amir was A-mazin. he had a personal block party and drew comparisons to a young Jermaine oNeal. Still not ready for consistent minutes in the 4th as he did get winded. I'll take a hard 12-15 minutes any night, though...

7. Devean george just blocked too...'a trade' to the Nets. Still funny prtending to hear george yelling 'Oh hell $%^$# naw!"

8. Another single double for 25cent tonight with a solid-quiet 12 pts. A couple of nice assists as well.

9. Highland park just announced the winner of its primary tonight: Dlev edged out A-bama by the length of Army Girl' s boot!

10. Over all: 10 wins in a row aint bad. Happy all-Star break. Gunight, RC!

Thanks D4! You are truly a hero of the Pistons Nation :)

I think that he is not in condition for 30 game minutes. He faded pretty bad in the last quarter.

As he gets consistent playing time of hopefully 15 + a game his game conditioning will improve.

:hoops:

Based on the defensive effort given by the Pistons in that 4th qtr, I would say that the 22+ mins played by Amir, Alf, and Stuckey may have been a bit much for all three of them. Then again Hayes, Fabio and Primo contributed to the garbage time play too.... :). Give them more mins in Feb and March and they should be ready to give 25-30 mins with no problem into the post season if called on to do so.

31 minutes and a near triple double? That kid needs to get buried on the bench the next few games. What is Flip thinking? Don't worry, I'm sure Flip Sr will wake up and glue that kid's butt back on the pine where it belongs. (sarcasm off)

Loved the boxscore. Love the Pistons.

I LOVE BEING A PISTONS FAN!!!

It's so cool because pretty much unless you have/had some sort of personal ties to MI, chances are you hate the Pistons. Being a Pistons fan is like being in an exclusive club or something. Like Mensa. :MusicBigGrin:

By my calculations, Amir blocked 15% of Indiana's shots when he was in the game tonight.

And by the way, did he ever actually foul anybody? That was some loose whistling.

But finally, Max and Amir both put up numbers together. The extended play had everything to do with it. Dyess + Sheed = 38 minutes. Amir + JMax = 53 minutes.

Just think about how unfair it would be for a college team to have Amir right now and for the next seasons too! Top 3 pick for sure. So let's realize that we basically have stolen back what we gave away in the Darko pick.


Here is something else that is odd about this game tonight. Indiana's starting 5 combined for 31 points, 2 offensive rebounds, and 0 blocks. Nice work guys. I know, I know, Diener was injured. :pound:


It really is hard to not be in a good mood after that blowout.

The bench man, the bench. Listening to Amir's post game was kinda funny. Amir mentioned that the bench knows their roles better now, how they are to either maintain the energy or bring it when the vets can't. We are winning games that we used to lose because of this bench. Cant help but feel that the theme can continue all the way to the NBA finals. If the bench helps us win games we should win - but used to lose; can't they help us win series in the playoffs under that same rule??

Watching some of the things Amir does on defense is just absolutely amazing. Man the next 3 years in Piston land look great. While Wade, Lebron and Howard are the best and most dominate players in the East, their GM's seem clueless as to how to put a championship team together. Thanks Joe.......

Johnson, who played 31 minutes, finished with eight points, seven blocks and nine rebounds. No starter played more than 29, and Hamilton and Antonio McDyess stayed under 20.


"He had seven blocks, and he probably had three they didn't count that he got a piece of," Saunders said of Johnson. "We have to talk to the stat people on that. ... And I don't think a week and a half ago, if I said Amir would lead us in minutes played, anyone would say that's going to happen."




DETROIT 96, INDIANA 80: ON ALL CYLINDERS: Pistons hit All-Star break with 10-game win streak (http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080214/SPORTS03/802140447/1051)

:hoops:

The bench man, the bench. Listening to Amir's post game was kinda funny. Amir mentioned that the bench knows their roles better now, how they are to either maintain the energy or bring it when the vets can't. We are winning games that we used to lose because of this bench. Cant help but feel that the theme can continue all the way to the NBA finals. If the bench helps us win games we should win - but used to lose; can't they help us win series in the playoffs under that same rule??

