Latest Lineup Changes

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by Pwn Toney, Jan 12, 2011.

  1. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    The Pistons have won games with Rip playing haven't they? I think they even won 59 games the year before Stuckey was permanently moved into the starting 5.

    It has been downhill since which seems odd given that he purportedly plays such a winning style. That doesn't seem like a conspiracy to me.
     
  2. Mogilny

    Mogilny All-Star Forum Donor

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    Yeah, and Shaq is the best center in the league.
     
  3. max

    max All-Star

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    Only thing that makes sense was that he must not have been listening to the coach or following the game plan. He once told Curry that he should not have to listen to him since he sucked as a player ( or something like that ) . He also seems to have been not respecting Q that much.

    There must be something to it since the team looks so much more like a team now out on the court. Rip brought this on himself.
     
  4. copper

    copper Bench Warmer

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    Yeah they won with rip starting, when his mojo cbill was here...thats why I said after his mojo left. He hasnt been the same player since, he plays like a shell of himself and doesnt seem to mesh with the teammates. and he defenitely doesnt mesh with the coach
     
  5. Walter

    Walter All-Star Forum Donor

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    That's a myth. There was no significant drop in Rip's numbers after Billups left. Check the stats: NBA.com : Richard Hamilton Career Stats Page

    The only thing that went down was his FG% which is understandable. However, his FT% went up and he posted almost identical numbers in points, rebounds, assists.

    It's no secret that CB's departure really affected Rip's play and his attitude has damaged this team over and over. But, let's give the man his due as well. Sometimes people react like Rip turned into a binary stat line guy the day Billups was traded and that simply is not true.
     
  6. copper

    copper Bench Warmer

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    I was reffering more to his attitude and demeanor on the court rather than his numbers, cause we all know stats can lie in regards to performance and team chemistry.
     
  7. Walter

    Walter All-Star Forum Donor

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    Then you get no argument from me. Rip's always been a hot head. He's always been 2-3 technicals behind Sheed. After [STRIKE]Chauncey's [/STRIKE] Larry Brown's departure it just got worse and worse.
     
  8. 2Tough4You

    2Tough4You Bench Warmer

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    A pick in the 20-30 range for Stuckey, in one of the weakest drafts in recent memory? Come on.
     
  9. 2Tough4You

    2Tough4You Bench Warmer

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    Why the heck should Stuckey come off the bench in favor of Ben Gordon? Gordon had his chance when he was given the starting role and he failed miserably with it. This team is winning ball games with Stuckey at the two and he is unarguably a better all around player than Gordon. Gordon is damn near worthless when he isn't scoring. I don't see any reason why he should start ahead of Stuckey, and that's not me praising Stuckey as being great either.

    Putting Stuckey in Rip's role is even more egregious to suggest. Playing Hamilton a ton of minutes is not going to make teams want to trade for him. That isn't happening.
     
  10. KGREG

    KGREG All-Star

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    Weak draft indeed, which is why I'd give away this years pick to any team willing to take Rip in exchange for an expiring deal.
     
  11. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    Don't know exactly what you mean to say with this post - but I do want to put down a complete history here of the move of Stuckey into the starting five. That was sometime after Billups was given away to Denver - 2 games into the season, to let Billups go home as he wished. (Nothing to do with helping the team.) The previous year, Billups started - and he had an energetic young Stuckey to come in and spell him. When Stuckey was the point - we had no point guard on the team really to run the show if he sat. So of course the team got worse - nothing at all to do with how good a player Stuckey is. (again, just Dumars doing his level headed best to tear down the team he once cared about.)
     
  12. Nemo

    Nemo Fantasy-Football Snub Forum Donor

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    Of all coaches since LB...it is this guy who is showing the most moxy by standing up to the players and benching them when they don't preform. He hasn't followed logic with his lineup changes, but the team seems to be playing better for now. Rip has gone to the land of the Petty (along with the coach), but Tay seems to be committed to making the team better. Helping him out is T-mac. It would be nice if the two of them (Rip and Q.) could solve this issue.
    Then we could get back to blaming Stuckey for everything again. :)
     
  13. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    The options to me are letting him walk for nothing or getting an extra pick. You at least give yourself a chance for success if you can get a pick for him.
     
  14. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    All I was trying to say was that one player has demonstrated he can function on a winning team while the other hasn't come close. One player has achieved in the L (as Gordon also had prior to coming here.) while one has lived off his dad's name.

