Dumars' failed chemistry test has doomed Detroit

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by lpgrl26, Apr 21, 2009.

  1. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    Things look bleak now, but I really think they're going to be right back at the top next year. I think Tay is going to be an all-star next year and the rest will follow.
     
  2. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    He couldn't unload Billups next year. That's the thing. He sized up a contracting economy, and knew that the time to move was now.

    As a cap move, the trade was genius. The problem is, everything else was crap, from the coach to the remaining quality of the roster.
     
  3. Pwn Toney

    Pwn Toney All-Star Forum Donor

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    Yeah...I'm curious though as to why the wait and see approach when even fans were looking at this set-up as suspect, regardless of how the trade turned out.
     
  4. Latinoking90

    Latinoking90 Bench Warmer

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    Well I wanted it sort of because Rodney Stuckey has been/or is being exposed, and doesn't have anyone in Detroit to teach him/develop him.
     
  5. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    I think Joe thought it would work out well with AI. I don't think Joe would realize how steep Mike's learning curve would be. Detroit has a reputation for not respecting the competence of coaches.

    Let's see if Joe can pull a Danny Ainge and remake this team in one or two seasons.
     
  6. max

    max All-Star

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    I will go with that. Works for me.
     
  7. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    If I am Joe, and I could redo this season, I still have to do the AI/Billups trade. If keeping Chauncey would get me a title, then I would never have had to trade him. It would be impossible to trade him next year if he won another title.

    I would still trade Chauncey, but I would have been a lot more aggressive with the roster. I would have cut back Sheed, Dice and Tay's minutes and insisted that Curry play the kids as much as possible, not to win or lose, but to be able to evaluate these guys.

    By trying to serve all masters, Joe really put himself in a pickle. But then that has been his MO for 4 seasons now. He hasn't made any aggressive moves since the Sheed trade and firing LB. Trading for AI, given the outlook for this team, seems like a no brainer deal to me. It had the makings of being somewhat successful, but blew up in Joe's face when compounded by his other moves.
     
  8. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    Also, buy out AI immediately and fire Curry, even though he wouldn't have actually coached his first game at that point.

    And tell Arnie to watch Rip's groin very closely.
     
  9. 2Tough4You

    2Tough4You Bench Warmer

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    I love your sarcastic wittiness. :laugh:
     
  10. Winless Wonders

    Winless Wonders Starter Forum Donor

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    Great article. I could not have said it better myself. The guy's Dumars counted on the most let him down. Curry, Stuckey, Amir and Max all failed terrible this season and did not live up to the Dumars hype. Stuckey in my opinion has the only upside. The rest of those guy's are just role players or journey men. What free agent player is going to come here is a good question.

    Dumars may have just screwed us big time with this Curry nightmare. Don't think for a second AI did not get on the phone and blast Curry and the Pistons organization with other players in the league. I am not taking AI's side he has some flaws and he didn't help matters, but the fact remains that Curry could not even string together a consistent offense that utilizes any of his players strengths. The Pistons look like organized chaos on offense and the defense and rebounding is non exsistent.
     
  11. basketbills

    basketbills All-Star Forum Donor

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    What if Joe waited until we were near the trade deadline before he pulled the trigger on a Chauncey deal?

    I think he should have waited to see what other offers would be coming.
     
  12. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    The McDyess loophole was probably too good to pass up (as someone previously mentioned).
     
  13. basketbills

    basketbills All-Star Forum Donor

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    Seemed good at the time, I guess.
     
  14. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    We would still have McDyess under contract next year at $3M.

    So, Joe got rid of our longest term obligation in CB, he got rid of next year's obligation in Dyess, and he still got the services of Dyess for this season, which were substantial, for basically free. On top of that, we got a free roll on AI for a season.

    It was a pretty sweet deal... except that CB was more valuable than we thought, Dyess's contributions were in vain, AI was less valuable than we hoped, and Michael Curry spent the entire season stealing random lineups from Lee's rotations thread.
     
  15. pistonsloyalist

    pistonsloyalist First Round Draft Pick

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    What I fault Joe most for is not thinking ahead sufficiently and moving more players sooner. Sheed, Tay and Rip each had more trade value at the end of the 07 season than they have now. It is not that difficult to predict that the skills of a big man like Sheed are going to decline as he moves into his thirties. Sheed is also a very mercurial player who, if unhappy, can bring an organization down, and there were risks in keeping him here too long. Rip is a fine player, but Chauncey made him seen better than he is, and I think Rip's stock has gone down a bit this year in the league. Tay's reputation as a great defender has taken a hit this year too. I also think Joe overrated Amir and JMax, and I suspect that their trade value has gone down this year as well.
     
  16. lpgrl26

    lpgrl26 Bench Warmer

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    Langlois mentioned something about Sheed and Dice both being back for 6 million a piece and that was the Piston's "best" option at this point. IIRC, it was just speculation.
     
  17. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    That's going to be a happy day in forum land if that happens.
     
  18. himat

    himat Bench Warmer

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    I will wait until we pick up a player with the money we get before I criticize Joe for the CB trade.

    Its not an excuse. Joe had a very good reason to trade CB. 1. He would get money and 2. He would get a hall of fame player that looked like he just needed to be surrounded by good teammates. Of course in hindsight Joe D. looks like a moron, but the same media that is criticizing him was also hypothesizing on how explosive the new Pistons team would be.

    Now I have heard rumors of us picking up Carlos Boozer. If we pick him up then YES this was a TERRIBLE move by Joe D. Screw Boozer. That won't make us better. How much more effective will he be than Sheed? Remember we wont have Sheed AND Boozer. Sheed's contract is ending this year. Yeah Boozer might score more in the post than Sheed and get more boards, but Sheed alters more shots, is a better defender overall, and is a better shooter. Boozer is also way more injury prone. I hope we don't waste our money on him. He will be a lot worse without D-Will.
     
  19. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    He will be a lot worse with Stuckey, Rip and Our Little Princess. It is not a given that they can't have both Sheed and Boozer. Lux tax be dammed they could re-sign Sheed to the max after they signed Boozer if they chose, I think.
     
  20. lazyberbs

    lazyberbs First Round Draft Pick

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    There I was, keeping my mouth shut and my opinions to myself, when here come the Darko Days. I know why they call them that. It is because drafting Darko and not developing him has brought us to this point, IMO.

    We would have a 23 year old center just coming into his own, to go with Sheed as he goes off into the sunset in a couple of more years. Some of us predicted this reversion back to the Teal Period and it is coming to pass. Instead, he was sold down the river when a few minutes a game would have turned the corner in his career. And he would have been learning and improving thru those years when he was thrown out of Pistonland.

    We had the chance that few teams get. We had a #2 Overall draft pick during a period when the Pistons were very, very good, and we hired a coach who dropped the ball (actually, threw it down the toilet). A few minutes a game during a time when those minutes could have been spared without harming the team, would have rewarded Joe with a lack of a seam in going from the Pistons who won it all and today.

    I know, my opinion is lost among all the rest of you who know a heck of a lot more than I do, but I have not changed my opinion.

    Stubborn old fart!
     

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