Big Ben Makes The Sporting News 10 Most Overpaid

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by buddahfan, Sep 1, 2007.

  1. buddahfan

    buddahfan Retired from Forum

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    If we had signed Big Ben last year, I doubt we would have been able to sign C-Bill this year. Of course there are those who say we would be better off next year with Big Ben rather than C-Bill. I don't agree.

    SportingNews.com - NBA - The NBA's all-overpaid team

    :hoops:
  2. himat

    himat Bench Warmer

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    How about Rashard Lewis? The reason Ben got such a big day is not because of his defense on the court, but also because of his work ethic off the court. He is getting overpaid, but by no means is he one of the most overpaid players in the NBA. Stats are a small percentage of how to rate a player. If a GM only looks at stats he would fail.
  3. Pwn Toney

    Pwn Toney All-Star Forum Donor

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    A) That's not exactly true because Davidson had the Bird rights to both players. It would have put us over the cap a bit, but I think Davidson would have coughed up the coin to keep Billups this year.

    B) I'd rather have a player with a great work ethic and a tough on court disposition. Than a player who spends half the year grinning at the camera, after being humiliated, and telling me, "Nah man, we ain't worried..."


    C) Ben would have put Lebron on his arse, Chauncey did not.
  4. BillLaimbeer

    BillLaimbeer All-Star 4x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    These are all good points, but you have to admit, Ben got paid for what he did in the past. He will never put up the production to match the $60 million he will cash in with the Bulls.
  5. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    We paid darko what he might do in the future...for another team.
  6. Pwn Toney

    Pwn Toney All-Star Forum Donor

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    Sure, if you only measure production in points scored.
  7. mikhail1973

    mikhail1973 All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion

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    Is he the player that will put them over the top? They can't even beat Pistons at this point.
  8. Pwn Toney

    Pwn Toney All-Star Forum Donor

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    How many times do we have to have this discussion?

    Is he Michael Jordan? NO. He never was and no one here ever claimed he was.

    The fact is, this team is better with him than without him. Case closed. You are never going to convince me otherwise by suggesting that he's not Kobe Bryant.

    Just saying you're a better team because you didn't pay for Ben Wallace is retarded. Getting humiliated by the Cavaliers ought to be enough to drive that fact home...or maybe being a worse team is preferable to some of you because you have possibilities and potential to get all excited about. That's fine, but don't tell me this team couldn't do better WITH Wallace than they can without because they've clearly shown that they need what he brings to the table.

    Now with some luck and miraculous turn of events by the current "coach," you might get some decent production out of these young guys, but that's hardly enough to convince me that removing the strongest part of your strongest asset (defense) is going to make you "better."
  9. himat

    himat Bench Warmer

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    His work ethic and character are not gone though (those things are not in the past).
  10. Nemo

    Nemo Pun Master Forum Donor

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    Ben shoulda signed for 48 million for 4 with the Pistons. He woulda had a more appreciated season here. He coulda made us a better playoff team last season......................Oh no...........just a bunch of woulda, coulda, shoulda...............:)
  11. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Ben was our Koncak gut check.

    Trader Jack offered Koncak twice what Dumars was making, coming off a Finals MVP performance. Atlanta got nervous, matched the deal, and fell off the map. No one knows if Jack was being legit, or playing mind games.

    Obviously Ben was more talented and useful than Koncak, but Chicago tossed out a big offer, that if we would have matched would have blown up the team salary structure. Joe did the unpopular thing and didn't match, but it was the right move for keeping the whole thing near the upper echelon of the NBA. If Chicago had not signed Ben, they could have been going into this offseason with $20 million in cap space. Enough to sign anyone they wanted and for those of you arguing that Ben doesn't put them over the top, they probably could have signed 1 or 2 guys that could.
  12. dba

    dba All-Star Moderator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    This is a pretty weird list. Seems a little bit more like "guys-I-want-to-make-fun-of" rather than an attempt to really measure performance and salary.

    KMart - Yeah sure, didn't earn his $12 mil, but got hurt and only played in two games. Nobody who plays two games earns their salary. If you're going to shoot at hurt guys, why not Peja who played 13 and earned $11M.

    Starbury - Yep, near the top of anybody's list. My numbers say he earned 7 of his $M.

    Kirilenko - Definitely overpaid for what he did - sprocket points say he earned $6.5 of his $12.4. But Kobe Bryant and Kevin Garnett had equally large gaps between performance justified salary and actual. There is a long list of "stars" with equal gaps.

    Theo Ratliff - Yep, but got hurt and played two games just like KMart.

