Joe D. MUST find a Stackhous/Hamilton-like deal

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by blueadams, Jun 7, 2009.

  1. blueadams

    blueadams Banned - Sent to NBDL

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    gotta trade rip for a younger, hidden in the grass type like he did to kick-start the last era. any ideas?? lol. Kevin Martin?
  2. theWORM

    theWORM First Round Draft Pick

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    Yes, Sac-town are just dying to trade Kevin Martin for Rip.

    The only K. Martin we will be getting for Rip is Kenyon Martin.
  3. armygirl

    armygirl Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    I still like Battier as a game changer and leader. Second choice Travis Outlaw out of Portland. Caron Butler would be third and is a very long shot.
  4. The Palace Artest

    The Palace Artest First Round Draft Pick

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    I like Battier too but I see Houston overpaying to keep him.

    And nice try with K-Mart. He's already better than Rip with a better rep.
  5. Pistons Lover

    Pistons Lover First Round Draft Pick

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    K.Mart would be nice and then I wouldn't have to hear the scouting report on him anymore.
  6. blueadams

    blueadams Banned - Sent to NBDL

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    tell me more about travis outlaw? is he better offensively than rip? does he match up well against lebron?
  7. theWORM

    theWORM First Round Draft Pick

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    Blue, please excuse the abruptness of my last post.

    Your idea of copying a pattern that was successful in the past is a good one. However, before thinking about what deal Joe can make that is similar to the one he made to acquire Rip, one needs to consider the precise context in which that deal was made.

    At the time, number 23 was getting ready to suit up for the Wizards. He wanted veterans around him that would take some of the burden off his aging legs, and ensure his team would get into the playoffs, and hopefully make a deep run. The longer term goal was to not make any long term commitments to players that would interfere with the plan to clear cap space to make a run at KG (or others) when he was to hit the open a couple of years later.

    Rip at the time was a promising young guard who was coming out of his rookie contract and would demand a long-term deal.

    Stack at the time was one of the few guys in the league that could carry a team offensively. He got to the rim frequently, and earned trips to the foul line. He demanded attention from multiple defenders. This would slow the game down, which would suit his aging airness perfectly, and the team would have a go-to-guy even when he was on the bench for rest or due to injury.

    So, out with Rip and in with Stack.

    Although Rip has had some big games this season, most notably when he came back from injury and Iverson was sitting, he is not a guy that can create his own shot whenever he wants, and carry a team offensively night in night out. Nor is there a team out there who is the same position as Washington was then. Furthermore, for a team to trade a young talent like Kevin Martin or Travis Outlaw, they must have some motivation to do so (e.g., maybe they are stacked with talent at that particular position, or they can get a stud everyone is overlooking at pick #15, ala the Spurs taking Parker or Manu, or GS taking Sprewell, etc.).

    Now, having said all that, there are teams out there that would be willing to dump salary, and indeed, good players in the process, if they think they have a chance in the LeBron sweepstakes, or a shot at another of the premier FA's in the summer of 2010, or if they simply want to cut costs in this slumping economy. NY possibly looking to move David Lee for draft picks or guys on short-term deals/rookie salaries is just one example of the former. NO's looking to dump Chandler's contract for a few pretzels is just one example of the latter.

    Detroit just happens to have a truck load of cap space to absorb a salary or three via trade, or it can be used to sign a player outright.

    I happen to agree with your thinking, and have been stating the case ever since Billups was traded: Joe is up to something. He will be creative, and most likely do several deals, one of which no one will see coming, whether for the immediate benefit of the team, and/or with an intermediate plan in mind. What I mean by that is that if Joe cannot find a deal that is a sure home run, he will simply acquire as many 'high value' pieces as he can, and PATIENTLY wait for the right deal to come along that will bring an all-star caliber player to Detroit.

    The difference between Joe and the average PF member (and Isiah for that matter), is that he won't make a deal or sign a FA simply for the sake of it. He won't cap the team out for the next four or five years just so he can be seen to be making a splash.
  8. detteam

    detteam All-Star

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    Comparing Rip to Outlaw is kinda apples to oranges. At 24, Outlaw's a SF-PF tweener. His listed height and weight are very close to Tay's, but he looks much stronger.

