Pistons Payroll

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by Slippy, Oct 27, 2005.

  1. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    From ASB's article. Nothing surprising here. But we know that Dumars is trying to build a roster strategy that remains competative long term. Is that an insurmountable task? I think Prince, Billups, and Wallace all deserve big money but their effectiveness will probably wear out before their new contracts to. Ok, maybe not prince.
    I have a feeling that dumars is trying to avoid a repeat of the 90's era pistons. But is that impossible given the realities of NBA salaries and salary caps? Or is it merely difficult. :confused:
     
  2. TheeTFD

    TheeTFD All-Star

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    The last I heard we are 15th in largest salary. That's probably too low for a 'ship team. JD has to get more cash from Mr. D. Every other team would like to steal a part. It's a players market and a owners time for buying. Bup-Bup is under paid.
     
  3. MainManJoeD

    MainManJoeD First Round Draft Pick

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    Payroll

    Alot of what happens in the future depends on how aggressive/ cut-throat Joe D is willig to be. In order to keep the payroll low, he has to keep from committing to players that are moving past their prime. In the past, Joe was able to move these guys off to other teams for younger, cheaper rising stars (ie Hill for Wallace, Stack for Rip) before they became too expensive. That was a lot easier to do when the team was losing and people were itching for change, and not probably quite as loyal to the players as we are now. The question is can JD trade B or R Wallace or Billups before their next extensions and find the next up and coming but cheaper star. That's going to be a lot harder. One could argue, though, that preservation of the system Joe has created (hard work, team attitude) is the most important thing here, not the players. We just need players who buy whole-heartedly into the system. Joe has to continue to find them.

    Can he pull this off? I don't know. He'd essentially have to say goodbye and thanks for the memories (he did it before with Hunter- he claims that winning comes first) to some Rising Pistons legends. Tough.
     
  4. mercury

    mercury Bench Warmer

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    I agree that Joe has been the master of buying low and selling high.
    In Hammond's recent chat, he alluded to the idea of trading one of our vet bigs in a year or two (translate Ben, Sheed, Dice or DD) to free up a spot for the young bigs.
    If you're looking at just a market value perspective... in two years our 33 year old bigs value will plummet.... Next year we may still get prime value from a team that believes they're one vet away from contending.
    It all hinges on Darko's progress this year.
     
  5. mercury

    mercury Bench Warmer

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    Briefly scanning other team salaries for next year... it doesn't look too bad for us. Several teams that have typically had $'s to spend, used up their cap this summer.

    Here's the teams that will have cap $'s and the threat factor for Tayshaun:
    Chicago...High threat.. plenty to spend..need a SF
    Atlanta... Low threat... $'s available but overloaded at SG/SF
    Charlotte... moderate... plenty of cap... does he want to play for a lotto team?
    Seattle... low (unless they trade Allen or Lewis)
    Utah... moderate... about 8M to spend
    Clipps.. High threat... $'s to spend... Tay's home town... possible playoff team.

    Maybe Joe is thinking it's worth the risk to wait... unfortunately if Tay decided to ride it out he may want to wait one more year when he's unrestricted and there will be several teams that have $'s to spend...
    It appears to be a shared risk right now... both sides should want to get it done in the next few days.
     
  6. TheeTFD

    TheeTFD All-Star

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    MMJD, Merc concur

    Don't forget the Lakers, they would go into the fine to get a piece of the Pistons.
    MMJD, I don't know that JD would quit on one of our starters without a fight. I say he milks them to the bitter end. He would have to have the replacement in hand before releasing. Bup-Bup will be here another 4-5 years. He's JDs prize possession. BaBaBen, you make the call. If Rip falters in the finals again, maybe no effort to keep him. This season will tell a lot as to which way to go as far as keeping up with the Spurs, Heat, Pacers.:confused:
    ...Then again if guys start breaking down with injurys it could get cut throat.
     
  7. TBird

    TBird First Round Draft Pick

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    Merc

    Nice work.

