Ben Wallace/Chicago Bulls '06/'07

Discussion in 'Detroit Pistons General Discussion' started by The Low, Oct 11, 2006.

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  1. armygirl Member+

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    Re: Big Ben's Debut

    The Bulls played very god last night however, let's not get too ahead of ourselves about the Bulls championship aspirations becaue there were glaring weaknesses.

    The # 1 issue that the Bulls will have ALL season is, they are a jump shooting team. Even though I didn't check, I can guarantee you there weren't many points scored in the paint. They will die by that jump shot.

    Ben tried to scored a few times in th paint but missed horribly.

    I hope we don't dedicate papges and pages of pistonsforum space on covering the Bulls and Ben Wallace. It's a waste of valuable space that can be used for Pistons talk.
    armygirl, Nov 1, 2006
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    Re: Big Ben's Debut

    Sorry. I could not resist this. Chicago sports writer talking about the pros and cons of the 1st 2 Bulls games.

    Reasons to like Bulls (or not) on ChicagoSports.com
    max, Nov 3, 2006
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    Re: Big Ben's Debut

    Don't we have the same problem?
    MotownPride, Nov 3, 2006
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  4. bball jay Member+

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    Re: Big Ben's Debut

    no nazr can score in the paint, tay can score in the paint, sheed can score in the paint and jmax can score in the paint. we are a jump shooting team but we do have the people that can go inside when needed. chicago doesn't have that.

    cb and rip are driving to the hole a lot this year now that they dont' have ben's man waiting for them in the paint.

    ben sucks.
    bball jay, Nov 4, 2006
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    Re: Big Ben's Debut

    If we have people who could but they don't what's the difference?

    ..and Ben absolutely does not suck. lol.
    MotownPride, Nov 4, 2006
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  6. himat Member+

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    Re: Big Ben's Debut

    Not too much. The Pistons got to the line a lot yesterday which means they tried getting inside. I think some of that jumpshooting problem is starting to get fixed.

    I can't believe Kings won in those last 30 seconds though. Anyone notice that was the first time Artest and Ben matched up since the brawl? Ben and Ron cleared things up though.
    himat, Nov 4, 2006
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  7. himat Member+

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    Re: Big Ben's Debut

    Jay is right about one thing and that's the paint scoring. That will not be as big of an issue this season for our Pistons. As for Ben sucking you are on your own there jay.
    himat, Nov 4, 2006
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    Re: Big Ben's Debut

    I can't help myself but this picture on Ben's profile hurts somehow...
    [IMG]
    TWOTIMESRALPHI, Nov 5, 2006
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    Re: Big Ben's Debut

    This Thursdays Chicago/Clev game with be on TNT at 7pm.

    This will be my 1st time seeing the new Bulls.

    TwoTimes - do you know which block that was out of the 2 that he has gotten so far as a Bull?
    max, Nov 6, 2006
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    Re: Big Ben's Debut

    ya think he's going to be able to average more than 1blk/game? Slowly I start doubting he'll be but no way he's going to block close to twice a game...
    TWOTIMESRALPHI, Nov 6, 2006
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  11. TaS Member+

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    Re: Big Ben's Debut

    Here is a comparison that not many of us have looked at. Would the Bulls have been better off keeping Tyson Chandler? NOK is rolling and the Bulls are sputtering a bit. The Bulls almost beat the Heat in the playoffs last year with Tyson.

    -------Ben/Tyson this year.
    Minutes 33/ 30
    Points 5.2/7
    Rebounds 8.8/12
    Assists 1.8/0.8
    Steals 1.4/0.2
    Blocks 1.6/0.4
    FG% .474/.700

    Salary $15.7M/ $9.0M

    Ben does more things, but Tyson is outscoring and outrebounding him and more efficient from the field. Tyson is averaging 3.4 fouls/game, so he is capable of getting increase PT as the season goes on.
    TaS, Nov 10, 2006
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    Re: Big Ben's Debut

    Last night's Bulls game was the first time I've seen them play this year. It was a bit of an odd introduction since the Bulls were never really in the game, but without the name on the jersey I wouldn't have recognized BBen. Ben always looked big to me with the Pistons (certainly bigger than his actual height), but he looked small last night. (I'm not sure how that works.) But, he was also basically non-existent on the floor. He seemed lost on offense, but also lost on defense and I'm not sure I've ever seen that before. He never once did something that seemed to change the flow of the game. I'm also not sure I ever saw a Pistons game where that didn't happen at least once. The frontline with Brown and Nocioni was a lot more productive than one with Ben.

    So, it's early in the season as you say, and maybe a player like Ben is harder to incorporate into a lineup. Don't know, but based on last night and your numbers, Pax might be feeling a little uneasy.
    dba, Nov 10, 2006
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  13. mercury Member+

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    Re: Big Ben's Debut

    As predicted Sam (the sham) Smith wouldn't let the Ben factor slide
    mercury, Nov 11, 2006
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  14. TaS Member+

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    Re: Big Ben's Debut

    Ben tonight had 10 offensive rebounds!

