Amir Johnson - Missing In Action

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by buddahfan, Oct 19, 2007.

  1. CloudWalker

    CloudWalker Bench Warmer

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    Bynum isn't any better than Cato was. Why trade a potential KG level talent for a guy that at best answers how Cato would have been if he were injury free?

    The game has already moved away from the likes of Shaq and Big Z.

    The new 5's are actually 4's with an expanded skillset for their size that borders on that of a 3.

    Bosh, Howard, Duncan, Amare, Garnett, Rasheed, Okur, Al Jefferson, Dirk, Jermaine O'neal, Gasol, even Yao Ming is going to be living out at the top of the key and using his skillset despite his size to make a living in todays NBA.

    The plodders may not be extinct, but they don't impact the game the way guys playing in Amir's position do.
  2. buddahfan

    buddahfan Retired from Forum

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    I think Flip found him tonight.

    4 boards in 4 minutes along with 1 block Nice start.

    Oh I almost forgot 2 points

    :hoops:
  3. Delfino Delivers

    Delfino Delivers Bench Warmer

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    this kid needs to play and play a lot. He is ready.
  4. buddahfan

    buddahfan Retired from Forum

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    That is what has been so frustrating for a lot of us, because we know what he can do regardless of the level of competition and we have been waiting for 2 years.

    :hoops:
  5. BillLaimbeer

    BillLaimbeer All-Star 4x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    You want him to play now? I thought you wanted to trade him. :pound:
  6. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    For some reason I was wincing every time Amir ran through traffic.

    He didn't seem to be showing any effects of the sprain, but it can take a while before a player gets the confidence back in the ankle.

    It just feels like we have waves and waves of options now.


    The Pistons were starting to see some drop off in their fan support. Incorporating all these guys will fix that, guaranteed.
  7. mikhail1973

    mikhail1973 All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion

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    It is good indeed to see Amir in action, finally. Hopefully he'll slowly start making his way into rotation. Increase the minutes gradually to let his ankle heal completely.
  8. buddahfan

    buddahfan Retired from Forum

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    For whatever it is worth, which isn't probably a whole lot, I did not see this article before I made my trade suggestion.

    I also don't agree that AJ, is at this point what you would call a project, but he definitely behind Bynum in NBA game development and Bynum as a true center who can play really good today at 20 years old and has as much potential as AJ does to dominate at their respective positions.

    I also would try and avoid throwing Tay in the deal unless they were willing to give us Walton.

    So you have

    Rip, Tay and AJ

    for

    Kobe, Walton and Bynum.

    This would not intially be a popular trade at all with most fans, but I think it would work and be beneficial for us. I don't know how the monies match up and haven't bothered to check because I doubt that this trade will ever happen, but its interesting to think about. I also would hate to see us trade AJ but this trade would be very interesting and it appears to me to our benefit.

    The comparison of Bynum to Cato is a bit strange. Cato's best statistical year ever was 8.5 points and 6 rebounds a game. Last year as a 19 year old in his first full year of playing in the NBA Bynum averaged 8 points and 6 rebounds the same as Cato did in his best year.

    It seems to me from having watched his development over now into his third year and with personal coaching by Cap that Bynum is definitely a 20 - 15 guy in the making.


    Bucher: Pistons still a possibility for Kobe - Detroit Pistons Full-Court Press - MLive.com

    Andrew Bynum Statistics - Basketball-Reference.com

    :hoops:
  9. FreshPrince22

    FreshPrince22 Bench Warmer

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    Maxiell steps up off bench, delivers 'monster' performance
    On Amir:
    I don't get this. Why is Amir fighting the 2nd best big man on the team for minutes? Why isn't he fighting to take the 5 minutes from nazr, and maybe 5-8 more minutes from McDyess (who doesn't need to be playing 29+ minutes)? Seems like Flip is lining this up to make it look like Max has to play less in order to play Amir. And since Flip knows this isn't what the team, fans, or management wants, it gives him an excuse to ignore Amir all together.

    We'll see, but Atlanta was the perfect team to give him real minutes against.
  10. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    Seems like he is fighting Saunders for minutes.
  11. mikhail1973

    mikhail1973 All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion

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    He's still recovering from his ankle injury. Lets give it some time.
  12. buddahfan

    buddahfan Retired from Forum

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    He ignored him the last two years so why change now?

    Once he is fully healed from the sore Achilles than Flip will give AJ garbage time this year, just like Maxey got in his rookie year.

    :hoops:
  13. lapeapod

    lapeapod First Round Draft Pick

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    I just don't understand Amir not getting any burn in this part of the season. I might be daydreaming here but I do seem to remember Dumars quoted as saying that Amir would not rack up any DNPs this upcoming season and lo and behold he's already picked up 2 DNP's this season. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy on Flip's part to continue to keep Amir from playing. He's got excuses for not playing him with the latest that Amir has to pick up crumbs from Maxiell. Why not let Amir have some of Tay, Dice's and Nazr's minutes? Jarvis Hayes can play SG when Rip isn't in there and where it is written that the 5 positons out on the court all have to be pigeon-holed. Tay can even play SG if necessary. I'm all for sending Affalo and Samb down to the development league and let them get some playing time. It's a long season and the Pistons need to not wear out their starters but Flip Saunders is not going to change his stripes and share minutes around with 10 players.
  14. buddahfan

    buddahfan Retired from Forum

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    I don't think AA needs to play in the D league. This guy was a consensus All American and his play to date has been adequate and helpful.

