Lebron vs Jordan

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by max, Apr 17, 2006.

  1. max

    max All-Star

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    The most striking thing here is his age. It took Kobe 3 years, T-mac 3 years, Wade went to college.
    LJ has such of a huge jump start over other players and its hard to say what his potential will be. I think we already know
    what Kobe and Wade are capable of.

    The NBA does make it hard to like LJ. All the calls, hype. I have come to the conclusion that the NBA does not care if you like their players as long as you watch them.
     
  2. Dlev59

    Dlev59 Bench Warmer Moderator

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    I am a LeBron fan, however, let`s not be to quick to crown him as of yet, especially after one playoff performance against the Wiz!

    I am confident the Cav`s will get by the Wiz, then let`s see what he does against a defense like the Pistons.

    The young man is extremely talented but until he gets a "Robin" he will never be "Batman"

    Larry Hughes or Flip Murray is not Robin! Nor is Iglauskas.
     
  3. max

    max All-Star

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    Lets keep in mind Jordans 1st playoffs. His team was sub-500 around 32-36 wins going against the 86 Celtics. Bulls were swept but Jordan set a playoff record of 63 points in one of the losses which sent the game to overtime.

    So far Lebran has started with a triple-double and a win. Not a bad start so far. Jordan was still in College at his age.

    I should also point out that I have liked Lebran in Interviews. He seems intellegent and humble given his circumstances. Its all the hype and watching him get all the calls that is hard to like.
     
  4. rdang

    rdang First Round Draft Pick

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    I concur - the reason why we judge individual games right now on Lebron is because they're so important to his speedy growth. It shouldn't matter that it's the Wizards - a team's opponent should not overshadow someone's personal accomplishment.

    This is a kid who has millions of people, regardless if he wants or not, watching and judging his growth since day one. This kid has continually impressed me by living up to expectations and surpassing the doubts that people have had. (Look at the article) I never said I don't like Wade - the kid's great but he's definately got a better supporting cast than Lebron which has led to his success and wins in the past 2 seasons. Remember, Lebron has missed the last two seasons playoffs by one game or through tiebreakers.

    Tonight's loss against the Wiz taught me another thing about Lebron's character and his potential to be a great leader and player. After a horrific night of shooting (7 for 25, 26 points) he was stated as saying: "I missed a lot of shots, layups that I usually make. They did a great job. I didn't come to play."

    He's taking responsibility and if there's anyone who plays a sport knows - taking responsibility is one of the founding principles to getting better. Wade last year was an example of this in the first game of the Conference Finals against the Pistons when he had a bad night - he knew it was his fault and came back with a drive unmatched by any of our five on the floor. Another example of it is what Sheed does when he "Guaransheed"'s us a win (look: Pacers vs Pistons 2005 Semi Finals). That's what a champion has, and as much as Wade has it - we gotta see that Lebron has just as much.

    This kid is here not just because he wants to be a champion - he wants to be a legend. Now all we can do is watch the next game and watch his growth again as he rebounds from a bad shooting night to hopefully be a hero once again. Game three ladies and gentlemen, a game to watch.
     
  5. max

    max All-Star

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    Thats the wrong question to ask . Ask what if Lebran was replaced by the 3rd year version of Kobe?

    Point being Lebran will get a lot better by the time he reaches Kobes age. My original point to this thread is not how good LJ is now, rather how good can he be? I am sure the Lakers would jump on that deal if it were presented.
     
  6. dba

    dba All-Star Moderator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    One thing this thread points out is how difficult it is to guess / project / determine how good LBJ will be. And not for all the usual reasons, but because he is in a wildly different position from players from earlier generations.

    - Look at the kid. Jordan never ended up with a body like his. Pretty much no player of Jordan's generation did. If you weren't around or didn't see players from ten or fifteen years ago up close and personal, take a look at ESPN Classics and see how skinny they were. We're not used to seeing players so well developed physically so young simply because no one has ever been that way before.

    - Which raises the question, can a guard play a full career in the NBA at 240 pounds (LBJ) versus the 210-215 that Jordan played at. I don't think we have any idea how well he will hold up by looking at players from the past. Remember, Moses Malone played at 230 or so.

    - Besides raw talent and better bodies, how do young players get so good so quickly? Simple exposure to the game must be a big part of it. I bet LBJ's first baby rattle was in the shape of a basketball. Certainly no one in the past had the constant exposure to the game, with tons of readily available stats and replays, not to mention games actually on TV. When Jordan grew up it was pretty hard to find a live NBA game on TV.

    So we got players like LBJ, who not only end up with great basketball genes, but have also been working at conditioning and skills since elementary school graduation. (I wonder when Jordan picked up his first weight?) Players who have seen more of the game on TV than players of Jordan's generation probably ever saw in their careers.

    Welcome to the future.
     
  7. Warthog

    Warthog Bench Warmer

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    i don't necessarily disagree, but lebron also has a lot of practice and training in knowing the right thing to say.

    in any case, the wiz even publicly conceded they are not that great defensively...but i'm glad to see they applied 'jordan rules' in pounding lebrong. you could see he was really really frustrated when they didn't let him get easy dunks or layups, almost like he felt entitled to them.
     
