Delfino or Evans... make your case

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by mercury, Jan 2, 2006.

  1. Mad Hatter

    Mad Hatter First Round Draft Pick

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    Lee your player "A" post must be a player who ain't on our roster. Or zat your way of comparing the two by the NUMBERS?:confused:

    Your Evans hating is simply because he is playing ahead of your favorite; rather than what's best for the TEAM. That's a coach's decision. Second is that Delfino "has range" and "can hit from anywhere." Maybe if you substituted the word "hit" with "shoot" it might work. Just cause he shoots from anywhere don't mean he hits from anywhere. In fact, the NUMBERS say he ain't hittin a dam thing!

    Bottom line is neither one excite me, although had the greater upside. At least from the neck down. As far as I'm concerned, 'Cept for Dice, Arroyo, and the rooks; we outta get the broom out.
  2. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    So you don't think Delfino can play defense. Do you think Flip knows nothing at all? Flip just said that Delfino did well on Wade, and gave him a good long stint on Bron. Tonight, we see him doing fine gaurding Hill. I will tell you what, look at the name of this thread and you tell me who between Evans and Delfino is the better defender?
  3. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    A+ for comprehension.

    I think Flip has a very nice playbook that has made All-Stars out of his PGs.

    I will have to institute an automated word replacement feature if you continue to refer to LeBron James as "Bron". That aside, Flip also said he would play Darko and Davis. I see Flip's lips moving, but all I hear is "the sound of silence".

    In his prime, pre-injury, Grant Hill would have had a career game against Delfino. What next? We gunna compare his 48 minute stats to Hedo Turkoglu? NEXT CONTESTANT!

    No, I tell you what. Re-read my post previous to this one, and understand that I made my case. Your marks for comprehension are slipping. You really haven't been on your game lately.
  4. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    hi to Micro

    Micro, I strongly object to your petty editing idea. But it is your world. Feel free to abuse your powers. Its not swearing to use Bron in a post. I strongly suggest counseling if the evolving english language disturbs you that much.

    You stated that Evans is as bad as Delfino, but that Delfino would get worse as he plays. Kind of flies in the face of logic saying that a player is going to get worse with experience. So, again, state simply who is the worse defender, Evans or Delfino. This includes things like if Evans will just continue to get worse too with more playing time.

    You certainly do spend a whole lot of time, seemingly arguing against something that you agree with for the most part. You have pretty much admitted that Evans is a very poor defender, and can't help a bit with creating offense for his teammates. And to me, you are leaving the most important thing out, the lack of ability of Evans to follow defensive schemes, making him much worse at helping on team defense (ignoring the comparison on individual D for the moment.) To me, you have already decided Delfino is the better player. Why not say that and avoid arguing the side you oppose.
  5. lemonpen

    lemonpen First Round Draft Pick

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    It's too early to make such sweeping judgements. Sure both guys have holes, but forum consensus is the voids are shrinking. With only 30 games in the books there is plenty of time to figure out whether one of them can join Dice/Hunter/Davis/Arroyo as a prime playoff contributor.

    Each fits the Joe D. model as inexpensive, young, got potential, and under contract for a while. Unless either can be said to have plateaued trading them would be a disservice to the team.

    I see them as different but the same, and teachable. Both are enablers, Los with the ball and Mo without. Each has the necessary physical gifts and aggressiveness to place them ahead of their competition.

    IMO the question isn't either/or, but can Flip grow them as a tandem.

    Think Salley & Rodman, Long & Tyler, Hunter & $100 million dollars I mean Houston.
  6. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    hi to lee

    All of your objections are noted. But you did bring up an interesting idea. We could word replace on variants as well as the correct names, linking to affiliate sites to generate income to pay the site bills. If you hadn't posted "Bron", I might not have thought to include evolving English variants. Thanks! Now Bron can be synonymous with "BUY A LEBRON JAMES JERSEY AT JERSEYWORLD.COM! ;)

    Back to topic...

