1. Football Picks Survivor is done for 2014. Congrats to billlaimbeer from The Pistons Forum

Darko

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by Jackattaq, Sep 19, 2006.

  1. hack

    hack First Round Draft Pick

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    ``don't forget lb also lost us a championship. his refusal to play darko in game 7 cost us the championship.''
     
  2. bball jay

    bball jay Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    Re: Rasheed Wallace : The key

    yeah. he could have played dice or elden. my point is lb made some bonehead calls as a coach plenty of times. the biggest one in my opinion is not playing darko ever. lb was more interested in teaching darko a lesson than making our team better.

    carlisle didn't have sheed. in my opinion that's what put us over the top not the coaching of lb.

    lb outcoached ron jeremy. flip got outcoached by pat riley. flip also had the malcontent to deal with in a free agent year.
     
  3. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    LB also outcoached Phil Jackson, bball jay.
     
  4. lazyberbs

    lazyberbs First Round Draft Pick

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    Just a couple of minutes a game in Darko's rookie year, and then in the second year, several more. Put him in almost every game and we would not be talking about this subject at all.

    Of course, Dyce would not be here because he would not have been needed; nor would Davis. Using DMC in the Miami series in his sophomore year would have been enough to keep Sheed and Ben from being beat up so much by Shaq and Zo that they were virtually useless in the first two games against Dallas. Then we would not even be talking about the use of Tayshaun on Duncan. There probably would not have been a game seven.

    And LB might still be here after a three-peat, going for number 4.

    And that is not just hindsight. Some of us were calling for just that, all along; just a few minutes regularly FOR THE GOOD OF THE TEAM!!

    Of course, the Magic would not have been so happy now.
     
  5. TWOTIMESRALPHI

    TWOTIMESRALPHI Team Captain 3x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    I miss Darko... and I'm afraid I'm gonna miss him even more once he wins the MIP award...
    I think there are several statements no one can call untrue;
    - picking Darko itself was not a mistake (we needed a bigman and Joe D tried to build up a dynasty- we had no need for a Wade or Anthony)
    - Darko didn't get enough PT- only about 5-10MPG wouldn't have hurt anyone
    - now that Ben is gone, Joe D's trade could turn out to be the worst move he ever made for that team and cause much damage on his good reputation (which has already suffered, 2 years ago he was considered being a genius and probably the best GM in the league, now he has dropped off to above- average)
    - many, many people in this forum miss Darko (including me) but having talked about that subject 1000times shows that this off- season has been far too long and boring.
     
  6. lurker

    lurker First Round Draft Pick

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    Re: Rasheed Wallace : The key

    I'm surprised you keep bringing up Ben Wallace ("the malcontent" for those who missed the reference). Ben was unquestionably the Pistons MVP of the last six seasons. I don't think your buddy Darko looks too good by comparison. Darko's contributions to the Pistons are closer to the Rodney White or Mateen Cleaves level (except neither of these players represent the highest pick since 1981).
     
  7. DaviaG-Rap

    DaviaG-Rap First Round Draft Pick

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    Fact: Darko will be a great player.
    Fact: We got robbed in that trade.

    Any way you cut it it was a bad move. However, Darko and his agent did force Joe's hand by requesting the trade. Darko was never going to work out here. You could make the point that Dumars sealed Darko's fate with some of his acquisitions- Rasheed/McDyess. But there is enough fault to go around. Dumars, Coaches, Scouts, and Darko all get some.

    It's not the end of the world though. We still got a first round pick which could be anywhere from 6-20. The addition of that pick gives us 4 total in a pretty deep draft. Those assets give Joe a great opportunity to improve the team. Whether its moving up in the draft, trading for an established player (KG?), or just adding peices to the bench. Plus, we still have promising players like Delfino, Jason Maxiell, Chiek Samb and Amir Johnson to look forward to.

    It's interesting to see how it will all play out. Unfortunately it will be awhile before Detroit raises any banners to the rafters.
     
  8. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    This is the truth ^^^. Exactly what I think and feel (except I would class Darko as definitely going to be good, with the possibility to be great, I need to see to believe).
     
  9. lurker

    lurker First Round Draft Pick

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    Your first fact is really a prediction. We'll see in time.
    As far as the trade, that I agree with that completely. I still don't understand why Joe D. was willing to accept so little for a recent #2 pick who had not been properly showcased at the NBA level. It's hard to imagine there wouldn't have been better deals out there at some point before the cap space was needed. I wonder if the focus on Darko was becoming so disruptive that Joe decided to just dump him and be done with it.
     