Watching some of the things Amir does on defense is just absolutely amazing. Man the next 3 years in Piston land look great. While Wade, Lebron and Howard are the best and most dominate players in the East, their GM's seem clueless as to how to put a championship team together. Thanks Joe.......

A little chest puffing heh?

I want to see how we do the end of this month before I get too excited and hopefully the team doesn't get over confident.

Feb 24th at Phoenix
Feb 25th at Denver
Feb 27th at Utah

At this time it seems to me that once Bynum returns and Radmonovic is moved to the bench the Lakers bench is as good as ours.

Right now Farmar and Vujacic (a combined 17 ppg and 40% on 3s) are just as good, if not better than Stuckey and Afflalo. Of course our guys are rookies so they could become better than the Lakers duo or have more experience at this point.

Ariza, Turiaf, Radmonovic and Walton are better as a unit than Maxiell, Johnson and Hayes.

Ariza and/or Walton match up very favorably with Hayes

While Maxey is a better rebounder than Radmonovic, Vladie is shooting 42% on 3s.

At this point AJ has a slight edge over Turiaf, who I would love to see us get for Maxey, but the Lakers would never do that deal. However I expect AJ to get a whole heck of a lot better more so than Turiaf.

Turiaf is probably their best low post defender and he can also defend away from the basket.

They play 11.

The Lakers have 4 guys shoot 38% + on threes, and that doesn't include Kobe. Combine that with the low post presence of Gasol and Bynum along with the everywhere presence of L.O. and oh yea throw in a guy named Kobe and the Lakers may be the best team, though not by much, in the league, when healthy.

I am just not convinced yet that the Lakers defense is good enough to win the Title

Right now assuming everyone is healthy on all contending teams I rank them.

1. Mean Greenies
2. Lakers
3. Pistons
4. Cavs
5. Jazz
6. Spurs

Though I would say that of the group there no team is significantly better than the other 5.

Everyone else.


cheers

:hoops:

if I said Amir would lead us in minutes played, anyone would say that's going to happen." Qoute Flip by Buddha
-
No kidding......

the beauty of the bench is that there's a bunch of game-changers. max can change a game. amir can change a game. stuckey can change a game. hayes can blow open a lead. lindsey can turn a game around defensively.

when you have that many, there's a good chance 1 or 2 of them are going to be superb every night, which is why we've been seeing such ridiculously good games over the past 10.

At this time it seems to me that once Bynum returns and Radmonovic is moved to the bench the Lakers bench is as good as ours.



IMO... only because Phil is known for giving his bench PT, and the majority of those players you have mentioned have logged much more time in together and under Phil's system than our guys- 2 rookies, a 1st year FA, and a may as well be a rookie.

As far as talent, and potential returns 3 years from now goes... our bench blows the Laker bench out of the water. If Samb can become a contributor, forget about it.

A little chest puffing heh?

I want to see how we do the end of this month before I get too excited and hopefully the team doesn't get over confident.

Feb 24th at Phoenix
Feb 25th at Denver
Feb 27th at Utah

At this time it seems to me that once Bynum returns and Radmonovic is moved to the bench the Lakers bench is as good as ours.

Right now Farmar and Vujacic (a combined 17 ppg and 40% on 3s) are just as good, if not better than Stuckey and Afflalo. Of course our guys are rookies so they could become better than the Lakers duo or have more experience at this point.

Ariza, Turiaf, Radmonovic and Walton are better as a unit than Maxiell, Johnson and Hayes.

Ariza and/or Walton match up very favorably with Hayes

While Maxey is a better rebounder than Radmonovic, Vladie is shooting 42% on 3s.

At this point AJ has a slight edge over Turiaf, who I would love to see us get for Maxey, but the Lakers would never do that deal. However I expect AJ to get a whole heck of a lot better more so than Turiaf.

Turiaf is probably their best low post defender and he can also defend away from the basket.

They play 11.