    That is not what I posted. I said that Delfino was a lousy defender, and Evans is also bad. If Delfino played more, his poor defense would be as obvious as Evans.

    Obvious man strikes again! It's known as "looking at both angles". For the advanced kids.

    A very good summation from a portion of my post. Thank you.

    Important to you perhaps. I wasn't constructing an Evans deficiency post. I tried to offer a quick hit on the two players from a broader perspective. I reserve the right to watch the game 7 more times and follow up with additional observations.

    But then what would you build your soapbox on?
  7. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    That was pretty funny

    I always appreciate good humor. About time you stepped your game up a bit.
  8. ojay

    ojay Second Round Draft Pick

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    Well lately, Delfino has been getting in the rotation a little bit earlier than Evans. In the beginning of the season, we saw Evans coming in before Delfino (if he did at all). I think that says a lot of the decision's of the coaching staff.

    Delfino was just fine prior to his knee injury. However, his past may haunt him with his conflict with LB, and it's easy to forget his play in his rookie season.

    Delfino fits what the Pistons need: slashing, dribble penetration. Though, he's a little slower than most elite slashers (Ginobili, Baron Davis, Jameer Nelson), he can finish and he's not afraid to actually do it. He has a knack to handle the ball but I wouldn't trust him with it, yet.

    Evans can make a jump shot, hustle for some rebounds, and give 200% energy but I don't think he's too great close to the basket besides dunks (too many times he's put it off the glass too hard for a layup). He can't handle a ball for %%%% either.

    Both of their defenses need some serious help, but we picked up these guys not necessarily for their defensive contributions.

    All in all:
    Delfino: better slasher, ball handler, finisher anywhere on the court
    Evans: hustles, more consistent jumpshot, more "ups" on his legs

    My pick: Delfino, hopefully he has more room for development, and overall, better in more situations where you need offense.

    But don't get me wrong, they are VERY close.
  9. 16 Mile

    16 Mile Bench Warmer

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    Yep, I think people are going to like a player by the qualities they appreciate the most. Most of Evans supporters seem love his Charlie Hustle mentality, me, I like a guy with Skillz.

    I do think Delfino's D is better than he is getting credit for. As for his shooting, he was advertised a streaky shooter when we got him, let's hope PT helps him get his shot down.


    Out like LLoyd Carr
  10. detteam

    detteam All-Star

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    now that's more like it!

    micro/lee skirmishes :laugh:

    Takes me back to...............:confused: .......nevermind :P
  11. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    OT did anyone listen to Delfino on the radio?

    www.mlive.com/pistons/audio.ssf

    difficult to understand. between him and darko, the team banter must be a little odd. I mean, forget the language barrier, I can barely understand CHAUNCEY and I speak english.
  12. FreshPrince22

    FreshPrince22 Bench Warmer

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    I have to disagree here.

    DEFENSE
    Delfino:
    Last year, he was flat out attrocious on defense. That, nobody will argue. But this year I am definately seeing why he was considered a lock down defender in Europe. If it weren't for the handcheck rules he would be an elite defender in this league as well. He is very aggressive, and very physical. So he actually gives up a LOT less dribble penetration than most of our perimiter guys (once again, only as of late). The problem is, he gets absolutely no respect from the refs. As you would expect for a guy who hasn't seen many minutes. But once he earns the respect from officials, and he learns what certain players like to do, he will be a very solid (if not good) defender. Clearly Larry didn't know how to approach Delfino about his play. Last year he looked uninterested on defense. This year he is probably our most intense defender. Seems like it should have been the other way around with Larry/Flip, but I think Flip's style of coaching is just better for certain players.

    Mo Evans:
    Mo on the other hand, seems like his height really kills him. He works hard on defense, but when a guy can just raise up and shoot it over you it doesn't matter too much. That forces him to play a guy close (unlike Tayshaun due to his length), which then gives his opponent an easy shot at blowing by him. Seems like Mo would be a phenomenal defender if he was just 2-3 inches taller and had slightly longer arms.