    2 shooting guards who have accomplished stuff in the NBA and they're both in the toilet. Maybe DET is just the place where the 2 guards come to die, but maybe it is something else?
     
  15. Walter

    Walter All-Star Forum Donor

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    Don't take that as a knock on Stuckey. Since Rip's in the doghouse and Daye playing SF/PF minutes exclusively, there's a huge dropoff in guard quality when the bench comes in right now. We go from a huge backcourt (TMac/Stuckey) to a midget backcourt (Bynum/Gordon). Having Stuckey come off the bench with Bynum would balance that out a little bit. Also, TMac can probably do a better job of feeding Gordon than Bynum.

    The chronic issue is both Rip and Gordon are very similar players and neither one's play meshes well with Stuckey's. So, you'll always have a zero chemistry backcourt coming off the bench (or starting).

    TMac/Stuckey is working. Bynum needs to be limited to spot minutes at this point. That leaves Gordon and Rip as your backup guards. Terrible idea. The best scenario with the current roster might be to, *gasp*, start TMac and Rip and have Stuckey/Gordon come of the bench. We may very well see that once we get a 6 game losing streak going.
     
  16. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 3x Fantasy Champion

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    Rod Stuckey is VERY replaceable. I'd take a low 1st rounder for him in a freaking heartbeat!
    Unless you're one of the top 10 SGs in the league, you're a "dime a dozen" type player. At this point, Rodney isn't a top-10 SG. I strongly feel that the NBA is full of players that if given the same opportunities that Rodney has, they'd put up similar numbers and contribute to team success in a similar (or better) fashion.

    To me, Rodney was an intriguing prospect due to his size and quickness at the POINT position. But with every opportunity in the world given to him; he's proved that at best, he's a back-up PG.

    At the 2-spot, Rodney is "just another" 15-17 ppg guy who isn't going to do anything special. WHY re-sign him at a 4-6 million per year salary spot when we can get someone AS GOOD or BETTER quite easily.

    ...Or better yet, thin out the herd at SG and start addressing some of the gaping holes in this roster.
     
  17. Mogilny

    Mogilny All-Star Forum Donor

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    $25M per year + our franchise player on the SG position and it might be the weakest position on the team. That is pretty mindblowing considering the quality of the other positions.
     
  18. dba

    dba All-Star Moderator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    It does seem kind of obvious. T-Mac, Stuckey, & Gordon get around 30 minutes a night with Bynum picking up the other six. But to do that T-Mac and Gordon need to start so that Stuckey can come off the bench for McGrady and take over the point for a stretch, then switch to off guard when McGrady comes back in.
     
  19. KGREG

    KGREG All-Star

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    NOBODY is willing to give us ANYTHING for Rip, we're going to have to pay someone to take him by attaching an asset (player or pick) to him.

    Walter, Ball Don't Lie & Mogilny, THANK-YOU those are/were my exact sentiments.

    It's about optimizing the talents on the roster and one thing we haven't seen extensively is T-Mac and Gordon together starting in the backcourt. I think playing alongside T-Mac (I think, as I have no way of knowing) Ben Gordon can get back to the 20 ppg scorer he has proven he is, he's had to play alongside two awful PG's in Bynum and Stuckey who seem incapable of delivering an on-target/on-time pass to a shooter (which may explain Rip's troubles also).

    I'm convinced that Stuckey is a 15 ppg scorer (which come a dime a dozen) whether he starts and plays 35mpg or comes off the bench and plays 25mpg. A backup unit of Bynum/Stuckey/CV/BenW/Daye is a unit with 2 drivers, 2 shooters and 3 good defenders (when Bynum is healthy) a starting unit of T-Mac/Gordon/Tay/GM/Wilcox is solid and you can close games with either Daye, CV, or Wallace at the 4 spot depending on what we need.
     
  20. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    I'd give two guys like Stuckey to get Afflalo back. Just my opinion based on if one of them is going to be our shooting guard.

    Just to remind anyone, or inform anyone if they have read what I wrote over the years, it was always my conclusion when I studied game film that it was Afflalo who was one of the most key players we had as far as whether we won a game if he played. His policing of the perimeter was awesome. The other team could not base their attack on the perimeter game, knowing we could send AA in to ruin it anytime we felt like it.
     

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