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Locker Room Rumbles?

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by roscoe36, May 20, 2006.

  1. Dlev59

    Dlev59 Bench Warmer Moderator

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    Did someone mention Antoine Walker? I knew someone was missing from who I hate, uh, dislike list.

    He will be a non-factor against Detroit. Unless he hits a few 3`s he is useless, let him bring his jughead a^$% to the basket with Dyess, and Ben waiting for him.
     
  2. Warthog

    Warthog Bench Warmer

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    feel any differently about this after today? :)
     
  3. max

    max All-Star

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    You have to be carefull when forecasting what will happen this summer when the playoffs are still going on. Someone this afternoon called Prince a choker and then Prince went on to become the player of the game in game 7.

    If the Pistons win the title and Ben signs for a reasonable amount then some of you risk getting caught with your cyber pants down.
     
  4. KGREG

    KGREG All-Star

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    This playoff run is vital to our sucess in the next three years. count me in as one of the people who feels Ben Wallace might have something to do with our success:noidea:

    If we win the ring it will be because we got back to doing the things that make us who we really are, that will keep Ben a Piston. Right now, in Flip's system, Ben gets marginalized, if we lose because Flip doesn't get us back to blue collar work, then Ben would be better suited for the Bulls, and as much as I hate to say this..........................with the absence of DMC, the catastrophe of Ben departing would be compounded.:doh:
     
  5. mercury

    mercury Bench Warmer

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    Kinda makes me wonder if there might be some intentional leaving Ben out of the offense to help keep his cost down... winning is obviously the most important criteria but judging by the mixed reviews it's not certain that Ben being a bigger part of the offense translates into W's. :confused:
     
  6. armygirl

    armygirl Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    Those of you who thinks that Ben should be traded, I have two words for ya


    Crack Kills................

    As far as the locker room bickering, So What.................

    Crap, the Heat players, Payton & Wade was getting ready to throw down on National T.V. Wade bickering about Mourning, Mourning bickering about Wade, Antoine trying to be the peacemaker, Shaq looking stupid.

    This is the playoffs, everything can't smell like roses all the time. I can't imagine living with my family 240 days out of the year and everything is peachy......won't happen.

    I would pay more attention to what's going on in the Heat's locker room, they are the ones that showed their cue card, at least the Pistons keep their stuff on the DL.
     
  7. aurora

    aurora Bench Warmer

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    You really have to wonder about the psyche of this team right now.Whatever is wrong with them for the last six games does seem to be systemic. They seem to be having a failure of will as a team.

    If it's occurred to us, you can bet it's occurred to them that the more we win and advance toward the championship, the less likely it is that Flip will be sent out to pasture. I would think that if some or all of them have serious reservations about wanting to continue to play for Flip, that would create what they call in the therapeutic world a double bind.

    As micro says above, the last time Larry Brown was the escape goat. So, with Ben unhappy about Flip, with them all being way overplayed in order to win homecourt, with the unwillingness to use the bench sensibly or at all, and with the starters all having already gotten their ring, I wonder if this team has an unspoken agreement or even unconscious commitment to not perform. I just wonder.

    Now I'm not saying they are intentionally losing. I'm not saying that they aren't trying. I am saying that there could be some serious motivational conflicts for our 5 starters. And then there's McDyess, who is just beside himself with drive and desire for this thing. I wish we could clone him and play him at all five positions right now.

    I would rather not see a repeat of this in next year's playoffs. So let the chips fall where they may, but I can do without the new improved offense. Give me back my LB Pistons without the LB! I do understand what micro is saying, that part of this is developmental. But if that is so, I think we need a coach that understands that specific challenge. You know, championship team struggles with frontrunner status. Flip doesn't have that no matter how smart he is.

    I'm just saying what more simple, eloquent and obvious way is there to show that Flip's system isn't working than to lose games using it? I'm just sayin'.
     
  8. LanierFan

    LanierFan Bench Warmer

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    So many unlicensed psychiatrists around here.

    Imagine a world without byzantine motives and subconscious desires to sabotage coaches by losing. A world where players of experience and accomplishment encounter something many of us struggle with as we get older: Expecting a little more while wanting it a little less.

    But it couldn't be that simple, could it? Nah.
     
  9. anakin

    anakin First Round Draft Pick

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    Is there something wrong with this team? They have been so uncharacteristically not playing Piston ball I can't help but wonder what it is? Or is it the famous Chuck Daly "last big game" theory in effect. Chuck thinks that a team comes to a point where they just can't get up for the big games anymore and it's time for changes. Maybe the roster needs to be shaken up.
     
  10. BillLaimbeer

    BillLaimbeer All-Star 4x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Until the Pistons get eliminated from the playoffs, I'm not going to panic like many of you. They aren't throwing away games and the roster doesn't need to be shaken up. They played an extremely horrible game and they only lost by 5 points. The real Pistons will be back. Have faith. :)
     
  11. lurker

    lurker First Round Draft Pick

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    I agree 100%. There's no need to freak out. I'm not thrilled to start the series in a 0-1 hole, but Miami shot extremely well, and they're unlikely to continue at that pace. Shaq's week of rest is over, so watch him become less and less effective with the every-other-day schedule. It's a long series...practice, regroup, hit it tomorrow.
     
