Darko

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by Jackattaq, Sep 19, 2006.

  1. 16 Mile

    16 Mile Bench Warmer

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    Seriously, what exactly is it that Darko did that screwed up the Pistons? I can think of two things, he hated playing in garbage time, and when he couldn't get into the lineup, he wanted a trade.

    What he did do was practice, work on his game, workout, and avoid being tazered.
  2. max

    max All-Star

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    bbaljay - you do have a good point on Arroyo. Nobody ever mentions it but we did lose a lot off the bench with that trade. Delk was a complete non-factor in the playoffs.

    CHicago had no reason to do a sign/trade. These things happen when the other team has something to gain from it. Chic could have threw in Chandler but they either decided that trading for another big man on an expiring contract was the better option or simply did not want to help out a rival. Or perhaps Dumars did not like Chandlers contract.

    There is an unerlying theme of the financial aspects surrounding the Pistons problems. We can't get away from that. All the recent moves were done on the motivation of saving money. If we had matched Chic's offer then Ben would still be a Piston. Arroyo was delt to save $4mil/yr and Darko was seen as not worth the risk anymore. LB probably would still be in charge as well if he were given a raise.

    These were expensive things to do and all teams at some point ( except the Knicks ) have to face the reality of financial limits.
  3. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    HEY!

    Tazering is an honor!!!
  4. hack

    hack First Round Draft Pick

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    16, if we'd known he was gonna loaf, we could have drafted one of the several non-loafers, one of which is practically a HOF shooin already. Ultimately, as much as he was a young kid in a strange situation and reacted poorly to it, well, he's not alone. Lots of players ride the pine for a few years and emerge just fine. And others react to being low on the depth chart by working their way up. Is that too much to ask?

    You got me on his taser aversion abilities, though. Perhaps I haven't been as charitable as I could be.
  5. bball jay

    bball jay Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    how can you be sure melo wouldn't loaf around when he sees darvin ham getting more minutes than him?? the fact is you don't know how those other high draft picks would have responded to the way darko was treated.

    working your way up has to be an option. there was no way for darko to work his way up and he saw that hence his request to be traded. there were no minutes to "earn". so i say yes it's too much to ask a player to work thier way up if you aren't willing to give them an oppurtunity to do it.
  6. DaviaG-Rap

    DaviaG-Rap First Round Draft Pick

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    Stop saying that. If Ben wanted to stay so badly he would have taken the largest contract ever offered by the Pistons! Its obvious he wants to go to Chicago- its not like he signed there reluctantly. What is the difference between $51 million and $60 million when you are already very rich?
  7. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    $9 million dollars. The # is the same if you are very poor.
  8. dba

    dba All-Star Moderator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    $9m is $22k a game over the course of the contract. An extra $600+ or so every minute Ben is likely to play.
  9. DaviaG-Rap

    DaviaG-Rap First Round Draft Pick

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    So Ben appreciates that money the same as a homeless person who digs through the trash for food? You guys are really naive if you think Ben went to Chicago for money. He left because he hates you.
  10. dba

    dba All-Star Moderator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Maybe so, but nobody turns down nine mil. Maybe Ben ended up hating most things Detroit (which I seriously doubt), but he wouldn't have taken nine mil less to go to Chicago. I think you're not allowing for the mindset that sees one wrong landing ending a career, or the one that says that you only get one chance to sign a deal like this. Money matters.
  11. professor

    professor Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    i'd guess that a little of both (i.e. money and change of scenery) motivated ben.

    on the one hand, roscoe and dba make an important point: Ben is what? a 32 year old man. If someone told you tomorrow that you won't earn another dime for the rest of your life (i.e. ben tears his achilles on the first day of training camp), how much money would you want to secure an enjoyable life for you and your children and any other loved ones you feel responsible for? What if one guy came up and said I'll give you 51 million? would that do it. probably, for most of us. but then another guy comes and says 60 million? why not take the 60 million? or rather, why settle for the 51?

    if it were me, there'd have to be something affective tying me to the place and the job where i was gonna get the 51 million. i've no doubt that ben had and has very strong affective ties to detroit and to the pistons. but i also think it's no accident that he went to last year's strongest defensive team. i wonder if he'd have taken 60 million if it had come, say, from Phoenix? or Washington? or Milwaukee? I kind've doubt it. I think he felt -- rightly or wrongly, none of us knows for sure finally, but he's cerrtainly in a better position than any of us to judge -- that the kind of thing he's really good at and really enjoys doing was gradually being displaced from the place of importance it had in his last few years here in Detroit. At the same time, Chicago comes along and offers him not just the money but also a very enthusiastically delivered opportunity to do that thing he does well and enjoys doing, alongside other people, and for a coach, that clearly values that thing and enjoy doing it too.

