Business side of the equation

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by TaS, Dec 5, 2012.

  1. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    I feel like there is a whole piece to the puzzle that we are aware of, but don't fully appreciate. The players probably feel that way too every few years when CBA is renegotiated.

    Joe D will sense a certain pressure to win now and the coach will feel a certain pressure to make Joe D happy, which means winning now. The 0-8 start was a disaster from a business perspective and makes a lot of people's jobs much more difficult in the marketing department. While I may want the coach to develop the youth even if it means sacrificing a few W's, that may not be the way to maximize profits.

    Anyways, here is a recent article to start with that gives a little glimpse into the guys who are dealing with these issues and some perspective on the revenue, profitability, and financial potential. Must of this world is kept a secret by the owners for a variety of reasons.

    http://www.crainsdetroit.com/article/20121202/NEWS/312029971/ignore-score-pistons-see-bottom-line-getting-better-pricey-seats#

    One other topic that I'm interested in is the NBA's desire to have the stars spread out and retained by their teams, but the players' desire to clump together to win titles.

    David Berri: Price Controls in the NBA Force Teams to Find Different Ways to Keep Their Stars

    (nothing revolutionary in here, but it is well organized)
     
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  2. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    This is very good TaS. There is a much bigger picture than who plays what minutes what night, and at the same time, who plays what minutes and how they play has enormous consequences for the franchise and parent company.

    The notion that anyone in the Pistons organization has an agenda that isn't about winning is probably not very accurate.
     
  3. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    Nice article. I think the Pistons all out drive for mediocrity has hurt their ticket sales. They haven't appeared to have a plan or direction outside of that the last few years.
     
  4. Mogilny

    Mogilny All-Star Forum Donor

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    While there is a strong correlation between W's and income I highly doubt the relationship is linear. After a 0-8 start I don't think 27 or 31 W's make a noticable difference.

    Now that's some tragic stuff.
     
  5. coynejeremy

    coynejeremy All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Especially when you consider that they are inflating attendance numbers.
     
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  6. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 3x Fantasy Champion

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    Like many of us, I live away from the Detroit market so I'm forced to root from a distance. If I still lived in Michigan, I'd certainly consider purchasing tickets to attend some games. I may not be the ideal case study since I have some pretty deep-rooted unconditional love for our Pistons. Irregardless of record, I'm gonna back 'em no matter what.

    In marketing (my field), people always refer to things like "favorability rating" and "brand perception". My level of enthusiasm for our Pistons is way up this year and it has absolutely nothing to do with wins and losses. Obviously I'd like to see the team win but what's more imortant to me this season is what each game means for the future of this franchise.

    Did "player A" use his opportunity tonight to improve on something, gain experience defending a certain player or at the very least - come away from the game in a better position to help the team succeed? Did "player B" perform well enough to possibly enhance his trade value?
    THESE are the things I look at before I peek at the scoreboard. I admit that this season, I look at the box score before I even think about looking at the final score. I'm looking a minutes played, effiency stats, turnovers, etc. Sometimes, you can tell a lot from a boxscore; sometimes you can't.

    Again, my favorability rating is up this year. For the first time in what seems forever, we have some young players to get excited about. Some of these young dudes have all the potential in the world to become the "to be named later" group that follows in the footsteps of the Bad Boys and the Goin' to Work dudes. We are coming out of a dark place where the roster was buried in un-tradeable contracts. We still have some issues but at least there's some light at the end of the tunnel.

    The ownership group needs to realize that nobody cares about seeing Vanilla Ice at halftime or watching a team sacrifice future development to win 40 games instead of 37. As a fan, I just want the focus to be on moving this thing forward to the point that in a couple of years, the Pistons are championship contenders. The Pistons are one of the most successful franchises of the last 25 years and fans expect championships. A 45 win team that becomes a perennial 6th seed in the EC will get the same amount of fan support as the team has had the past 3 seasons. Detroit has some of THE best sports fans in the world but they don't want to pay for "average". Detroit fans are more sophisticated than that. They understand "hollow" W/L records when they see them. The Lions play every Sunday.

    Instead of spending $30,000 on the likes of Vanilla Ice twice a month, spend that money on another guy to scout talent or another coach that can help Andre Drummond with his footwork. Instead of worrying about winning a few extra games in a lost season and thinking that fans will get excited about that; worry about building this thing with the goal of being good EVERY season!

    ...And MARKET it that way!
    If you offer the fan base a young exciting team that is doing the right things to be better in the future, the fans will buy that! If you try and convince them to come on out to the Palace to see the great Tayhaun Prince from the '04 team help the Pistons return to the playoffs, NObody will give a (expletive).

    It's kinda like that old story about the father bull and the son bull looking down at all of the cows in the pasture...
     
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  7. BillLaimbeer

    BillLaimbeer All-Star 4x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Great post, BDL. I'd like to hear more about this family of bulls, though.
     