    The Bulls had 24 offensive boards to Indiana's 3!!! Jeff Foster has been solved.

    Just when I thought Ben couldn't get any worse, he goes and does something like this, and total redeems himself.
    TaS, Nov 12, 2006
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    Re: Big Ben's Debut

    How did he look? Anyone watch it?

    Curious if he looked like his old game changing self or just some guy who got a lot of rebounds. I see he had 0 blocks but he did have 1 game when he got 5.

    Thursday was the only Bulls game I have seen and Ben did not look like himself at all.
    max, Nov 12, 2006
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    Re: Big Ben's Debut

    He looked like a guy who just got alot of rebounds. Most of the boards were uncontested which could be attributed to Ben's excellent positioning and his intimidation. That said, 10 offensive boards is still pretty darn impressive.
    MotownPride, Nov 12, 2006
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  17. armygirl Member+

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    Wow, here we are only a few games into the NBA season and Ben is feeling the controlling ire of Scott Skiles.

    Skiles is a control freak, I often wondered how the two would co-exist in Chi-Town, I am beginning to see and if you think this is the end of this type of behavior for skiles, think again.

    All he wanted was to get Ben out of Detroit, a pseudo slap in our faces, we won't get far without Ben type of mentality.

    Allow me to make a comparison; in Washington D.C. you have Daniel Snyder, the owner f the Washington Redskins, what he usually picks up players off the waiver wire and sign high priced players so other teams won't get them. He even admitted to signing T.J. Duckett for moo goo bucks just so his competitors wouldn't.

    Ben is probably thinking that Flip was not such a bad coach after all.
    armygirl, Nov 27, 2006
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  18. roscoe36 Jedi Order

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    Re: A Disgruntled Ben Wallace/What a Shame

    The Bulls signing Wallace is huge.

    I didn't believe he was worth that much money to another team (valuable to the Pistons). Now I believe he is not worth that much money to anyone. He's certainly an important player to have, but not at 3 times the average salary, or 30% of the salary cap.

    It's hard to talk historical context sometimes because many fans memories don't reach back to 20 years ago.

    After the 1989 season, when Detroit won their first title, Rick Mahorn was lost to the Minnesota Timberwolves in the expansion draft. The arch-nemesis Atlanta Hawks were ousted that year by the Milwaukee Bucks in the first round, 3 games to 2. An emerging big man for the Hawks during that playoff round, Jon Koncak, scored 12.8 points and pulled down 9.6 rebounds per game. The former first round pick (5th overall) was finally showing some of his promise.

    The Pistons' GM Jack McCloskey offered Koncak what was a very large deal at the time. 6 years, $12 million dollars.

    Chuck Daly was quoted as saying "It's not what you are worth, it's what you negotiate" and Isiah Thomas (or was it Bill Laimbeer?) made the case that the money should be spent if it could keep the Pistons in contention.

    Bear in mind, at the time, Koncak's deal would have made him the second highest player on the team after Thomas. Higher than Finals MVP Joe Dumars, former Mavericks franchise player Mark Aguirre, and 4 time All-Star Bill Laimbeer. All based upon a 5 game stretch in one playoff year.

    The thing is, Koncak had put up very average #s in his first 5 regular seasons, and couldn't break the Hawk's starting lineup.

    Faced with Trader Jack's raise in a high stakes game of free agent poker, the Hawks capitulated and matched the deal rather than risk losing him to a division rival.

    This move ate up a huge chunk of the Hawks salary, pushing Koncak behind only HOFers Moses Malone and Dominique Wilkins. With no wiggle room to add supplemental talent around 'Nique, the Hawks missed the playoffs 2 of the next 3 years, and Koncak never averaged more than 4.7 points per game for the rest of his career.

    Maybe, just maybe, the sacrifice of Ben to Chicago has locked a division rival into a situation of diminishing returns and prevents their ascension to the Eastern Conference Finals.

    While unintended, it could be the move that we didn't make, that proves to be oh so important.
    roscoe36, Nov 27, 2006
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  19. 16 Mile Member+

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    Re: A Disgruntled Ben Wallace/What a Shame

    Was down on Ben for sneaking the headband into the game, but just read Skiles also forces guys to tape their ankles and won't let them listen to music before games. When did Scotty become such a control freak? I still remember him and Blake Ezor constantly partying at State and getting into trouble.
    16 Mile, Nov 27, 2006
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  20. roscoe36 Jedi Order

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    Re: A Disgruntled Ben Wallace/What a Shame

    I'm surprised that Ben has been able to get away without taping this long.

    Most ankle injuries can be prevented by taping.

    But if taping affects Ben's bone spurs, that could explain a loss of leaping ability.
    roscoe36, Nov 27, 2006
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