    AJ is still definitely hurt. I think that when he stops icing his ankle after sitting on the bench and doing exercises during a game and if he still does not get any burn at all then we have to wonder why. Though because he is so rusty and missed the pre season his game on defense needs to be integrated.

    I think it is garbage time for him even when he is healthy until he can prove by his defensive play, (Offense is no problem) that he can be a plus on the defensive end. In fact in an interview with him that I saw maybe two or three weeks ago he talked about his defensive development as being his main focus as a player this year.

    :hoops:
  15. FreshPrince22

    FreshPrince22 Bench Warmer

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    Then why did he play in garbage time against Orlando? If he wasn't ready to play, then he shouldn't have stepped foot on the floor in that one.
  16. FreshPrince22

    FreshPrince22 Bench Warmer

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    Because his Boss, the man that can fire him, said that Amir will not be a DNP-CD guy this year.

    That's not the impression that Joe and Amir gave with everything they said in the offseason. Joe said more than once that he would be a rotation player right off the bat. Rotation player at worst means that they play every game.

    I mean, Flip's going through excuses at a record pace...

    1. [@Dallas] He's still sore (Which was arguable based on what Amir was saying at the time) .
    2. [@Spurs]He needs to get caught up in practice (even though it was the preseason)
    3. [@Miami/Orl] We're playing Shaq and Dwight Howard, so we can't use him.
    4. [vs ATL] So what was his excuse here? A frontcourt stacked with athletic 6-9 guys, yet he throws in Nazr, plays Dice 30 minutes, yet there's no room for Amir? Not even a minute?
  17. buddahfan

    buddahfan Retired from Forum

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    There is another way to look at it

    AJ will not start at this point even when he is healthy. So that means he won't get the first 9 to 10 minutes of the first and third quarter. Hayes and JMax are ahead of him in the rotation so they will come in first toward the end of the first quarter.

    He also won't get in in the 4th quarter until his defense has improved sufficiently to put him ahead of both Dyess and JMax. Sheed is a given in the 4th quarter so AJ won't replace him and he won't replace Tay in the 4th quarter.

    So that leaves some minutes at the end of the 2 and maybe third quarters at the best. Getting minutes at the end of the 3rd quarter at this time is a lot less likely than getting minutes at the end of the second quarter.

    So until AJ is healthy and his game defense, which is more than rebounding and blocking shots, gets to a satisfactory level the only time he will most likely see will be at the end of the second quarter or during garbage time.

    Right now Nazr is ahead of him for the second quarter minutes. AJ has to show enough in practice for Flip to put AJ ahead of Nazr. Until that happens it will be mostly garbage time for AJ unless two or more of our bigs get into first half foul trouble then I could see him being inserted in the second quarter.

    I think once that AJ is fully recovered from his ankle injury he will pass Nazr in the rotation. Getting further up the pecking order will be a lot more difficult this year.

    We shouldn't make the mistake of thinking that we can just throw him out there so that he gets some minutes and game experience if he is not cutting it defensively according to Pistons standards.

    A team can get 10 points in 90 seconds no problem with the other team experiencing a defensive breakdown, so even in the second quarter we still do not want to have any leakage in the defensive dike if we can help it because that is all the more points we will need to make up in the second half.

    AJ's defense will come and hopefully one day be one of his strong suits. It took Maxey until the second half of last year to where his defense was up to Pistons standards. That is when his minutes started to increase.

    :hoops:
  18. mikhail1973

    mikhail1973 All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion

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    This time I completely agree.
    :)
  19. FreshPrince22

    FreshPrince22 Bench Warmer

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    I never did get the "10 minute rule" Flip lives by. Plenty of teams start cycling in bench players after 5-6 minutes. That would open up plenty of opportunities. Plus it would keep from having 2 completely separate units. It would be a lot more mix-and-match with the bench and starters. Flip sure loves to wring out every last second to start the game, then swap out like 4 guys at once though. Seems illogical, but hey, he makes the big bucks, not me.
    But when have we seen him out there with any of the regulars? How do we know what his defense is like? Joe D seems to think his defense is up-to-snuff for him to say he was a rotation player right now. Obviously you don't want to put him out there against Tim Duncan, but when we're playing against guys like Josh Smith, Marvin Williams, etc. It's the perfect time (Or Tyrus Thomas coming up on Wednesday). If he's getting abused out there something fierce you yank him, but you can't fail him before you even give him a chance. You're that worried about 4-5 minutes of game 3 in the regular season? Like it would even be more than a blip on the radar in a weeks time if he missed one or two defensive assignments his first time on the floor?


    Actually, it took Sheed going out for a few games, and forcing Max into big minutes before Flip realized he could play (Even after that, he was getting DNPs). He has been a solid defender for quite a while. Obviously it has improved, but that's because he has played in real games, and learned from his mistakes. Which is what it takes.

    Yes, Amir will miss defensive assignments at first (Nazr and Dice miss them on a regular basis to this day). Yes he will get pushed around a bit by bigger guys. But that will happen at first regardless of whether it's now or 3 years from now. My guess is that his talent will make up for that at this point. Most of the guys he'll be going against won't have his energy. They won't have his athleticism. And they won't have his speed. So why not set aside 5-6 minutes per game to find out? Is it because Nazr (and Dice for that matter) is playing too well?
  20. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    The D league hype was so much for AJ, that some here in this forum were convinced he was next coming Garnett!!! He was a no show in the Summer Vegas league and MIA in preseason and currently he is Darko revisited...

    The potential is there, but that contract issue put him behind schedule and now the injury is hindering him even more...Unless one of the bigs get hurts in the next month or so, he will be regulated to garbage time for the next month himself.

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