  10. 16 Mile

    16 Mile Bench Warmer

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    Darko will be very good, if not great. DHo's Pippen.

    The trade was one of the worst trades I've ever seen, a backup pg, and a young, talented bigman for cato and a late 1st rounder? Huh?

    Anyone still sticking up for LB is in some serious denial about him the last few years. LB peaked against LA, and since then he has completely self destructed. Sean Kemp was pretty good back in the day, anyone want him on their team now?

    As for the relevance of Darko, well everyone responsible for the Darko Debacle is still around (except LB and Darko). If they can't see how well Darko is playing now, understand that they blew it, and learn not to repeat the mistakes they made, this team is doomed. But if they learn a few lessons, Darko wasn't a complete disaster.

    A couple of lessons to use on Delfino, Amir, and JMax:
    Find time for the kids
    Let them play through mistakes, you don't need to win 62 games
    Ditch the coaches pets
    Ditch coaches with pets
    Never assume anyone will resign
    Don't trade a guy just because he wants to
    It's not just the player's responsibility to develop, the team has to make an effort to help him.
    No more My way or the highway for the non-starters, a little flexibility doesn't hurt

    #1 lesson, don't treat your picks like crap and don't let your coaches treat your picks like crap, cause they may say enough is enough and just go to a team that wants them.
     
  11. jammertime

    jammertime Starter 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    I agree with everything after your 2 opinion (not fact) statements.

    Its impossible to say for a fact that Darko will be a great player. He has the potential to be a great player. He's shown flashes of skills that could make him a great player. But just ask the Lions what potential and a top 10 pick will buy you.

    Its too soon to say that we got robbed in that trade since not only have we not drafted the player yet, but we don't even know what pick we're getting, or even what year.

    I'd say that part of the trade was a bust (or a lie from the start) in that trading Darko was supposed to allow us to resign Ben. But until the trade is complete, and until Darko and/or Arroyo do something with their potential, its impossible to factually say who won.
     
  12. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    I like that: don't let your coaches treat your picks like crap. Dumars said that he played defense to get PT. I think delf made strides in that department. Flip is not Chuck Daly. Or Maybe he is and Chuck had some pressure on him to play Joe. At any rate, if you feel a guy deserves to be out there, let the coach know when it can help not after the fact.
     
  13. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Folks, before you call this the worst trade, bear in mind that the Pistons made a LOT of bad trades.

    They traded 2 first round picks for Bob McAdoo. Those two picks became Kevin McHale and Robert Parrish for the Celtics. That was probably the worst trade. McAdoo played 64 games for the Pistons. McHale was a 7 time all-star, and 2 time 6MOY. Parish played 17 seasons after ending up in Boston and is the 2nd all-time rebounder in league history.

    By comparison, this trade just sucked.
     
  14. TWOTIMESRALPHI

    TWOTIMESRALPHI Team Captain 3x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Wow, I didn't even know Mc Adoo was a Piston? At what stage of his career happened that trade? Why did he only play 64 games (one season)? Injuries?
    IMHO, it's hard to classify trades against picks because you never know if the Pistons would have drafted Mc Hale and Parrish if they'd kept the picks...
     
  15. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    who is your avatar?
     
  16. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Parrish came to Boston in trade for that pick. He was the 8th overall pick in '74 (??). McHale was Mr. Basketball from Minnesota and an awesome pick by the Celts.

    McAdoo played but got injured for the 16-66 Pistons and the next season was traded to New Jersey.
     
  17. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Is this like "Who is your daddy?"

    r U talkin 2 me?
     
  18. lurker

    lurker First Round Draft Pick

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    Roscoe's guy has enough tattoos to play in the NBA.
     
  19. Dumars4Ever

    Dumars4Ever Bench Warmer

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    The trade that sent Parish, and the pick that became McHale, to Boston was from Golden State, where Parish played the first four seasons of his career (the Warriors drafted him at #8 in '76). But how did McAdoo and the Pistons figure into it?
     
  20. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Boston traded the two Detroit picks, #1 Joe Barry Carroll and #13 Rickey Brown for Robert Parrish and the Warriors' 1st round pick, #3 Kevin McHale.

    If I recall correctly, this was a draft day trade with the players being agreed upon in advance of the picks being made.
     

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