Darko

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by kpaav, Jul 3, 2007.

  1. MotownPride

    MotownPride Starter 2x Fantasy Champion

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    If he was a blue chipper, he'd definitely still be in a Pistons uniform. Untapped talent? Perhaps. Blue Chipper? ummmmmm..no.
     
  2. aurora

    aurora Bench Warmer

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    Sorry Roscoe but I've seen a ton of "not playing hard" performances out of the Best Starting Four. Hell, I saw some "not playing hard" performances and them amping it up in the final minutes the Championship Year. No...that Goin' to Work theme hasn't been true for the Pistons for a little while now. Unless you count the kind of effort just like in the real world where you punch the time clock and space out the first 1/2 and then rally to be productive in the second.

    I don't think Darko has the market cornered on motivational issues by any means.
     
  3. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Absolutely, and that dog won't hunt. It is unacceptable to the fan base. We lament it constantly. Flip the switch, if it ain't rough, etc.

    Very few. That was one of the NBA's true blue collar teams. Larry wouldn't let them play any other way.

    Would you say that applied to Amir in the NBDL or Max in the NBA?

    No he doesn't. But as a highly paid and highly placed pick, his stand out on a team like this. Again, we would have been a lot easier on him if he panned out to be nothing more than a backup center, but one who gave 100% most of the time.

    Amir and Max have basically been treated the same way, without the job security or salary. Are they "victims"?
     
  4. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    What does this statement have to do with anything?

    Darko was drafted first and highest of the 3. That means his wage is locked in as higher. Like most things with this cat, it was given, not earned.

    And I seem to recall Maxiell getting a lot more respect than Darko during the playoffs.

    I'll agree that it isn't a privilege to play in Detroit. It's not perfect, but you have to keep your nose clean, you're expected to be professional, and you're expected to win.
    Detroit screwed up drafting a massive project who had neither an NBA body, or maturity to succeed on a short timetable.

    Unfortunately, DMC was making more than Mike James, Lindsey Hunter and Tayshaun Prince were, so it wasn't ok to nuture him along. He either needed to start fast or sit until he was ready.
     
  5. 16 Mile

    16 Mile Bench Warmer

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    Darko's first contract was given, the 2nd has been earned. He's been in the league for four years, and almost every team was willing to give him the mid level. He got more. Amir has been in the league for 3 years, was an NBDL super star, yet the market (except in Detroit) still values Darko more.

    My point is, in Detroit, we value attitude over talent. And we forget when we won, it was with attitude and talent.
     
  6. linwood

    linwood All-Star

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    There is a way to do this, but I can't recall it off the top of my head. Maybe I will look in my college stats book and see if I can find it. Or, you could just ask Lee. I think he has performed an in depth analysis on all possible lineup combinations. :)
     
  7. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    I dunno man. One team lets him go for a protected 1st and cap space and the next team lets him go for nothing.

    But let me say that me and a few memphis fans find it ironic that the Griz got their 2nd Pick back. If nothing else, Dumars has an ability to make lemons into lemonade. We can only hope that Stuckey pays off.
     
  8. basketbills

    basketbills All-Star Forum Donor

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    Darko had a very poor year last year. He had some good games finally at the end which were enough to get him a contract..but back in October the Magic could have simply signed him to an extension if they wanted to keep him..they didn't. He has a chance to erase the bust label in Memphis..but he hasn't proven anything yet. He is and 8 and 5 player and that ain't gonna cut it.
     
  9. aurora

    aurora Bench Warmer

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    Roscoe if you think I am going to get into a posting debate with you on the Escape Goatism of Darko on a beautiful Saturday morning....well...all I can say is I want some of whatever you are smokin' man. :)

    My only real point was that all the flippant comments by Chauncey, Rip, and Sheed over the past several years, I hardly think Darko is the one to castigate for not "playing hard" (especially as he didn't play) and hold up as the incarnation of laziness and poor attitude.

    All of your points are well taken. The only reason I read this thread (because I really can't stand the Darko Obsession and Ritualistic Chanting of the DHOF Mass and then the return litany of the Darko Haters) is because I wanted to see where the kid ends up. Then...voila!.. sucked back into the Darko black hole. "Everytime I try to get out, then pull me back in" or something like that.

    I recuse myself from the discussion...again. :pound:What can I say? I'm a slow learner. :) :sssh:
     
  10. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    Aurora, its the power of the Darko-side. I was trying not to get involved either!!:nerd2:
     
  11. 16 Mile

    16 Mile Bench Warmer

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    Thanks,
    It's freaking gorgeous outside, and I just realized I'm on this forum. Later, I'm going to get sun burnt.
     