    Toine - Earned $4M, made $7.6M, but 49th on my list - loads of other guys with bigger gaps. Of course, taking shots at Walker is a national pastime. And a fun one. Should be too easy for a Sporting News article though.

    LaFrentz - Another guy who got hurt - played in 27 games (though admittedly not at a level matching his salary even for those)

    Rose - 24th on my list, not top ten. Besides, anyone playing for the Knicks should get a pass. They'll pay anyone anything.

    Szczerbiak - Wallyworld got traded, got hurt, but even prorating his performance to 82 games only nets him half of what he got paid. But, expiring contracts are always for more than you get. That's just the way the system works.

    BBen - From one of the most underpaid last year to #29 on my list of overpaid players this year - no where near top ten. sprocket points say he earned $12 of his $16M - same performance justified salary as Baron Davis (who earned $15M), McGrady, Ray Allen, Paul Pierce - why pick on Ben when there are so many others in the same boat?

    Kwame Brown - #35 on my list and another injured player. If you project his 41 games played performance to 82, his salary gap narrows to earning a little over $7M, and getting paid a little for $8M. Sounds like a pretty good contract to me.


    And what about...

    Shaq - sure he was hurt, but projecting his performance over 40 games to the full season still makes him the most overpaid player in the league by a lot.

    Even prorating to a full season, these guys missed the mark by over $5M -

    Grant Hill
    Steve Francis
    Larry Hughes
    Allen Iverson
    Jermaine O'Neal
    Tracy McGrady
    Adonal Foyle

    Still, if you're a journalist always begging for interviews, why offend a big name when you can always take shots at Kwame and Wally?


    P.S. The spellchecker wants to replace Szczerbiak with Scumbag. Talk about no respect...
  13. Pwn Toney

    Pwn Toney All-Star Forum Donor

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    Well, IMO we could have kept Ben for less than the max if Davidson had been willing to negotiate and compromise a little. Davidson wanted 12...no more. There's still 4 Mil annually of compromise in there somewhere and DET showed no interest in compromise. They strictly wanted "take what we offer or get out."

    I don't think that's any way to come to the table with the heart of your team.
  14. buddahfan

    buddahfan Retired from Forum

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    Our roster would have been frozen almost as bad as the Knicks with aging players and no room to move in the future.

    Hard work ethic is great, but Ben is undersized and can't shoot. Which means his entire game is based on quickness, jumping and reaction. All those qualities are the first to go in a basketball player as they get older.

    Ben is past his prime and the money would have been a waste and a bad decision.

    Joe D. did the right thing in not re-signing him.

    :hoops:
  15. linwood

    linwood All-Star

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    I disagree. I don't think Ben would have returned to the Pistons even if we matched Chicago's enormous offer. By the Miami series, I think it was becoming quite clear that there was no place on the Pistons roster for a defensive specialist.

    To paraphrase the coach, "you can't beat Shaq with a guy who can't score."
  16. dba

    dba All-Star Moderator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Except last year in the playoffs. :stirthepot:
  17. linwood

    linwood All-Star

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  18. Pwn Toney

    Pwn Toney All-Star Forum Donor

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    Sorry, no dice. There are no signs of Ben losing his physical ability. That's just plain heresay and there is nothing to prove that fact other than he went to a slightly worse team. Even then, that's no indictment of his loss of ability, simply an inability to reach the same level of "team success."

    Saying Ben Wallace was fading is purely cliche and the "in" thing to say since he chose to go to CHI. Ben is without question one of the most physically fit and able players the league has ever seen. If you leave it to some people on this forum, Ben Wallace is more slow, fat, and out of shape than Shaq or Oliver Miller. If saying Ben Wallace is fading and fading fast makes you feel better, so be it, but please do confuse that with fact or reality.

    Joe D absolutely made the wrong move for this team over the next 4 (3 remaining) years. This team had a much better chance of competing for a title and all Joe would have had to do was force Flip to include Ben in the game plan, much like he's forcing his hand by giving him nothing but young guys this year. However, Joe D chose the run and gun package and crapped out and won't get any closer to a title until Saunders is gone.

    Finally, to even suggest that our roster would be anywhere close to the Knicks roster simply by retaining Ben Wallace is blasphemy and not worth a legitimate response.
  19. Pwn Toney

    Pwn Toney All-Star Forum Donor

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    Well, I should have qualified my statement by saying that I fell that would have had to come with some assurance that Saunders would be expected to compromise his great offensive playbook.
  20. basketbills

    basketbills All-Star Forum Donor

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    Maybe winning a title isn't the top priority for Dumars. He wants to be cost conscious and still competitive and keep a coach around who is a nice fellow. That's what it's all about.

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