    My take on Outlaw:
    -high energy, jump through the roof
    -good shot blocker
    -good in the post on both ends of the floor
    -hits 3's at pretty good percentage
    -can drive and finish at the rim
    -avoids contact but is not afraid of it
    -quickness to create turnovers
    -run's the floor with ease and finishes breaks
    -streaky FT shooter
    -sometimes questionable shot selection

    As for Lebron? No doubt in my mind that Outlaw matches up better than Tay. Unfortunately, I read something a few days ago saying Portland doesn't want to give him up.
  9. Blue

    Blue First Round Draft Pick

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    Portland is a team that I would like for this type of trade for three reasons:

    1. I believe they recently had expiring contracts come of the books and are in a nice cap situation to take on a vet's salary.

    2. They are already a good team that is in the play-offs. They are looking to take the next step to contender.

    3. They have a wealth of young talent that they might be willing to part with in order to plug in a veteran player to help them take the next step.

    Tay is a prime candidate here. He has value around the league, is reliable, and has championship experience. He may be an upgrade at SF for them considering their goals. If Joe is convinced that one of these younger guys is ready to break out and expand their game, I think a trade with Portland can be a win-win for both.

    I think at least that this is Joe's type of thought process, and similar to what blueadams was refering to with his type of trade.
  10. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    What about Marvin Williams?
  11. blueadams

    blueadams Banned - Sent to NBDL

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    worm - i agree that these situations are different, but opportunities of all sorts are always out there. joe-d will find them.
  12. Tha Locstah

    Tha Locstah First Round Draft Pick 1x Fantasy Champion

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    What's wrong with that strategy? :sssh:
  13. theWORM

    theWORM First Round Draft Pick

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    Why is Isiah out of the NBA?
  14. Tha Locstah

    Tha Locstah First Round Draft Pick 1x Fantasy Champion

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    I was just being wise. I always thought Isiah WANTED to go to FIU.
  15. lapeapod

    lapeapod First Round Draft Pick

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    I do have confidence that Joe will find a diamond in the rough to add to the mix. The current lineup the Pistons have now is not going to win any more championship rings so now's the time to change it out and go younger. A mix of a few veterans is always nice but the team should be in their prime (or slightly younger). Portland is on the verge of being a championship team but they need a few vets to steady the ship.

    So Joe should be open to trade his most valuable chips (Rip and Tay) to get back a really quality player and possibly trade draft picks so the Pistons finally get a star quality player they can develop.

    The free agents out there are so-so and don't overpay for a player that has a high profile because they're playing out a contract year or getting lots of face time because they are in the playoffs.

    The free agents I like out there that won't cost the farm:

    Brandon Bass -- love his game and his hard nosed playing style. Bass really should be our SF starting with Walter Sharpe backing him up. Time to ditch Tay and go for Bass.

    Desmond Mason -- really like this guy and he can play SF/SG and he's currently playing for OKC so there's a sign and trade waiting to happen.

    Marcin Gortat - he's restricted I think but he's worth making a really good offer to and watch him become the big man the Pistons have been missing. He's got limited range which is fine for a 7 footer since it gets old watching our 7 footer (Sheed) live and die on the 3 point line.

    Chris Wilcox - he's a sleeper pick and the Knicks just never let him play any minutes since they are jam packed at the power forward position. He's a legit big man that boards and has a tough attitude and he's only 27 years old. If a quality team grabs Wilcox I expect him to be Most Improved Player next year if he stays healthy. The Pistons should take him and turn him loose and he'll thrive playing blue collar ball.

    Now if we could only trade TandoriCurry and get a decent coach I would be a really happy camper.
  16. pass99

    pass99 All-Star Forum Donor

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    Nothing wrong with your summation.
  17. hitafreethrow

    hitafreethrow Starter 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    I like the Chris Wilcox idea. Is he a free agent, or would we have to acquire him via trade? Going into his 7th year as a pro, at only 27 years old is great. Had some impressive stats when he was playing with the Sonics. I agree with the blue collar ball as well.
  18. TWOTIMESRALPHI

    TWOTIMESRALPHI Team Captain 3x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Problem with Wilcox is that his knees are banged up and he probably will never be able to play the style he did in his best years with the Sonics... teniditis is something even Arnie can't treat...
  19. Jumpman313G

    Jumpman313G First Round Draft Pick

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    How about we get Randy Foye and Rodney Carney from the Timberwolves?
  20. Smoooth

    Smoooth First Round Draft Pick

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    Yes to Foye, no to Carney. Also, Hell yes to Al Jefferson :).

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