  8. dba

    dba All-Star Moderator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    First line of today's MSNBC article about last night's Cavs/Wiz game...

    "In first game since historic playoff debut, James..."

    WTF?

    Historic?

    People would be getting healed by statues of the Jordan if he had had the kind of hype LBJ has.
     
  9. Pastor Flournoy

    Pastor Flournoy First Round Draft Pick

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    Kobe is closer to Mike Tyson.
     
  10. Pastor Flournoy

    Pastor Flournoy First Round Draft Pick

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    I think Lakers would be better. IMO James knows how to get his teammates more involved. Lamar Odum might play to his potential.
     
  11. max

    max All-Star

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    dba - young players are not getting good quickly - most of them are failing or take 2-3 years to come around.

    LBJ is in a class by himself.
     
  12. LanierFan

    LanierFan Bench Warmer

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    From today's New York Times:


     
  13. linwood

    linwood All-Star

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    I have nothing against Bron, but...

    Finally! Someone is willing to deliver a hard foul that isn't crazy (ron). I miss the part of basketball. Not that I am advocating a bunch of thugs playing goon ball, but I really hate the layup line and the flop (unless it's really good) and the freethrow parade. Dull, man, dull. Make these cats earn thier paychecks. Lay some wood. No Free Chili.
     
  14. linwood

    linwood All-Star

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    Hard to play to your potential when Mamba won't give you the ball.
     
  15. OLD SKOOL HQ

    OLD SKOOL HQ All-Star

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    Here I go acting old again. There has never been a 21 year old as dominate in any sport like Lebron sans Wayne Gretzky. When LeBron is 25, he will have been in the league SEVEN years! I can not fathom how could he will be, but I can compare him to Moses Malone. Malone got mature physically and his talent merged with his girth, He became 3 time MVP...and Malone isnt HALF the player LeBron is. Guys, 31-7 and 7 at 21???!!!!! Jordan is the king, but here comes the truth!
     
  16. LanierFan

    LanierFan Bench Warmer

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    I don't dislike LeBron James. It'd be hard to do, really. I just don't like the company he keeps.

    Namely ESPN.

    In the latest trough-wallowing orgy of excess, ESPN Classic will be replaying James' triple-double against the Wizards. Why wait until a long and storied career makes it worthwhile to look back at an otherwise trifling achievement? Our Bristol friends specialize in instant history, no waiting. YOU WILL WATCH. YOU WILL CONSUME. YOU WILL BELIEVE.

    If that place burned to the ground, I'd gather the charred remains from the Executive Offices and use them as briquets for a barbecue.
     
  17. rdang

    rdang First Round Draft Pick

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    What's wrong with that?

    Think about what ESPN is doing: sure it may be a little premature to put LBJ in a "Classics" game but one of the main reasons why they have those games isn't just for you old timers to look back and reminisce; but to also set an example for the newer generation (guys like me).

    The complaints about today's NBA is largely routed in its rise in popularity of the hip hop culture and it's "tough" and "gangster" attitude (ala Iverson, Garnett). No matter how much these players claim that they're not role models (Barkley), they are and will always undoubtly make an impact on the future attitudes of the NBA's future players. The media even depicts coaches (see Larry Brown) with praise for classy endings and smart fundamental basketball.

    Enter LBJ the era: a truly ideal NBA specimen with a pass-first, team-player attitude. Something that hasn't been around from a superstar since the days of Magic (before my time). Can anyone really complain about this kid getting all this publicity? Everytime he's on the air he's as humble as anyone I know. Why not give him more air time?

    With the rise of the popularity in basketball in North America; I'm glad. I'm glad that gone are the days of the AI's and the KG's. I'm glad the days of selfish basketball has dwindled and hurt the image of the sport to the point where the "American Dream Team" has become a shell of its former self. Enter the days of the Dwight Howard's and the LBJ's. Enter a new age of great team-play, individual effort and emphasis on leadership in the NBA.
     
  18. LanierFan

    LanierFan Bench Warmer

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    Well, you and ESPN will be very happy together. I just don't see why a merely excellent performance in the first game of a pedestrian playoff series should get the same treatment as, say, Kobe Bryant's 81-point game. If they changed the name to ESPN Rerun or ESPN LeBron, sure. (And that will probably come in time.)
     
  19. rdang

    rdang First Round Draft Pick

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    'Cause the last superstar who gathered a triple-double in his first playoff game was a fellow by the name of Magic Johnson. Classic? I believe so.
     
  20. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    It's classic because of what followed his triple double (amazing career), not just that he had the triple double. LeBron hasn't done Jack but put up some gaudy regular season #s.

    That's the issue some of us have with LeBron. He's being sold a little too hard and heavy as "the next great one". Read my article on the HOF. We got guys going without recognition and yet have to watch what happened last week as instant classic. Kinda stupid don't you think?

    You gotta be careful rdang. This much player love will lead to conflicted feelings if/when the Cavs play the Pistons. We are here for you.
     

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