Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by blueadams, Jul 1, 2009.

  1. lpgrl26

    lpgrl26 Bench Warmer

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    Re: Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

    Is he really? Or did he just have one spectacular series against BOS and got hyped up?

    I've watched the Bulls mainly b/c of Ben Wallace and then b/c of Rose, and he's good, but he's wildly inconsistent. And was easily neutralized when we played them in the playoffs. I also remember our PG/SG lighting the Bulls up and them eventually trying to find somewhere to hide Gordon defensively.

    I agree on the age thing, but Rip is also in absolute great physical shape. How much and how fast would he start to decline?

    I don't know. The Bulls fans vary between praising him and wanting to trade him b/c of his turnover in the clutch. I feel like that's where i am. He's good. He can get better. But i'm not sold. Him having to guard the opposing SG's makes me nervous.

    edited to add;

    And why i'm contemplating this at almost 3:30 a.m. i don't know LOL.
  2. The Palace Artest

    The Palace Artest First Round Draft Pick

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    Re: Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

    No he's not.

    What shocks people is that Gordon shoots > 45% in a higher percentage of games than Kobe Bryant, and a considerably amount more than Rip Hamilton. And that's being a volume shooter. I'll go find the stats.

    He's a CONSISTENT shooter. People just write him off as an erratic chucker, because he shoots a lot.
  3. blueadams

    blueadams Banned - Sent to NBDL

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    Re: [RUMOR] - Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

    #1) please stop with the ben gordon is too small to guard shooting guards nonsense. rodney stuckey (OUR POINT GUARD) looks like he's about 6-5, 215lbs right now. He can guard 95% of the two's in the league. The quicker ben gordon can handle points.

    #2) ben is an upgrade over rip, simply because he is much younger. but also, because he appears to be more of a go-to type scorer...and a much more dynamic one as well.

    #3) Here's what the team would (PROBABLY) look like:

    C: Bosh/Stoudemire/Kaman/Chandler/Surprise?, Brown
    PF: Villanueva, Maxiel
    SF: Prince, Daye
    SG: Gordon, Afflalo
    PG: Stuckey, Bynum

    Rip WILL be traded for a big. Someone else (Brown? Maxiel? Daye? Afflalo? Bynum?) and draft picks will probably also be included. If we can add a LeBron-stopper (not pietrus necessarily, but like him) to the bench, we could be pretty good right away.
  4. lpgrl26

    lpgrl26 Bench Warmer

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    Re: Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

    I don't think that's unjustified. He has very bad shot selection. Good for him is that he can make some of those.

    When i say inconsistent i don't mean his offense specifically. I'm talking more general. He's on and off defensively. Some games he has impact, sometimes none at all. He has halves where he is on fire and then goes completely cold.

    I don't dislike him and actually think that he could possibly work well w/ Stukcey. My main problem is i feel like he's going to get scored on constantly and negate his scoring in the process.

    ---------------

    I'm looking at his stats right now. Not % of games he shoots 45% in b/c i can't find that, but i don't see much of a difference in the basic stats. In fact Rip really outdoes him.

    Gordon shot .455 last year and .434 the year before. His career FG% is .437%

    Rip shot .447 last year and .484 the year before. His career FG% is
    .454

    Gordon has a better % from three. Rip surprisingly almost doubles his FTA's. He's also considerably better in steals, blocks, assists, and rebounds.

    I think this guys whoever he is sums up my feelings;
    » Rip Hamilton
  5. blueadams

    blueadams Banned - Sent to NBDL

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    Re: [RUMOR] - Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

    DUDE, whatever, rip is old, ben is young. moving on...
  6. KGREG

    KGREG All-Star

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    Re: [RUMOR] - Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

    LPGRL, 1 more thing to consider, we've never really had a guy who could make a shot with a hand in their face, Rip can't do that, Ben can. To win in this league you need a player who can hit a shot even when they're well defended. Like I said before, I don't think Ben is the answer but he is an upgrade over Rip, albeit a very small one, and it also allows us to move Rip for a PF or C and still have a 20ppg scorer at the SG spot.
  7. Smoooth

    Smoooth First Round Draft Pick

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    Re: Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

    Agreed, why are people trying to get rid of our most consistent player in rip? And yes, I do find Ben Gordon a chucker.
  8. FreshPrince22

    FreshPrince22 Bench Warmer

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    Re: [RUMOR] - Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

    Joe needs to be patient. A year from now, if we've got Charlie V and Gordon locked into long term deals, it's going to feel like we blew an opportunity.