    I can wish Ben hadn't left. And part of me does. But i have a hard time blaming him for the choice. I can wish that he -- and the other parties involved -- had actually handled the process of making that choice differently. And I believe they could have. But whatever, those are wishes in reference to water under the bridge. He brought me a lot of joy in the past few years, now he's gone to anotehr team, and i wish him well, even when he plays us (though I hope Chicago sucks when they play us). And finally, like any other unasked for and perhaps unwanted change, I'm looking for the new positives it might bring out that we wouldn't have seen otherwise, and I"m hoping that the PIstons do the same.
  12. linwood

    linwood All-Star

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    :pound::pound: That's a good one!
  13. dba

    dba All-Star Moderator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    To put it in everyday terms...

    The median US HH income is around $47k. Supposed your current employer offered you $47, but the guy across town offered $55,300 - how many people do you know who wouldn't jump?

    47 to 55.3 thousand is the same percentage increase as 51 to 60 million.
  14. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    $9 Million. What would you do for that amount of dough?

    Go to white collar prison for 5 years?
    Lose a nut?
    Walk from here to Argentina?
    Get "Property of Big Ben" tatood on your forehead?

    It's a lot of money man.
  15. lazyberbs

    lazyberbs First Round Draft Pick

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    Sorry, I am still convinced that the man making $47K would appreciate the raise more than the guy making $51M would.

    Especially after the IRS got through with him.
  16. professor

    professor Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    No. Life's too short.
    Just one? Sure. Why not? As long as it was done by a competent surgeon (just saw the movie "hard candy" last night -- not a place i wanna go).
    Definitely.
    Nah, even with the current pace of my hairline recession, i don't think there's enough room.
  17. dba

    dba All-Star Moderator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    What font / size? I'll start out for Argentina tomorrow.


    No doubt, but given the choice most folks would go for 18% more money without raising an eyebrow.
  18. MotownPride

    MotownPride Starter 2x Fantasy Champion

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    Honestly, I find it quite laughable that one of the most devoted members in the history of the Pistons franchise over the past 10 years is being scrutinized about loyalty. Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the championship team molded from the same qualities that contributed to Ben's success in the league. He has made a name for himself based on pure effort, determination and hard work. So if you fault Ben for getting upset because the team had worked him out of the gameplan or if you fault Ben for eventually leaving to be a part of a team that obviously valued his contribution more than the Pistons....frankly, that's your problem.

    Ben Wallace doesn't owe the fans or the Pistons a dime. There is a banner and millions of dollars in merchandising that have more than accounted for his below market check he's pulled most of his career with us. I know we live in a what have you done for me lately society, but to trash Ben in my opinion is unacceptable. To me that is the epitome of a fickle fan. One who forgets all of the work and energy an athlete has sacrificed for the team when he hits a low. And Ben's low still earned him Defensive Player of the Year for Heaven's sake. Had Ben acted out the entire season and mooned the crowd prior to tipoff, it still would not take away from his impact on this organization. We all get frustrated and act out of character. How much press have you seen about Ben getting into trouble as a Piston? Zelch. Nada. No cockiness. Nothing but humility and leading by example. If you need to find an @zzhole, Lord knows you have your pick of the litter in this league. Just stay away from Mr. Wallace because it is unfounded and more importantly NOT deserved.

    Darko has done nothing for the Pistons organization. Absolutely nothing. Perhaps the organiztion's fault...sure. But, to align with a dude that is indirectly responsible for one of the most wasted picks in Pistons history versus a player that helped bring the organization back to greatness....is embarrasing. I feel embarassed for anyone who wears a Darko shirt over a Ben Wallace shirt and calls themselves a true blue Pistons fan.

    I certainly believe that everyone has a right to their own opinion. You can love who you want and jeer for who you want. My opinion is this though... If you can comfortably through pure speculation villanize I guy as integral to our championship as Joe Dumars (IMHO)..MotownPride thinks you suck.

    My opinion on the Darko hype machine? He'll probably have a decent career, but I could care less. He has less impact on our championship legacy than Chuck Nevitt and William Bedford. I don't even think Darko thinks he is as good as his Darko-maniacs believe he is. Oddly enough, the overhyping of this player aided in my dissapoinment through his tenure with the Pistons and now, in this forum, it is preventing me from enjoying his development again.
  19. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    True... but you make a lot of good connections, brush up on your tennis game, get congical visits, and be a rich man when you got out. Think of it as going to grad school.
  20. aurora

    aurora Bench Warmer

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    Bball, I think this is a very good point. None of those guys were treated the way Darko was. They all went to bad teams that played them ASAP. Truly, Joe should never have drafted that high of a pick.

    We should have sold that pick for the cash. This year Phoenix sold picks for money. Why? Because they already have their team, just like we already had ours. Darko should have gone to a bad team where he could have played, IMO.

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