Rip doesn't want to go to the bench

Before everybody jumps on Rip, what do you think AI's response to coming off the bench would be? Just sayin.

If Rip is a selfish a-- for that then . . .

edited to add;

AI said he would do whatever's asked of him (then promptly missed practice), but he hasn't been in that position so no one can assume what his reaction would be.

This is why I heavily criticised the trade earlier because if we had've bought for example Camby and J.R. to the team then we have our bench player and we have our center. I just think that Hamilton and A.I. both can't be on the team!!! It's too late to ramble on, i've done plenty of it, the trade was made, it has been good that we have a guy that can win games, and off his back and grind them out when the team is struggling as exhibited today. I think just stick with this, one of them will go to the bench and if A.I. is going to stick with the 1 million quotes that go along the lines of, 'I will give up what is necessary to win'. Prove it A.I!

Rip can win two more championships somewhere and he still won't be half the lock for HOF that Iverson is.

No doubt he just put a foot out the door with those remarks, and both he and Joe D are fully aware of this.

He may not play another game in a Piston uni.

Or Joe and Curry will buckle and either

• go back to the small lineup
• for the second time in his career, Tayshaun will be coming off the bench because of Michael Curry.

Neither of these bode well IMO, because it will feed the already out of control "bigger than the team" attitude that players acquired after winning the title.

Curry can bench him but I think he might just become disruptive from that point on for the rest of the season, which in turn could hurt his trade value.

Best choice is probably to trade him asap.

I think all of these current guys need to prove it before Iverson does.

Iverson hasn't had a team that was as talented as the last few years of Pistons squads have been. Iverson hasn't been accused of not working his tail off out on the floor during a playoff game. Iverson has never been associated with "flipping the switch".

If anyone on this team needs to prove they still belong here and not on the next train behind Chauncey it's Mister "If it ain't rough it ain't right" Richard Hamilton. He's the next guy in line on the list of players that personified the attitude Joe and the fans got sick and tired of. All his comments have done is shown Joe that perhaps he hasn't decided to change those lazy, arrogant, switch flipping ways.

He's not a star.

He's not a hall of famer.

He's trade bait.

Get 'er done Joe.

Does that matter? I don't think Brent Barry was better than Ginnobli or that Shane Battier is better than Ron Artest or that Vladamir Radmonavic is better than Odom. They all start b/c it's best for the team.

What if AI is receptive to the bench idea? What if Rip and AI take turns according to match-up (bigger guard,smaller guard). Hell, what if AI/Rip go back to starting together? I think these past few games have proved that Rip's offense and general play are very much needed regardless of who the starters are. To trade him at this point would just make the team much worse (on D and O). Who's going to defend the bigger guards?

And i don't get the attitude thing from Rip. Throughout all the times that we talked about complaceny and choking and not giving it your all, Rip was HARDLY if at all the guy mentioned. It was Sheed/CB and then Sheed/CB. Rip was always praised for being consistent and playing his butt off and carrying us through series. The only thing people had negative things to say about was his temper which was never as bad as it was the last year under Flip. Did history all of a sudden change?

I think if Iverson were the one that was injured and the team had gone even 6-3 rather than the current 8-1 you would be claiming that the record of win/losses supports that the team is better with Rip.

No way a Hamilton led team without Rasheed and Chauncey keeps winning like this team has. He's not the zone buster people like to think he is. In no way am I going to forget the jumpshot hating tirades of the last few playoffs and pine for the griever so we can start settling for more jumpshots and somehow miraculously be "better".

It seems to me to be a pretty good bet that if this quote would have come from Allen that you would definitely be the OP of a thread just like this one, echoing the same sentiments that you now deem unfair only because the shoe is on the other foot.

Pretend those quotes came from Iverson...you'd be giving him the business. Admit it.

That's not true. I've been quick to criticize AI (esp in terms of the practice thing) but quick to praise him when he's played well. If i did say AI was selfish and someone pointed out to me that Rip would probably feel the same way, i would have to acknowledge the double standard and have to clarify my statement not just gloss it over.

Because i don't adore AI doesn't mean i'm blind. This whole time i'm arguing that Rip is a better fit in the SL. Since the team has adjusted better, i haven't been advocating trading anybody. My only concern at this point is better fit for the SL, and in my IMO Rip fits better in the SL. I'm also a big propenent of the chemistry between AI/AA. I can't really have that if AI is on a different team.