  12. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    I'm not castigating Kim. Those are the facts. We all saw it, and his fans made excuses such as it's hard to play cold, or that his bloodflow was compromised, or that garbage time was meaningless so it was ok for him to treat it without respect because it was an insult to him. I mean, even they saw it because they were quick to make excuses for what everyone saw.

    Yeah, the Pistons veterans have a huge entitlement problem. Many of us complain about it. We can't change it, but I don't think it is any big secret that they aren't giving us their best effort night in and night out.

    I love the Pistons despite their mistakes and shortfalls. I don't like people painting them out to be the sole bad guys in the Darko drama, that he was a victim and completely absolved of any responsibility for his situation.
     
  13. Dumars4Ever

    Dumars4Ever Bench Warmer

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    I didn't see this earlier, but I can come to the rescue here. The answer is:

    (5 choose 2) * (2 *(5 choose 2)*5)

    Which comes out to 1000 different possible lineups.

    The first "5 choose 2" is the number of ways to pick two guys to play the 4 and 5 positions, out of the five you have available. This is completely independent (according to your no-small-ball scenario) of the other ten guys who will fill the other positions, so you multiply the number of big men (i.e. the 4 and 5 position) combos by the number of small-guy combos.

    For the small guys, you have five who can play the 1 or the 2, and five who can play the 2 or the 3. Let's call them the "1-2 group" and the "2-3 group." You can't pick all three perimeter players from one group or the other, because then you either don't have a 1 or you don't have a 3. So you have to add (a) the number of ways you can pick one from the 1-2 group and two from the 2-3 group to (b) the number of ways to pick two from the 1-2 group and one from the 2-3 group. It should be pretty clear that (a) and (b) both come out to the same total; both of them are just the number of ways to pick one guy from one group of five and two guys from the other group of five. So this is (5 choose 2) * (5 choose 1), where you use the nCr formula that TaShawn posted earlier. 5 choose 1 is simply equal to 5, so we can fill out our perimeter players in 2*(5 choose 2)*5 different ways.
     
  14. linwood

    linwood All-Star

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    Right on. When you type the 5 choose 2, is that the same as nCr?
     
  15. Dumars4Ever

    Dumars4Ever Bench Warmer

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    Yes, "n choose r" means the same thing as nCr. I was using the term that mathematicians use when talking about it (I used to be one).
     
  16. bball jay

    bball jay Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    flip and joe d can change it. why are we making examples of fino and darko instead of the starting 5 who really built the culture of slacking. darko didn't build that culture he just grew up in it.

    i do think darko was the victim. he had no power in his situation except to demand a trade and eventually that's what he did. i don't care what people say about sitting on the bench and waiting patiently for your turn that's dumb on the pistons. darko, jmax, amir, delfino all earned playing time with thier play at certain points in a pistons uniform. it takes an executive mandate from joe d to actually get them some extra pt. darko and delfino couldn't wait until the piston culture changed. it is up to the pistons to develop players. darko had his faults but the majority lies with the pistons organization.

    it's funny that people talk about how darko didn't try. for the last year and a half his psuedo effort was better than all of our bigs minus rasheed maybe. it's weird that nobody has seen that minutes and oppurtunity to play his own game motivate him. memphis will be the first time he'll be on a team that motivating him and keeping the big guy happy by letting him play his game will happen. some of you are happy the pistons taught darko a lesson. i'm sad he'll be teaching our bigs a lesson for 10 more years.
     
  17. bball jay

    bball jay Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    we don't like blue chippers until they are old and have no knees. maybe we'll bring darko in when he's 32. i can't believe people still can't accept that the pistons org has had trouble with developing youth over the last 5 years. we develop them alright but we have no idea of how to transition them into the lineup. darko and okur are gems that we let go. it would be fun to imagine us with a darko/okur frontline and us with a sheed/ben frontline. one would be dominant for 2 years the other would be dominant for 10 years. maybe we didn't make the right choice.
     
  18. buddahfan

    buddahfan Retired from Forum

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    AJ makes Darko look like a Serbian farmer with a rotten crop.

    :hoops:
     
  19. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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  20. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    Grizzlies: Darko Milicic Press Conference (transcript)

    Just thought these were interesting, because it reveals a little bit about his mindset and the Grizzles' plans for incorporating him.

    The amazing thing to me is that he is younger than Stuckey, Meija, Acker, Samb, etc.
     

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