Las Vegas Summer League 2010

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by det2atl, Jun 19, 2010.

  1. Brap

    Brap Starter

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    fantastic conversation with McHale and John Thompson. They both agree that Monroe needs to get stronger in his base, and needs to look to score first so that teams are forced to double team him, and THEN he can exploit his great passing ability. John Thompson has been saying that Monroe is kind of the prisoner of his great passing reputation, that he thinks he needs to live up to that - and that takes away some of the scoring mentality he needs to have. He's very unselfish and right now unselfish to a fault. He's supposedly very coachable according to Thompson, and he won't fight the people who are trying to teach him, by making them prove that they know something first. He'll assume that they're knowledgable, and that will speed up the rate that he learns and improves.

    McHale very impressed with Summers and Daye and JJ - and thinks the Pistons must be very happy with what they're seeing from those guys and Monroe.

    I didn't see enough of White to have much of an opinion. I know he's supposed to be an ubber-athlete, but during the times I've watched (I've been in and out), he's played more under control He does look like he can really shoot.

    Pretty obviously Monroe is a guy who can help right now, but who isn't close to a finished product. He's likely to ultimately turn into a very fine low post player, who will really help our offense. But it's going to be a development thing for him, and to me that means the Pistons are likely to struggle a lot this year, as they pin their hopes to a 20 year old talent who'll be learning a lot on the fly.

    Best case scenario - we start loving what we see for the future from Monroe, and we're a lotto team again and add another major presence next year in the draft; and we see Stuckey, Daye, JJ, Summers and White really take very positive steps in their development.

    I have VERY high hopes for Daye. I think he can become a star, although that's a couple years off. And I think Summers can play - but I'm not 100% sure he'll fit what the Pistons need. We need him to use his body and play in and around the paint. But he's an excellent long range shooter too. I'm unclear as to how to best use him.
  2. mikhail1973

    mikhail1973 All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion

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    That word just gives me instant chills

    :cold:
  3. Brap

    Brap Starter

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    Re: Monroe: I like your comments. He seems to project really well to me. Think of him two years down the road, two years of working with Kander and guys like Ben Wallace, and two years of development as a professional. I'd love it if the Pistons could find a guy like Kevin McHale for him to work with. I think he could really be a gem. Based on what I've read and heard about his willingness to work and to be coached, I'm really encouraged.
  4. mikhail1973

    mikhail1973 All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion

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    How about bringing in Sheed to coach?

    :stirthepot:
  5. pass99

    pass99 All-Star Forum Donor

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    Yep. He will never be a five and without some extra toughness will not make it at the 4.

    Of course, many people (not necessarily GM types) new this. Long learning process and wishful thinking at the forefront when this club can least afford at this time. Building through the draft like this is torture. Another case of drafting for position.
  6. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    You know Pass, Monroe looks as fish out of water as Daye did last year.

    And this year, Daye looks like he wants to take Tayshauns job from him.

    I don't think Monroe is ready, but this might turn out to be one of Joe's better picks in a couple years, and frankly, that is the soonest we will be playing for anything meaningful.
  7. mikhail1973

    mikhail1973 All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion

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    Lets not get carried away as this is the summer league and it is difficult to access anyone's performance. Usually the defenses are not nearly as tough, the teams are nowhere nearly as physical as during the NBA season, and the opposition is not there. Besides, there are players with the guaranteed contracts that are working on certain elements of their game and there are players fighting to get on board and make living and they try to show off their stuff.
    But I do agree that Monroe will be a solid player for the Pistons.
  8. raxrets

    raxrets Team Captain

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    we were seeing from last night how painful can be this rebuilding process: heck, GS has been at the bottom since ancient era and has got tens of top 10 picks and this team was all they were able to gather for summer league? two NBA experinced guys Brandan Wright and Reggie Williams fought and that is all from multiple high drafts?


    Folks, do not take this "developement route" so granted -you know," we need no1 and then blabla" - why we're not witnessing many bottom feeders rising after 2-3 years?

    Even for portland it has taken 5+ years but it seems more to anomaly than a trend.
  9. pass99

    pass99 All-Star Forum Donor

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    My comments about Daye (look them up) where completely positive last year. His talent, combined with his height/reach was never in doubt.

    Tay's position was never up for grabs (as time was about to wear on)...hence his only defense was to never leave a gap. That gap had one extremely important starting point: always start. His heavenly cloud was the father-wink provided by JD and the coaching problem (reaching beyond) accelerated...henceforth: those that got on the right side of coaching (which is the selection process) best get it right. How come winning coaches, in proportion to the progression of winning percentages (above .500) where left out of the sense concerning the fittingness of the world?

