Forward Delfino drops like a stone on the Toronto Raptors' depth chart

His averages and Hayes are pretty comprable considering that the minutes each one plays. However, the Pistons don't give a damn about youth. Their opinion is "screw them," let them come back when they are about 30 and know how to play.

SCREW DETROIT'S COACHES, they are killing the future of the team. You can't continue to expect that veteran FA pickup will get you through as your core continues to age. This team won't have much of a future if they don't start utilizing their draft picks in a productive manner.

I know I have mentioned this before. But it still matters so here goes: Delfino only played twice in this game. He is not starting. To get all the mintues he did, means he came on very early in the 3rd quarter and played the rest of the game.

Early in the 4th, Toronto went up 20, chiefly behind some hot shooting by Delfino. Delfino was 9 for 11 at that point. He missed some shots down the stretch to make his stats look human, but hey, he was getting quite tired when he took those last few shots.

I have watched Delfino repeatedly get played like this, and repeatedly get tired in the 11th thru 16th minutes(and like last night, the 18th minute) of a stint on the floor. Delfino is the 3rd highest minutes guy on his team because his coach understands just how valuable he is. Why he is not starting Delfino is certainly a mystery to me. Obviously, if Delfino has a few more nights like last night, that will change.

Just got to add that I've watched Delfino a lot now that he's playing for the Raptors and it took Sam Mitchell quite awhile to figure out that Fino is a laid back personality both on and off the court but he still gives you energy and that X-factor that every team needs. I think the Pistons are missing that piece and maybe Joe will go out and get it before the trading deadline, otherwise it's going to be a long season for the Pistons.

Carlos was offered a contract by Toronto before the deadline and he turned it down because this will be one of his few opportunities in his career to have control of his destiny. He told the Raptors to hold off and let him just play out this year because he wanted to earn his next contract so good for him. It doesn't matter to Carlos if he starts he wants to be a part of the rotation and play solid minutes. I read the Raptors boards and slowly but surely Carlos is picking up his own fan base and becoming a fan favorite. I had him pencilled in for Most Improved Player this year and he's certainly in the running for that.

They understood that too here in Detroit. That is why Joe D. drafted him. Unfortunately Joe. D. did not realize that Delfino did not fit in with the Pistons and the rest as they say is history.

The Pistons have very very few chemistry problems among the players and that is by design. I can't recall the last time a Pistons player other than Darko who is now gone, have had a run in with the law.

I believe that all of this is by design. Delfino clearly doesn't have a problem with the law, but he did not fit in and so he was banished.

Carlisle was ousted because he caused waves. Big Ben was not resigned because he did not get along with Flipper. Sheed and Flipper reached an agreement and now everything is running pretty smoothly there. Note the reduced number of T's that Sheed has had this year.

Darko, Delfino etc never fit in and they were sent packing.

Flipper has managed to survive, maybe by being a sycophant, like Roscoe has said, but nonetheless he gets along with Joe D., Tom Wilson and Mr. D., so he will survive despite the fans dislike of him.

Yes, the Pistons want to win, but not at the risk of messing up the organization chemistry and having their players names on the sports pages for run ins with the law and/or not fitting in, in the locker room.

In that regard we are very similar to the Colts organization.

Just to set the record straight Carlos wasn't sent packing, he requested a trade and Joe Dumars accomodated him. Remember Carlos has the same agent as Chauncey and when the agent was working with the Pistons behind the scenes on getting Billup's that long term contract he threw in that Fino wanted out because Flip Flopper wasn't giving him a significant role to play on the team. Is Toronto a better fit for Delfino, hell to the yes on that one but he wasn't a problem on the Pistons and in fact was well liked. Being the only foreign player on a team can be lonely so now Carlos can converse with many of his teammates in Italian or Spanish so having the right fit is very important. Plus Carlos is basically in his prime now as a basketball player, this is his 4th year in the NBA and the European players take a few years to develop their game. Even Mano Ginobili wasn't an impact player his first couple years he had to grow into that. I'm still a Pistons fan to the core but that doesn't mean I'm not rooting for Toronto to be successful as well now that Carlos is on the team. My dream is for the Raptors to play the Pistons for the Eastern Conference Championship.

Carlos was sent packing.