  12. professor

    professor Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    ditto: not to mention that Shaq wasn't all that effective even with a week's rest: 14 points, foul trouble, etc... and we are unlikely to continue shooting (at least our four main scorers) so poorly...
     
  13. aurora

    aurora Bench Warmer

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    Hmm. Well I have a sister who is a licensed psychologist. Does that count?:laugh:

    Certainly it could be what you propose. LanierFan. If so, it's a rather drastic falloff due to increased age and newfound lack of desire. I mean, how long has it been since the regular season? Five weeks or so? Now if we were talking about the 2004 Lakers your argument might carry a little more weight. And even if that is it, then they need a coach experienced with the dynamic of championship teams even more.

    And no sorry but it couldn't be that simple. Because "expecting a little more while wanting it a little less" is still a psychological state of mind.

    So there. Imagine a world where the Detroit Pistons play DEEETROIT BAAASKETBAALL. Is that too much to ask in the playoffs?
     
  14. Dumars4Ever

    Dumars4Ever Bench Warmer

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    A couple of reasons for optimism about last night--two of the things that lost us those three games against Cleveland were (a) committing way too many turnovers and (b) bricking huge numbers of FTs. But both of those things were taken care of nicely last night, as the Pistons had only 6 TOs to Miami's 15, while shooting 19 of 22 from the line. It's pretty clear that if ANYONE had been making ANY SHOTS AT ALL from the floor, it would have been a win. And it doesn't look like Shaq is going to be any sort of consistent difference-maker for the Heat, as lurker and Prof both mentioned just above.

    Pessimistically speaking, Rasheed and Chauncey have just fallen apart on offense. They've both been consistently bad since early in the Cleveland series. Big trouble if that doesn't change real soon.
     
  15. anakin

    anakin First Round Draft Pick

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    Can we stir not shake?:laugh:
     
  16. aurora

    aurora Bench Warmer

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    from the Professor in New Pistons Motto thread
    i certainly do think the issue is a mental or, more precisely, psychological one. but i'm starting to think the ups and downs and lapses come from how focused the Pistons have been (since the end of last June actually) on "THE TITLE". Everything has been about the next GAME 7 BEING AT THE PALACE AND WINNING IT.

    Sometimes when you get fixated on a long-term goal, you lose sight of the fact that reaching that destination consists of many tiny (and not immediately rewarding, let alone spectacular or glorious) steps along the way. Moreover, in formulating the goal in terms of "game 7 being at the palace" the Pistons might have inadvertently missed the point: the point would be not to even need Game 7 at the Palace because you've already taken care of business ahead of time.

    I used to think they got bored when things got easy. That might still be true sometimes. But I think the case is that they are so caught up with winning the championship as all that matters that they take their eyes off the step that is right in front of them. That would explain why they are so "miraculously" resilient. The losses or poor performances remind them that they winning the title is actually made up of winning a bunch of games that are right in front of them; not just winning game 7 of the finals.

    It certainly doesn't make them easy to watch. And there's always the danger that the moment they refocus and realize they need to win the one right in front of them they run into some guy on a tear, or their own shots rim out, or another team will be clicking on all cylinders. But I don't share what I sense is a kind of disappointment and even disdain for the team for having lost desire or become fat and happy. They aren't underdogs, they aren't just happy to be in the playoffs, or the 2nd round, or even the conference finals. Maybe they should be, ideally, but that doesn't really seem realistic or even honest. They've been saying it all year, we fans have been saying it all year: "the only thing that matters is a championship. anything less would be a disappointment." I think they are playing exactly like anybody would who has such a drastically unbalanced fixation.

    What they need to pull through is to remember that championships are won one series at a time, one game at a time, one minute at a time, one cut, one pass, one stop, one board at a time. I'm guessing they'll only remember that when losses force that reminder upon them.

    ---------------------------------------------------------------------

    I thought this excellent perspective from the Professor in the first New Pistons Motto thread deserved a read here in case any one missed it. I didn't know how to put it here, so Roscoe forgive and let me know if I broke a rule by copying and pasting like this from one thread to another.

    As far as psychological theories for Pistons underformance go, we may have enough to have our own thread! I figure if we are going to have endless posts debating the bench, statistics, and God Forbid Darko still, the forum can afford a few amateur psychologists going wild as well.
     
  17. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    This is possible. The Pistons have shafted players and coaches in the past. Maybe Joe D is a member of the inner circle now.

    Hey man, that's better than having unlicensed
    • Gynecologists
    • Obstetricians
    • Sexologists
    • Neurologists
    • Colon and Rectal specialists
    running around here!

    Maybe the players should not coach themselves. The coach should coach (motivate, train, scheme) and the players should play (make shots, rebound, pass).

    More leap of faith!
     
  18. TheeTFD

    TheeTFD All-Star

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    More Flip sandbagging?
    AHB, Tay was an opportunity player during the reg. season. Now I see him slashing into the paint. And being successful.
     

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