The Lakers have 4 guys shoot 38% + on threes, and that doesn't include Kobe. Combine that with the low post presence of Gasol and Bynum along with the everywhere presence of L.O. and oh yea throw in a guy named Kobe and the Lakers may be the best team, though not by much, in the league, when healthy.

I am just not convinced yet that the Lakers defense is good enough to win the Title

Right now assuming everyone is healthy on all contending teams I rank them.

1. Mean Greenies
2. Lakers
3. Pistons
4. Cavs
5. Jazz
6. Spurs

Though I would say that of the group there no team is significantly better than the other 5.

Everyone else.


cheers

:hoops:

I watch a lot of Laker games these days, ever since Ariza joined the team. (Although Ariza has been injured lately). My assessment of the Laker bench is a whole lot less kind than yours.

I like Ariza a lot. Lots of hustle. Lots of rebounds. Lots of defense. But I will take Amir any day. On offense, Ariza can knock down an open shot upon occasion, but he is too streaky to help his team much as an outside shooter at this point. Other than that, Ariza is a far weaker offensive player vs. Amir. On defense, while Ariza is pure hustle, he is simply small as compared to Amir. Of course, Ariza is being used as a small forward, while Amir is playing power forward for us. But Amir could play the small forward positon just fine, and outclass Ariza as a defender completely. (While Ariza is not going to play power forward for you.) In all, Amir is just the bigger, stronger, faster, quicker, far more talented version of Ariza.

Vujacic is not someone who the Pistons would have on the team. Not enough defense. On offense, he is a streaky shooter. Walton impresses me not in the remotest, in any way, not with any aspect of his game. Farmar is getting his game together this year, enough to be an acceptable backup, and nothing more. Radmanovic has been in a slump forever. He is showing signs of coming out of that slump of late, but even if he makes some of those outside shots, that is the extent of his game; very one dimensional.

I will hold judgement on Turiaf for now, as he is coming off that heart surgery. But I will say so far, that the only thing he has done to amaze me in anyway is to come back from that heart surgery.

In sum, when the Lakers starters sit, what comes in to replace them ain't pretty. Farmar and Ariza are the best of the lot, with Ariza being the only one I would pay to see play basketball.

Our four younsters off the bench, Stuckey, Afflalo, Maxy, and Amir, are each well ahead of Ariza on defense, who is by far the best of the Lakers bench on D. On offense, all four of our guys beat all theirs. In all, there really is no comparison, we have the better bench, far and away.

Yes, Hayes is part of the bench. If I had to rank him with the rest of the players mentioned above, I would rank him toward the bottom. His shot is not consistant enough, and his defense is not sound enough. Specifically, I would rank him behind Ariza, Farmar, and Turiaf, tied with Walton, and ahead of Radmanovic and Vujacic.

IMO... only because Phil is known for giving his bench PT, and the majority of those players you have mentioned have logged much more time in together and under Phil's system than our guys- 2 rookies, a 1st year FA, and a may as well be a rookie.

As far as talent, and potential returns 3 years from now goes... our bench blows the Laker bench out of the water. If Samb can become a contributor, forget about it.

Three years from now?

Okay

:hoops:

I watch a lot of Laker games these days, ever since Ariza joined the team. (Although Ariza has been injured lately). My assessment of the Laker bench is a whole lot less kind than yours.

I like Ariza a lot. Lots of hustle. Lots of rebounds. Lots of defense. But I will take Amir any day. On offense, Ariza can knock down an open shot upon occasion, but he is too streaky to help his team much as an outside shooter at this point. Other than that, Ariza is a far weaker offensive player vs. Amir. On defense, while Ariza is pure hustle, he is simply small as compared to Amir. Of course, Ariza is being used as a small forward, while Amir is playing power forward for us. But Amir could play the small forward positon just fine, and outclass Ariza as a defender completely. (While Ariza is not going to play power forward for you.) In all, Amir is just the bigger, stronger, faster, quicker, far more talented version of Ariza.

Vujacic is not someone who the Pistons would have on the team. Not enough defense. On offense, he is a streaky shooter. Walton impresses me not in the remotest, in any way, not with any aspect of his game. Farmar is getting his game together this year, enough to be an acceptable backup, and nothing more. Radmanovic has been in a slump forever. He is showing signs of coming out of that slump of late, but even if he makes some of those outside shots, that is the extent of his game; very one dimensional.