He didn't fit in and wasn't wanted. This whole topic as been discussed before. The bottom line is that there are no European trained players on the Pistons. Yes he was born in Argentina but played extensively in Europe. It is the same style anyway. They don't fit in. That is the reality, regardless of what we may want to believe.

Whether he technically asked for the trade or was told to ask for a trade we will never know because we weren't privy to the conversations that took place.

That is why a player like AK-47 will never play for the Pistons under the current organizational setup. I wish I was wrong because there is a lot of excellent European trained talent in the NBA, but the facts as they now stand say that that is the reality. Wishing will not change it.

Have a nice day

I think the problem has less to do with chemistry, and more to do with a seniority mentality. Detroit (Dumars and the coaches) don't want players to earn their PT, they want them to wait their turn. Which is why you will never see a rookie develop on this team. JMax only got PT because Ben left, and Nazr absolutely stinks.

Amir is sitting the pine, and I won't be surprised if he's begging for a trade at the end of the season. Stuckey will get his 10 mpg, but 3 years from now, after still getting his 10 mpg and playing behind Derick Fisher (a steal from the waivers after Lindsey retires in 2010), I wouldn't be surprised if he's demanding a trade.

I never bought the whole "he doesn't fit our style". Just because he's from another country? I mean, His biggest strengths are rebounding, defense, and unselfish team-play. If that doesn't fit our "Style", then something went drastically wrong here recently. The fact is, Flip never appreciated the things he did on the court to help the team, even when he wasn't a member of the offense (by design). He never cut the leash.

I will stand by this statement now and always. I would rather have Delfino coach the Pistons vs. Flip Saunders. Delfino simply knows more about the game.

Name me one player with a European basketball background that has ever succeeded with the Pistons. Whereas the list that have failed with us is pretty long. A resounding shutout to date.

Zelly was our first player with a European background. His first year was 2001-02. Unfortunately he had heart problems and was eventually traded. Since then a few have come and all have left us without making a meaningful impact with the Pistons. Not one has ever cracked the starting lineup and today we have zero on the 15 man roster.

I find this a bit odd that we have been in the ECF 5 years in a row without having any meaningful contribution from a European trained player. Carlos came the closest, but he was moved to Toronto where his performance has come closer to what was expected of him when we drafted him.

Blame it on Cola, Pound for Pound or Flipper or whatever, but the facts are the facts. Players with European hoops backgrounds have never fit in with us enough to succeed.

Thank you.

Breaking down the Euros in the NBA

Uhh... Memo Okur? He averaged about 10/6 for us in his 2nd year (we won the title that year BTW). He had enough success here to earn a contract worth about 8.5 million per year. The only reason he left is because we couldn't technically afford him under the cba rules if we wanted to keep Rasheed. And he had probably the most "Euro" influence in his game of any foreign player we've ever had.

Another high scoring event for Fino. 15 points on 16 shots. Hard to have a high percentage when 9 of the 16 shots are 3's. Guess he is spreading the floor for the bigs. Had enough left in 30 minutes to gather 6 boards too.

They probably beat the Wizards if Bargnani doesn't go 2-13.

He lasted 2 years at only 20 minutes a game, Brown sat him in the 2004 playoffs and we never resigned him. Please don't tell me for what will seem like the millionth time that we didn't have the money to sign him. The fact is that we chose to keep an American trained player and let Okur go. Excuses are excuses and facts are facts. Case closed.

We chose the BETTER player of the two. If we could have kept both, we would have. There is no way in hell Joe could ever live down not re-signing Rasheed after he was the reason we got to the finals. It was about money.

Did anyone check out the Raptors box score from last night? Fino Leads the team in scoring while Bosch, Ford and Bargnani (sp) get the night off. Raptors beat the Bobcats. Can't imagine that went over well with Bobcat Management; losing to second string Raptors?

Raps put up good fight against Suns. 130 to 117 or something.

Seems Carlos's minutes are coming down a bit. Was up around 35 per and is coming in around 25 for the last few games. Still had a good stat line with the reduced time. Hit the boards hard and had an astounding +30.

I noticed that. I know that short-run +/- can be very misleading. It is usually because the player just happened to be in during a couple big runs. This +30 was very strange because nobody else on the team was even close to that.

Beats being -30.

Fino is the best guy they Raps have coming off the bench.
[when he doesn't start]