    I still wish we just offered up our cap space for Shaq. Try that out for a year, probably make the playoffs, and then go after a real free agent next year.

    These guys we're looking at now have future anchor contracts written all over them.
  9. NTC

    NTC First Round Draft Pick

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    Re: [RUMOR] - Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

    I think we just need to have some faith, too many people writing off these players before any deal has actually been made. We don't know what is going to happen until it pans out, who knows, Gordon might come here and flourish under our system, you can't just write him off because he takes some bad shots now and then for a different team. You can't expect him to be perfect 82 games.
  10. DirtyMoney

    DirtyMoney First Round Draft Pick

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    Re: [RUMOR] - Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

    Dang you guys are up early. Where is the defense going to come from?
  11. NTC

    NTC First Round Draft Pick

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    Re: [RUMOR] - Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

    I'm in Australia, its 7:16PM on Wednesday night over here lol.

    I'm not saying Gordon would possibly change his ways, but you're with a new team, new coaches, we've always been a defensive minded team, who knows, that may be partially instilled in him if he were to come to Detroit, we just don't know until it happens is all I'm saying.
  12. armygirl

    armygirl Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    Re: [RUMOR] - Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

    Ben Gordan a huge upgrade over Hamilton, We are not picking up one oe of the best SG's in the league to ride the pine.
  13. dba

    dba All-Star Moderator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Re: [RUMOR] - Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

    If Gordon comes, Rip is gone. No one making that much is going to come off the bench.

    Rip is a better shooter overall - 0.466 versus 0.445 over the past two seasons
    Gordon is a better shooter from three - 0.410 versus 0.399 over the past two seasons. Rip is hopeless from three with any sort of defensive pressure.

    Gordon gets to the line more - 4.4 versus 3.5 FTA per game over the past two seasons.

    Gordon provides more Sprocket Points per game - 21.9 versus 20.7

    Obviously Gordon is younger, and may get better though after five seasons this may be it for him. Rip is on the downhill slide, but in great shape and could sustain his level of performance for a while. Both are overpaid and neither is worth the $10mm Rip gets or the $10mm Gordon aspires to.

    Gordon is small and can't guard twos, but can't guard points either. In fact there is no one Gordon can guard on a consistent basis.


    Villaneuva is a fine young player, but adding BG and CV doesn't make the Pistons better than a 500 team. Joe has got to look higher than these guys.
  14. theWORM

    theWORM First Round Draft Pick

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    Re: [RUMOR] - Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

    Agreed, but I am getting the strong feeling this summer may be just the starting point. Unless Rip is traded before tip off, and even he does, we may have to wait till next summer before Joe finishes building the new core.
  15. RipBillupsRJC

    RipBillupsRJC Second Round Draft Pick

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    Re: [RUMOR] - Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

    Gordon is better than Hamilton offensively.

    . . . . . . . TS% USG%

    Hamilton: .529 .27

    Gordon..: .573 .25
  16. anakin

    anakin First Round Draft Pick

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    Re: [RUMOR] - Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons


    How about defensively? Gordon can't guard anyone.
  17. CloudWalker

    CloudWalker Bench Warmer

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    Re: [RUMOR] - Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

    Neither could Rip before he came to Detroit.

    Given our current teams ability to contain penetration, I don't think Rip is exactly "locking them down" now.
  18. dba

    dba All-Star Moderator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Re: [RUMOR] - Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

    If Joe goes after Gordon he must have a standing offer for Rip from somebody. Otherwise it just makes no sense to load up on shooting guards when you have no one to play the four and five spots. Unless you got Kobe, a team can't spend $21mm on shooting guards, and the Pistons can't afford to spend over half of their cap space and not get a big man.
  19. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    Re: [RUMOR] - Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

    While I agree with you, I think it is closer after assists and prior years are analyzed. Rip had a tough year in '08-'09 for a number of reasons. I'm not sure Ben Gordon would have thrived while playing small ball with Stuckey and Iverson.
  20. NYPistonFan729

    NYPistonFan729 Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    Re: [RUMOR] - Ric Bucher Reports - Gordon and Villanueva to the Pistons

    I think Gordon is an upgrade over Rip, too. Also, Ben does not have the "i won a championship baggage" that Rip has. I feel that Rip will never get over Chauncey not being here. Time to move on. Ben and Rip will not be a good fit chemistry wise. I know that Gordon can't guard anyone, but we will not be a defensive team next year anyway.

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