It seems that the tunnel vision i'm accused of is the exact same tunnel vision others have for the opposite side and ppl can't justify their "tunnel vision" by criticizing mine.

The main problem i have is who starts not who can we trade faster. I'm concerned with making it work as is.

The message JOE needs to send is to sign Iverson to an extension. Give him at least one more year than Hamilton has. If he does this, then the pecking order is established by the head of operations. If not, then it must be assumed that AI is gone after this season and Rip is our future. (based on current contract situation) To me...it seems that Rip wants to pack AI's luggage now, since he feels that he is the future.

If you call "praise" claiming that the team is proving AI should come off the bench for Hamilton game after game during a 7 game win streak.....then okay.

Is that the way it usually breaks down?

While contending that this point has been proven - during a win streak - without Rip or Rasheed.

U Might want to schedule that eye exam.

As long as your guy is the one that starts. How convenient for you that your indubitably impartial analysis has led you to conclude exactly what your emotions wanted from the beginning.

What a coincidence.

I've really gained an appreciation for Tayshaun over these past few months because of all the grieving and whining Rip has done since the Chawnkey trade. He hasn't complained a single time. Joe, trade Rip. Please.

Defending AI's comments to a fan

on AI's defense;

I don't know. I could be stubborn and just refuse to acknowledge the point and talk in circles.

Yes b/c winning = absolutely nothing wrong. Best team ever!!. Champions!! And it has nothing to do with us starting Amir and going back to a traditional line-up right? It's all AI starting.

Wanna start AI/AA and have Stuck/Rip come off the bench? That works for me as well.

If Rip is indeed claiming that he will not come off the bench for sake of the team, he needs to be traded.

Secondly, if he said this, you can bet that Joe D is ringing the phone off the hook to GM's who may have a player that will compliment our existing bench and who plays team ball.

The Joe D that I've known as a player and GM will not tolerate anyone who feels that they are bigger than the team and/or not willing to sacfrice individual goals for team success.

I agree that Joe needs to offer AI an extension, this would solidify his role as a piston for however many years. AI is a HOF'er, an individual who I would put 100% trust in taking the winning shot regardless of the challenger, not just taking a jumper, but will drive on anyone, anywhere, anytime and at any moment. I don't possess that same comfort level in Rip, and with those comments that he made, he has further clarified for me that he needs to be gone asap.

I agree AG.

I am surprised RIP made these comments especially out loud to the media. What makes RIP more important than the team? Ginoboli, Odom, Magette, Salmons, I could go on have come off the bench when perhaps they should be starting. I appreciate RIP's contributions in the past, but I have been advocating for a while that he move on. We need a legit shooter on this team someone that doesn't need screens to get off a shot and that is more of a 3 point threat. We have one hot head in Sheed and this team is not big enough for a second one. I don't know who can be had for RIP and if Joe D. can get value.

I think AA is servicable. Look at Denvers starting 2 guard. You don't really need a dominate scorer just someone that can hit a shot when open and give you 10 pts a game.

But DEN has JR Smith who most people think should be starting at the 2 and would be if he didn't have an attitude problem. And even though he doesn't start he usually plays the 4th quarters and can drop 30+ on you if you're not paying attention. DEN is also not a very good team evidenced by their record against teams +500. I love AA, but IMO he's still got a ways to go before we dub him future and sole SG.

TOR struggles playing AP at the two. UTAH use to struggle before they got Brewer (still do at times b/c he's inconsisitent ) at that position.

SAS has always had a strong scoring 2.
So have the Lakers, and MIA, CLE is now light out with a scoring 2, BOS does. I think that covers about every championship/finals in the last 6 years.

Which one of those teams are championship caliber?

TOR isn't
NOH isn't
ORL isn't (and consequently their guard position was on the main reason that we own them; they were struggling so much at the 2 they started Courtney Lee for awhile and even toyed with the idea of JJ Redick)
And Finley doesn't start on SAS anymore at the 2; Now it's DMason/Ginnobli. And Finley plays SF in place of Bowen.

And in terms of CLE; they have 3 combo guards that can and do all play the 2 and can score (Williams/Gibson/West)

Scoring from your 2 (and the guards in general seems to be vital to being an elite team)