    Advantage: Delfino

    REBOUNDING
    Both are great rebounders at their positions. Tayshaun makes them look like Rodman on the glass. Evans is a better offensive rebounder. Delfino is a better defensive rebounder. Evans uses athleticism, Delfino just has good rebounding instincts and those big hands.

    Advantage: Wash

    OFFENSE
    Delfino:
    Great at slashing to the basket, but he's just not aggressive enough. I think he tries to be too unselfish sometimes. If he could break out of that shell he could be a star in this league. He is also great at running the break (either as passer or the finisher). He's got MUCH better ball handling skills than Mo (not even close). But he's more prone to commit a careless turnover like traveling, palming, or just flat out stepping out of bounds. A large part of that is just inexperience with the NBA. He's a very streaky shooter, but it's hard judge a guy's jumpshot when he only gets one or two jumpshots per game. Not much time to get in a rhythm there. I'd prefer him getting to the rim anyways.

    Mo Evans:
    He's limited offensively, but he can certainly dunk. He is also a much better spot up shooter than Delfino. He has shown flashes of mid-range game (which i'd like to see more of), but when he dribbles he gets into trouble easily.

    Advantage: Delfino

    OVERALL

    I just think Delfino is a more complete player. I like what Mo brings, but I think it would be worth it to put more time into Delfino because I think he can be a big difference maker by the time the playoffs come. Mo is fairly limited though. Either way it's a helluva lot better than what we had last year in the playoffs, so you can't really lose.(Darvin Ham??)
  13. FreshPrince22

    FreshPrince22 Bench Warmer

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    Not sure about that one. Delfino was 17-21 when he was in the Euroleague. Mo was 24/25 with college and (limited) NBA experience.
  14. TheeTFD

    TheeTFD All-Star

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    Inconsistant posting

    Did someone say Evans can shoot but has poor ball handling skills?
    Did someone say Evans gets in the way of offensive flow kinda like Hunter.
    Did someone say Evan stands in the corner too much looking to bomb?
    Did someone say bench players need game time play to prepare for a playoff stint?
    So if you can't handle the rock or can't help the O flow wouldn't standing in the corner be a good option for a shooter? Wouldn't this be a way of smoothly bringing your game along?
    It would seem we can't have both, either you give the guy every chance to grow and stay in the flow [of what he does best] or cut bait or suck the confidence out of the guy.
    I would say if your team is like Boston where you have exstarters coming off the bench and you're still a .500 team, your method sucks.
    Either let the benchers swing until they go down or package them for a second rate exstarter. [ Dyess types excuded here]
  15. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    No inconsistency at all

    If a player stands in one spot, that just leaves 4 other players doing the movement part of the offense. Can it be done. By the end of the year last year, Brown managed to hide Hunter in our offense pretty well. Had Hunter doing just enough, and absolutely no more, so that he would not be too big a liability for us on offense.

    So far, our offense is finding it quite hard to operate with just 4 guys. On occasion, we try to get Evans involved, but that has gone pretty badly for the most part. In the Utah game just now for instance, Evans was certainly not standing off to the side. We were involving him in the offense. Result: No buckets. Not any real good shot attempts even.
  16. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    No, Maurice was an All-Star in Euroleague.

    http://www.euroleague.net/plantillas/jugador.jsp?id=BRY

    His team weas 14-6 in his last year.
  17. TheeTFD

    TheeTFD All-Star

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    So what's the plan?

    Let the guy run wild causing mayhem on D and mayhem on O? Let him buy precious time for the starter. Develope "his" skills? Cut him from the rotation? Kill his energy? Challenge JDs player selection?
  18. FreshPrince22

    FreshPrince22 Bench Warmer

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    uhhh. ok? You must not have read my post I guess. :confused: Either that or you just ignored the part when I pointed out that Maurice was about 5 years older with college and NBA experience when they were in Euroleague together.

    And FWIW, Delfino's team beat Mo's the only time they matched up (in the '04 semi-finals i believe).
  19. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    I just re-read it. My bad. :doh:

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