    I'd actually remove Utah from the list. They're already paying their starting front line (Kirilenko, Boozer, Okur) mega-bucks.
     
  8. FreshPrince22

    FreshPrince22 Bench Warmer

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    Chicago already has Luol Deng, whom they are very high on, and the Clippers have Maggete and Mobley locked into long-term deals. Plus the Clippers owner is a huge cheap ass. So, I would lower both of them to "moderate". I would raise Charlotte to "High" as well, since they will likely be looking for someone at his position. And if Tayshaun is getting an offer of 45+ million from us (the perfect situation for him), and he is threatening to leave, then clearly money is a huge deal for him. So, maybe that means he's willing to go there.
     
  9. bricalz

    bricalz First Round Draft Pick

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    Tough indeed

    The problem with trading down for better up and comers is that you trade a potential Piston legend for someone who'll be a star and eventually get traded again.

    I don't know, if I was a player I'd know that'd be the trend and would simply elect to go to a place where they'd have me stay til I retire as well as pay me equivalent to my worth.

    If we don't pay, we wouldn't have any Hall of Famers or Detroit Legends to say that he truly was a Piston like Reggie will forever be associated with the Pacers. :ohwell:
     
  10. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    I think Jerry Krause (?) got that bad rep once he started cleaning house after the Bull's run. Good FA's didn't want to go there, if I remember rightly.
     
  11. TheeTFD

    TheeTFD All-Star

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    What is the equivalent of your worth? 4 more million over 4 years. Then it's the money. Possibly change the balance of power. Make your own dynasty? High risk.
     
  12. G-man

    G-man Starter

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    Two-sided coins

    I think in Tays case - from his perspective, looking at future values when signing a deal for 4-6 years is pretty basic. He see's Big Bens and C-Notes deals and its clear the Pistons negotiated those contracts in their favor. Something Dumars is paid to do himself. They are competing interests.

    When they signed C-Note the last time around they were gambling on his becoming a better player later in his contract. There were alot of people on Detroit Forums saying he was overpaid in that deal. (though not as many as when Rip signed his deal)

    As an example in C-notes case Dumars negotitated the value of time Vs money and had the then current CBA deal (financially more restrictive and punitive) firmly in the background for a little added leverage.

    There was less risk that we would be getting more bang for the buck later than they got the day they signed the deal. Dumars came up roses.

    Today I think everyone agrees that bbbbbillups is underpaid. Who got the better end of that deal by todays PG$ payroll standards?

    It's Time Vs Money and whoever sells it to the other party better. The biggest difference is that teams today aren't under the same punitive and restrictive payroll tax situation as they were when Ben and C-Note signed their deals.

    Plus the way the total team costs are calculated has changed under the new CBA. The players negotiating today, right after the new CBA deal has been defined, but before teams have "jimmied up" their roster costs, are in the drivers seats if they have good skill sets and fit well.

    Tay will get his money and remain a Piston. Only question is whether he gets it by Tuesday morning or if it takes until next summer..

    I'm still betting it's Tuesday..
     
  13. TheeTFD

    TheeTFD All-Star

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    What? In C'Notes and BBens first contracts they were unproven players. Not even starters. JD was able to sign them to lower end deals. But now with 'ships on there resumes the money has to get big. What the players have to understand and what JD must insist is, they are better as a team than as renegades.
     
  14. KP

    KP First Round Draft Pick

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    Better maybe, but not richer.
     
  15. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    OH, pity the day the NBA refugees that were Pistons champions become renegades. Unless they become Renegades of Funk. Then I'm down with it.

    [​IMG]
     
  16. MotownPride

    MotownPride Starter 2x Fantasy Champion

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    cool pic!
     
  17. TheeTFD

    TheeTFD All-Star

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    Afnifbamba-what!!!

    You musta been hanging out at a comic book store. How dare you come at me with the "Renegades of Funk"! Who's the blonde guy? :confused: :pound: :yield:
     

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