  8. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    I was thinking the other day about the Pistons hard core fan base. Like BDL and Roscoe, I don't live in the area so I have no impact on attendance. I do buy league pass so something is tracked. Hard core fans believe the product should be catered toward them - and why not? The hard core fans are the last to jump off the bandwagon and it's usually in disgust rather than disinterest. They are also the first to get back on. Hard core fans in today's Internet world constitute a vital resource for any product. Like this forum: it cost the Pistons nothing but it circulates information and interest among a concentrated demographic. Other sites create articles or highlight videos.
    However, big organizations based on a consumer (vs customer) paradigm largely ignore its hard core base. Why would the need to cater to these folks? They'll buy the product regardless of quality. You can tell the focus is on the casual fan with the halftime show. Maybe in January well see 'Puppet show! And Pistons".
    The thing is, once your hardcore base jumps ship, where will new fans go to grow their interest in the team? Pistons.com? Of all franchises, the pistons have a market that is easy to define. Blue collar work and tough defense. All star scoring is just icing on the cake. The hard core fan is also easy to figure out: development of its young talent.

    Jerebko stank at PF and sat but watching CV go 0 for 8 for downtown while doing little else. Thats demoralizing.
     
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  9. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    I pretty much go to all the Pistons games that come through Chicago.

    By the way, I went to the Cubs Tigers game at Wrigley field last summer and the volume of Tigers fans was overwhelming. Based on the orange in the stands and the "Let's Go Tigers" chants that the Cubs fans were unable to drown out, I would estimate that nearly 50% of the people in attendance were actually Detroit fans. Chicago gets a lot of Michiganders that move here, so there was probably a very small percentage that traveled in just for the game.

    St. Louis Cards vs Cubs can sometimes be the same way here.
     
  10. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 3x Fantasy Champion

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    Similar situation with me here in Denver.
    Lots of Tigers fans at the Rockies inter-league games I've been to at Coors Field.
    There aren't as many Pistons jerseys in the crowd at Nuggets games since the team has sucked and Chauncey doesn't play for Detroit anymore.

    Not that hockey even exists anymore but when it does, I can't even handle going to Avalanche games anymore. It's like being in a building with 18,000 of the dumbest people that you've ever met.

    I'd like to go to a game a Wrigley someday.
     
  11. coynejeremy

    coynejeremy All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    I just want to take this opportunity to see how much you are looking forward to your future Colorado Avalanche avatar. Give me a minute to check the standings...oh look, the Cavs are in 13th place in the East and only 5 games out of a playoff spot. Don't worry, a lot can happen between now and April.
     
  12. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 3x Fantasy Champion

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    I totally forgot about that man... :behindsofa:
    The Cavs have maybe the 3rd best PG in the NBA and a crazy looking Brazillian guy who gets like 20 rebounds a game. ...I ain't worried.
     
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  13. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    I'm assuming that about half the people visible in the background are forum members here. Please identify yourselves.

    [​IMG]

    They tried their best to get the place rocking, but that guy in the white sweatshirt just refused to do the wave and killed it almost every time it came around.

    If you were a heckler and came to the palace, you could really do some damage. Your target player would hear everything that you yell, including what type of beer you order.
     
  14. webz

    webz All-Star Snub Administrator 2x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Indeed, or you could also start up a very effective 'We want Dre!' chant for LF.
     
  15. round

    round All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion

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    Wow.... I attended some soccer games (I think that was the sport) in the early 90's that had better attendance....
     
  16. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 3x Fantasy Champion

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    10 step plan to eliminate empty seats:
    1. Fire the entire marketing, promotions and sales teams.

    2. Step in and demand a more marketable product on the floor. Nobody wants to see Maggette, Teen Wolf or Turd. Make sure that Frank and Joe know that you want to see a product on the floor that gets people excited


    3. Stop hiring washed up musicians to play at halftime and pawning it off on people as added value entertainment. It hasn't been Hammertime for 20 years!

    4. Once you've figured out how to entertain people again, give away a TON of tickets. Get people out to the Palace to see the show.

    5. Look at what other companies, organizations & teams do with social media and do it better. Use facebook, twitter and instagram to get people to talking about you. ...but realize that you HAVE to give them something to talk about!

    6. Lower ticket prices and tell everyone that you're lowering ticket prices. Same with parking & food. Your not going to "cheapen the brand" by having a crowded arena. People are broke!

    7. Cater to businesses. Lease an expensive suite for a multi-year deal? ...John Salley will come have lunch with you and your biggest client and tell stories about the Bad Boys. He'll call you by your first name and make you look mlike a big shot in front of your best customer.

    8. Have Hooper blow himself up after every loss.

    9. Stop making pistons.com a propganda machine. Find some writers that will write interesting content and not treat the fans like idiots.

    10. Win games!
     
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  17. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    They should drop the price to whatever they need to in order to fill the place. If it's free, then it's free. At least they'll sell some Drummond jerseys and hotdogs.
     
  18. linwood

    linwood All-Star

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    Dude, what the hell?

    Mr. Cheevers, call off your goons!





    Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk 2
     
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  19. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 3x Fantasy Champion

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    I so badly want to start a muppet account under the handle "Buck Cheevers".
    Buck's sole purpose would be to constantly bash Hooper and agree with everything that I say.
     
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  20. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    That's a great idea. Once again, another brilliant post BDL.
     
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