I will hold judgement on Turiaf for now, as he is coming off that heart surgery. But I will say so far, that the only thing he has done to amaze me in anyway is to come back from that heart surgery.

In sum, when the Lakers starters sit, what comes in to replace them ain't pretty. Farmar and Ariza are the best of the lot, with Ariza being the only one I would pay to see play basketball.

Our four younsters off the bench, Stuckey, Afflalo, Maxy, and Amir, are each well ahead of Ariza on defense, who is by far the best of the Lakers bench on D. On offense, all four of our guys beat all theirs. In all, there really is no comparison, we have the better bench, far and away.

Yes, Hayes is part of the bench. If I had to rank him with the rest of the players mentioned above, I would rank him toward the bottom. His shot is not consistant enough, and his defense is not sound enough. Specifically, I would rank him behind Ariza, Farmar, and Turiaf, tied with Walton, and ahead of Radmanovic and Vujacic.

I think you are watching old tapes.

Turiaf came back from surgery last year.



:hoops:

Turiaf is like Maxiell. The guy plays with intensity and hustle.

Three years from now?

Okay

:hoops:


Isn't that essentially what one would have to do in order to put two rookies, 1 rookie for all intents and purposes and one second year player for all intents and purposes...paired up with a guy that is rebounding from injury riddled seasons and learning a new system against guys that have played together for multiple seasons and also played within the same system for multiple seasons?

Vujacic - 4th season all with LA
Walton- 5th year all with LA
Turiaf - 3rd year all with LA
Farmar - 2nd year in league - experience on par with Maxiell
Radmanovic- 7 year vet, 2nd with LA
Ariza- 4 year vet 1st year with LA - experience on par with Hayes

As you can see, our most experienced players in the bench rotation - Hayes and Maxiell - are only equal in experience with team and system to Farmar and Ariza, two guys that happen to be the low men on the totem pole in the same context on the Lakers bench.

In order for our bench to log the same amount of PT we would have to fast forward to three years from now and only then would your comparison to todays Lakers bench be a valid one, since in the long run repetition of tasks and structure over a period of years goes a long way toward influencing a squads on court performance regardless of a players individual talents and skills.

So yea, 3 years. :MusicBigGrin:

I think you are watching old tapes.

Turiaf came back from surgery last year.



:hoops:

It takes a long time to get it back after a long layoff. Turiaf ain't there yet. Read my post. I only am talking about games since Ariza joined the team, not that long ago. (About a month or so.)

Turiaf is like Maxiell. The guy plays with intensity and hustle.

Correct

He is also a few inches taller a bit better of a defender.

:hoops:

It takes a long time to get it back after a long layoff. Turiaf ain't there yet. Read my post. I only am talking about games since Ariza joined the team, not that long ago. (About a month or so.)

Ariza has not been on the team for the last month. He has been on the injured list.

:hoops:

Ariza has not been on the team for the last month. He has been on the injured list.

:hoops:

I mentioned that already. I only saw Ariza play a few games with the Lakers before he got injured, but I kept watching the Lakers anyway. What I know of Ariza is mostly from following him when he played for Orlando. I also watched several Laker games last year trying to figure out why Mo Evans was getting playing time there. As far as I could tell, Evans was doing pretty bad, and LA was trying to find someone who could take his minutes. But there was just no talent on the LA bench so Evans had to play. Since then, Farmar has improved a lot.

I mentioned that already. I only saw Ariza play a few games with the Lakers before he got injured, but I kept watching the Lakers anyway. What I know of Ariza is mostly from following him when he played for Orlando. I also watched several Laker games last year trying to figure out why Mo Evans was getting playing time there. As far as I could tell, Evans was doing pretty bad, and LA was trying to find someone who could take his minutes. But there was just no talent on the LA bench so Evans had to play. Since then, Farmar has improved a lot.

It seems to me that you are correct in your above statement.

:hoops: