Joe Dumar's Presser...The COntents and Verbatim Remarks

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by armygirl, Jun 3, 2008.

  1. Smoooth

    Smoooth First Round Draft Pick

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    Pistons backcourt can't be touched, unless we are really getting a good deal here.

    I just don't see Stuckey as a starter, yet.
  2. FreshPrince22

    FreshPrince22 Bench Warmer

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    Meh, Boston is starting Rondo in the Finals in his 2nd year in the league. If it meant getting back a big-time player, I would deal Chauncey or Rip for sure. Stuckey is the most ready-to-start backup we've got, so I'd say Chauncey is one of the more expendable starters.
  3. Smoooth

    Smoooth First Round Draft Pick

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    What would those big time players be? Just some food for thought.
  4. anakin

    anakin First Round Draft Pick

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    I would say Rip is more expendable than Chauncey. There are more 18-20 ptr scorers in the league than quality PG.
  5. Smoooth

    Smoooth First Round Draft Pick

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    My thoughts exactly, who would be that replacement for rip?
  6. anakin

    anakin First Round Draft Pick

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    Not that I would necessarily think these guys would fit or be potentially available, but some considerations are: S. Jackson, Ben Gordon, McGrady, Crawford, AI.
  7. ggazoo69

    ggazoo69 Team Captain Forum Donor

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    They seemed to be OK with Flip that first season when they were scoring more points. I remember distinctly several Pistons talking about how "Flip has opened up the offense and made things fun again." I'm paraphrasing. Alas, the good feelings for Flip ended when Sheed decided he didn't want to buy in anymore and the rest of the sheep followed him. Sheed needs to be traded -- yesterday. He's a cancer. I'm not defending Flip because I don't think he ever had the right "get in your face" attitude. That's on Dumars. Totally on Dumars. But Sheed needs to be moved. He has too much influence with his loud mouth. Sure, he's a great teammate -- of everyone except the coach. I posted on another thread that Sheed could come off the bench, but I've changed my mind. Deal him.
  8. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    I agree that they are both problems going forward. Joe should wait until he gets max value for Sheed, but it should definitely happen before the next season gets too far along.
  9. raxrets

    raxrets Team Captain

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    Agreed, I think, in case of sheed, dumars should wait 'til drade deadline, cuz thanks to his contract coming off the books, is his value the highest...Yeah, you can try to trade him to somewhere where he could make significant impact but those contender teams usually do not have something good to give back.

    Remember : we got sheed from Atlanta cuz we had some off from books contracts....
  10. DirtyMoney

    DirtyMoney First Round Draft Pick

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    I didn't get that. i felt that he went along with the situation as it was. hunter knew his role. the people in position to undermine his role was botht the starters and the assistant coaches.
  11. lpgrl26

    lpgrl26 Bench Warmer

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    Don't know if this belongs here exactly, but i was thinking about the whole player's responsibilty vs. Flip.

    The premise that if the players are not listening to Flip it's an indictment of the players and not the coach. While they're both responsible doesn't it fall more on the coach than players being "cancers"?

    I mean Chauncey hated LB's offense, but you could be positive he was going to run it.

    And isn't the essence of a good team, a coach who's philosphy the players buy into.

    I mean talent alone rarely gets you anywhere. The Cavs are good because they belive in MB's defense, The Lakers are good because they faith in PJ/triangle. and The Spurs are all expected to play within the system or pay the consequences.

    When it comes down to it, is it really a character issue on the part of the players ?? or if it is a character issue it would seem every player in the NBA has it

    I mean people who have spoken out against the coach or strategies don't just include Sheed or the players on this team; "High character" guys like Nash, and Yao have publicly questioned a coach, strategies, etc.

    And in PHO, D'antoni was ripped by some players (Amare esp), and eventually fired for the same reason Flip was. Does that mean that all the PHO players are uncoachable? or are situations like that mainly to fall on the coach for a/his philosphy being ineffective, b/he couldn't get the players to buy into it.

    So i guess my point is that winning masks alot of things, and losing brings out the worst. I just don't think that the way the players acted was any different than alot of players if not all would act in the same situation esp when it's the same situation allowed to fester the way it did.

    While their effort could be called in question, it seems to be more of a problem of lack of cohesion. It was interesting that Joe D stressed the fact that no one was on the same page. And that again goes back to leadership.

    So is trading players, and bringing in new ones really going to change anything? I mean you could say bring in young players, but i mean even AA/Delfino/Evans questioned Flip in the papers.

    Inconsistent weak leadership will make everybody look bad.

    I'm not sure what the main point is of this post. Feel free to ignore my rambling. :)
  12. mikhail1973

    mikhail1973 All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion

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    These are all good points. We've been on Flip about his inconsistencies since pretty much day 1. That never improved, hence he's now gone.
  13. anakin

    anakin First Round Draft Pick

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    Bball has got to be the sport where you get the worst attitudes. You don't hear whine and moan every in the NFL, NHL or MLB. Sick of players and the respect thing, these are grown men and hopefully adults. Yes a coach has to be a superior leader but everyone needs to be accountable. Self-accountability and commitment to earning your paycheck should be a person's motto. I am sure Joe's door was more than open for the players to come in and complain about Flip. You don't toss a game, show up to play whenever you feel like, and keep yapping off at the refs for every bad call. Where is the teamwork?
  14. mikhail1973

    mikhail1973 All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion

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    I think it is tough to compare basketball with other sports since you only have five starters on the team with the rest mostly marginal players. You have lots of players on a team in other sports.
  15. anakin

    anakin First Round Draft Pick

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    While that may be the case, all teams in above mentioned sports have superstars. The Wings for example have Lidstorm, probably the best D man to play the game in atleast the past decade and a HOF'er. Never hear him complain about coaching, the refs etc. There are many more examples of players who conduct themselves in a professional manner. A bad attitude is corrosive to teamwork, I don't care how good a player/employee you are.
  16. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    Anyone who knows Joe tell him I will take the job and work cheap. Qualifications: Read what I have written in the Det. News blog the last five years. If he likes my ideas, he should hire me. Seriously, except for Brown, I would have done better than the last few coaches he hired.
  17. basketbills

    basketbills All-Star Forum Donor

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    If nothing else, the half court shot percentage would have gone up.
  18. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    That could be his downfall also. The great ones sometimes have trouble relating to people who can't match their skill.
  19. 1989

    1989 First Round Draft Pick

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    *sigh* We're all over the place in this discussion, but what anakin said above is really all that matters.

    Get a better coach, move some players around -- I'm all for it. But all I really care about is seeing the right attitude, an honest effort every game.

    If we have that much, we can lose 70 games and I'll be happy.
  20. TheeTFD

    TheeTFD All-Star

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    I don't think Sheed can live down not doing the war dance before a CF game. He wants to go.

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