    Back to the team.

    The right accompaniment (system), GM/Coach (define your system) and reaching out to those that complement one another (team selection) is the biggest factor for organizational success. Sometimes you have an outstanding individual talent (that may mix, or may not mix), with other individuals within a certain system. Leadership gets paid to recognize, select, adapt, nurture, and introduce talent within a particular time frame. They are paid millions by those that expect this. But who are the expect? It might be each other's shadow. A crossing of shaddows...so-to-speak? If the losers are always losing, but think they are about to win...then the zero-sum game is turned upside down. Everyone become one big percentage point that leads to the plumbers. And as all plumbers know, %%%% rolls down-hill.

    Again, back to the issues of the summer league and who fits into what.

    The announcers (especially Kevin) tried very hard to be right about the players and the subsequent placement into what system that they faced with the Pistons. He stated the big question: in the great being of flux: what direction are the Pistons going to move? OK fans, now is your chance..have a clue?

    Thompson emphasized another big picture. Segmentation of roles that are paved by some form of influence about wants ahead of means.

    I might need to be corrected about this, but did not both Thompson and McHale preach a sense of progression via proportion of what is a pre-manufactured player's dream state? Who determined the color of the current yellow brick road?
  10. armygirl

    armygirl Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    I totally agree with McHale. Our team is in a state of flux right now. Our identity as a team is not clear. I believe Joe D is still confused as to what direction this team will take.

    Hence Joe is using these summer league games in order to put our roster into some sort of perspective.

    Lot of if's on this roster. With Daye looking good, so good that Taye's a goner? So MANY tweeners and not enough bigs. Where will Summers fit? maybe backup to the backup, he can't play the power position, however he can play SF and SG, but wait don't we already have 5 other people who can play the same position?

    Is White a keeper? Do we really need another SG? Don't we already have Stuckey who is playing PG and struggle when he is naturally better off as a SG.

    Do we need a legitimate PG or don't we? Do we trade for a Legitimate PG or make one of the dozen or so guards that we have into a PG? Can we just insert Daye into the lineup as a point forward thereby not having a need for a starting PG? What do we do with Jerebko? He started all last year as a SF, but if Daye is in the starting lineup do we bring JJ and all his energy off the bench? Can JJ be an effective PF (NOT)?

    Trade Rip now and for whom? Will Monroe start? Who can we get via trade that would compliment Monroe's effectiveness and provide a hi/lo presence?

    Yes guys, our team is rebuilding and is in a state of flux. Too many ands,if's and buts.

    I say somehow Joe needs to really observe ESosa the next few games. He has good handles and can thread the needle pretty good. Hence another guard sheesh.
  11. Brap

    Brap Starter

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    Day Two Las Vegas Summer League Roundup

    July, 11, 2010

    [​IMG] By Kevin Arnovitz

    ...

    • I'm not sure what's more fun -- watching Austin Daye create for himself, or for others. Daye missed 12 of his 20 shots from the floor on Saturday, but he was clearly the best player on the court for the second consecutive game. Daye sees the floor with clarity and and is forever a half-second ahead of the defense, which is an eternity in basketball. He can deliver a pinpoint pass -- no matter how fast he's moving or how fierce the pressure -- and is aware of his teammates strengths and weaknesses.
  12. Brap

    Brap Starter

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    If we're going to try to find a way for the Pistons to be a great team in coming years, we're going to need guys who are 1) matchup nightmares at their positions and/or 2) great team players and/or 3) outright stars.

    Here's a hopeful list of guys currently on our roster who MIGHT fit those categories:

    Matchup Nightmares: Stuckey, Daye (especially if he plays SG), White (if he plays PG), Gordon (if he plays the Vinnie Johnson role, like he should), Bynum off the bench, Monroe (a couple seasons from now).

    Great Team Players: I'm thinking of glue guys here - JJ, Daye, Monroe. I included Daye and Monroe here because they are great passers for their positions.

    Outright Stars: Stuckey and Daye. I hope Monroe fits into this category - but I want to wait to see if he has that type of potential. I believe from watching them that Stuckey and Daye could be all-stars down the line. White has the potential to fit here - but at this stage, calling it that way is too much of a flier.

