Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by lpgrl26, Apr 21, 2009.
I love it. "The little monster". I love it.
Lol at this writer with nothing else to write about. He's kidding himself if being in the 'elite' can be upheld for longer than five years without a young top-5 talent. Joe saw the writing on the wall and cut his losses this year. Judge the past, not the present and future.
"Man, I wish this team was the four-seed so we could lose to Cleveland in the ECFs instead of the first round! That was the life, huh? Not like we won a championship awhile ago, or anything. I'm a retard." - Joe Dumars, President of Basketball Operations for the Detroit Pistons & Retard
If Dumars knew how badly AI would turn out and only made the trade for financial reasons, then he would have immediately bought out AI, saved some money, and kept chemistry in tact.
First article was on point. Signing a free agent is not going to fix our broken team chemistry. We will be starting from block one.
Trading Billups was a Darko Day in Detroit
Hiring Curry was another Darko Day in Detroit
Hope we have seen the last of the Darko Days!!
Glad to see someone is holding Dumars to his failures.
Its one of those things where if Dumars had made no changes and we lost then these same guys would be criticizing him for not making any moves. Or not trading players while they still had value.
Not trying to defend Dumars but this is a time in a franchise where you are dammed if you do and dammed if you don't. Its important to have a game plan and the resolve to stick to it.
One thing the authors in those articles failed to point out is how much Sheed and now Dyess have aged. Sheed is banged up and old and Dyess peaked out 2 months ago. Then we have Tay who's Iron man streak was more important than getting ready for the playoffs.
Good job Max.
You have to be willing to put up with a lot of criticism when you are a GM.
I think the point Max made is that people in here and wherever would find fault in his actions regardless of what he did this year. The point is not that it bothers Dumars or affects his judgment.
I'm not saying that it does. I think Dumars does his own thing no matter what is said.
Just agreeing with Max and pointing out that being GM really is difficult because of all those "damned if you do and damned if you don't" scenarios.
You have to admit that if your goal was to free up cap space then finding a way to free up over 20 mil with one trade for the very next year was a very good move. Not only CB's contract but Dyess 5 mil was moved as well. Its a tough thing to gauge on when is a good time to make these kinds of trades. But the deal was there, the opportunity presented itself to move nearly 1/2 the cap and Dumars took it.
The main thing that holds up a teams rebuilding process is dealing with a lack of cap space and thats been taken care of for the most part. We will just have to see what he does with it. Next year or the year after that when CB is slowing down we could be well on our way to building another championship team.
On cutting AI. Why give away someone to a contender? At the time we were still in the mix for the 4-7 seed and AI may have just signed with the Celts or Orlando. I don't see how keeping AI affected the chemistry at all.
To gain an edge on them.
Maybe Dumars did AI a favor by not cutting him. If he was cut and starting demanding 40 MPG on say Clev then he may have been re-cut and ended up looking real bad.
IMO, the writer addressed that and very well. All the other repercussions of this "salary-cap move" were disregarded to the detriment of the team, future ramifications in terms of an FA's POV, and going against what Dumars has always held as an important factor in the way he's gone about building the team; chemistry.
The two key paragraphs in Bill Simonson's article spells it out and will be the unknown factor for Dumars this summer. I too fear that this will be the case below:
Simonson is either a PForumite or a daily lurker of this forum...
This guy didn't tell us anything we didn't already know. But he did confirm several issues.
Dumars earned the right to rebuild.
I don't think moving CB was the way to go.
He'll need to find a better coach again. That's the easy part.
I give our members more credit than that. That was one of the worst articles that I have ever read. Its not like Dumars is breaking up a championship team here.
Where he is wrong.
1) Its a buyers marker. The NBA took out a 200mil loan to help out struggling owners. Loans from banks that will have to be payed back - its not a bailout or anything. So its a good time to have an ownership with resources.
2) One down year does not make Detroit a bad destination. Dumars has a proven track record of putting pieces together so its not going to be that bad. Even so, lot of FA's will come for the money and the opportunity.
3) Even if CB were still here that would not have stopped the rapidly aging and declining play that we have seen from Sheed and Dyess this year.
4) As stated earlier in this thread. When is a good time to break up a core? Do you wait until they are not worth much and you are stuck with their contracts or do you move when you can?
Things that Dumars can be blamed for are overestimating Stuckey's readiness and the hiring of Curry. But I cannot blame him for trying to shake things up. Lets give him the summer and see what he does with all this cap space. He has said that his plan is not to wait until 2010.
How Dumars couldn't foresee that Iverson was a broken down, cancerous blister is shocking. Dumars showing such a lack of basketball IQ is like a rip in the space-time continuum. It's the kind of gross mistake Dumars rarely made. [from CBS sports]
That one's for you God.
Besides it ALL Curry's fault.
Honestly, when the trade happened I at that time had hope that Joe could lure a "big name free agent" in 2010.
I was happy when news articles we're telling how Joe Dumars got into prime position to sign Chris Bosh, D-Whistle, Amar'e, or Chosen One himself, Lebron James. Because Allen Iverson had the same agent as Lebron James, and how if Joe treated AI well and could have a better core then what the Cavs will have 2010, then maybe Joe could lure Lebron James here.
How, Joe Dumars could sign Lebron James and truly built around him, since it looked at the time Danny Ferry was a failure of a GM. Mo Williams seriously? And Joe Dumars was a big shot GM, who signed veterans who could play for cheap and had an eye for talent where other GMs didn't see.
But now it seems Joe Dumars has a big problem this summer. When he said there was no sacred cows in this team, he also said some like "I built this team every year to what I believe they compete for a title."
And it was true, this team had a talented bench and good core of players on where this team truly was competitive. They did beat the Celtics at their house. Only team to do that, not even the Lakers did that.
But he rushed in my opinion. He should have kept Chauncey/Stuckey tandem for another year. Say whatever you want, but Chauncey is a true floor leader, he covered the mistakes of Flip Saunders and keep this team competitive. Point Guards in the NBA have a knack it seems to still play while their old. Jason Kidd and Steve Nash come to mind.
He will be in the hot seat this summer, that is for sure.
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