    Looking at the Pistons roster, I don't know what to do with Summers and CV. Both these guys have a lot of talent. If CV ever developed a killer mentality and got healthy and in great shape, he really could be an all-star performer at PF. I think Summers could be a very fine NBA player - he overmatches many 3's physically, seems like he could be a great slashing SF or PF, and is a great long-range shooter. If either of these guys emerge, they could own the PF position, but is that where Monroe ends up? Monroe might not have the strength yet at 20 years old to play C, but I think that's where he's going to end up in a couple seasons. Still, in the meantime, MUST we play him at PF? If "yes" then that sure seems like it would crowd Summers and/or CV out of the rotation, since Monroe has got to get minutes to develop. I really hope the Pistons just plunk him at center - let him take some lumps but have him acclimate to that position.

    I'm praying harder than ever that we trade Rip and Tay, but if we do, then any players we get back for them will crowd the rotation even further. Of course, if we keep them, the rotation at their positions is crowded anyway. Still, I want to move them because I really want Daye, JJ and Summers to get all their minutes.

    And mostly, the reason for this post is that I'm convinced that we should plop Daye in at SG. He's showing such superb handle and passing ability this SL, that I'm convinced he can handle the position. And that would give us a big-time matchup problem for other teams for a lot of years. Daye at SG would free minutes up for JJ at SF - easily his best position. Summers, after we move Tay, would have minutes opened up for him as well - and I think he's a player who really fits with Daye on the court and with Monroe in the post, since Summers is such a fine shooter.
  13. Mogilny

    Mogilny All-Star Forum Donor

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    I think he started at the PF most of the year with Tay on the SF when he wasn't injured.
  14. Laimbrane

    Laimbrane All-Star Forum Donor

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    :twitch:

    I... don't understand what you're talking about. Everytime I felt like I was following you, you jumped to a completely different plane of thought and lost me.

    I think you're talking about choosing the right players and talent for the system, and you're correct about that. It's not easy, but that's the philosophy.

    But you also bring up a good point: who are the expect? I don't know. Should I? Can any of us really know who the expect are? That's a dangerous gray brick road you're taking us down.
  15. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Great post Pass. I am on board with most of that, particularly the insight about Tay finally yielding an opportunity involuntarily (injury).

    Dumars the wizard of course. And Coxey's Army marches to his tune.
  16. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    I only watched the 1st half of this game, but it seemed to take most of the half before the Pistons gave the ball to Monroe on offense. I'm starting to think of him as a 5 now.

    Why aren't the Pistons running more pick and rolls with Summers?
  17. S.J.

    S.J. All-Star Forum Donor

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    I just read something about Greg Monroe's lack of emotion..

    I'm kind of down right now..
  18. S.J.

    S.J. All-Star Forum Donor

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    Sorry! .. Wait!

    The full note is here: Pistons rookie Greg Monroe keeps his cool and focuses on team's success | MLive.com


    “I think I did OK,“ Monroe said. “I never grade myself. It doesn’t matter what I do personally as long as the team wins. That’s the only thing that matters."

    I know that winning is the most important thing.. but in the Summer League what I want to see is if you can dominate, if you can shoot, if you can rebound and if you can pass..

    "He’s got such a cool demeanor that I wouldn’t know it if he was nervous," said Pistons assistant coach Pat Sullivan, who is coaching the Summer League team. “He’s a very interesting kid. He’s very well-spoken. He’s very sharp. He picks things up very, very well."


    That's ok. He is not temperamental.. that's ok (Even when that doesn't fit that old "Pistons - Bad Boys" thing.)

    "Some Detroit Pistons fans might not appreciate the lack of emotion Monroe demonstrates on the floor, especially if the Pistons have another rough season in 2009-10. But while some young players have a tendency to waste their energy and lose their focus displaying their emotions (see Austin Daye, 2009-10 season), Monroe simply analyzes the situation in an attempt to learn a lesson for the future.

    He is learning to get better and focusing on the next play, not dwelling on the last one."


    That's great.. but I still don't see Monroe as a Center.. not in a million years..

    We need Al Jefferson or some guy who can start at the C position and be a menace in the inside.. sadly Monroe won't be our guy, maybe in 3 years..
  19. Laimbrane

    Laimbrane All-Star Forum Donor

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    I look at Monroe as possibly being more of a Tim Duncan type of player - though without his complete skillset. I'm okay with that.
  20. det2atl

    det2atl Second Round Draft Pick

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    Alright Piston faithful, on my way to Vegas. Very interested in Monday's game between the Pistons vs. Kings. Will try to report back what I see first hand. Anyone else out in Vegas for the games?

    Det2Atl

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