Round 3 Game 4 ... Pistons @ Heat

Discussion in '2006 Playoffs' started by roscoe36, May 24, 2006.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2005
    Messages:
    4,398
    Likes Received:
    830
    Location:
    Oakland, CA
    I think we have a superstar....Ben. Imagine starting lebron james and all you do is post up verajo and making Lebron play defensive stopper. You ain;t going very far and your star ain't gonna be happy.

    We went away from our identity and Ben got upset. Then ben got more upset. By not it doesn't matter what ben thinks...we're all upset.
     
  2. lapiston

    lapiston Team Captain

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2005
    Messages:
    1,213
    Likes Received:
    196
    Well, this has been coming since the middle of the Cleveland series. Why? I don't know. We do not have a deep enough team and not enough speed in the line-up at any time. While the offense has been stopped by Cleveland and Miami who have studied it, what now bothers me is the defense. No way Wade should be getting into the lane time and again. That must mean we simply do not have enough speed on the floor. It also means the coach can't adjust.

    Our adjustments tonight? Go into Tay time and again early. In the second, we pass while driving to the hoop leading to turnover after turnover.

    Once or twice we got the ball out of Wade's hands but usually he dictated what he wanted to do. We fouled a whole lot of people but until late second quarter, they weren't named Shaq. No way we should lose like this. Miami is better but not like this. Even miami is surprised how easy it is. It is going to be a long summer.
     
  3. ahb

    ahb Bench Warmer

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2006
    Messages:
    1,220
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    San Francisco
  4. ggazoo69

    ggazoo69 Team Captain Forum Donor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2005
    Messages:
    3,199
    Likes Received:
    225
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Willington, CT
    Wonder if Joe D wishes he'd drafted Wade instead of Dorko? Glad Flip was brought in to shore up the offense. I can see it's really working. :ohwell:
     
  5. pistonsloyalist

    pistonsloyalist First Round Draft Pick

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2005
    Messages:
    477
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    U.S. Virgin Islands
    Do you mean that Flip does not have the players to make defensive adjustments that would stop Wade, or that he does not have the coaching smarts to make those adjustments?
     
  6. ggazoo69

    ggazoo69 Team Captain Forum Donor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2005
    Messages:
    3,199
    Likes Received:
    225
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Willington, CT
    "Strange things happen," Pistons coach Flip Saunders said. "One play can change a game, one game can change a series. Basically, what we've got to do is come up with that play at home and try to change the series."

    Really, one play is gonna do it, Flip? This smacks of desperation.
     
  7. jzchen

    jzchen Bench Warmer Forum Donor

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2005
    Messages:
    795
    Likes Received:
    41
    Location:
    Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
    :frusty: :mad: :doh: :faint2: :noidea: :mad2: :yell: :hurt:
    sorry, i'm lost for words
     
  8. KGREG

    KGREG All-Star

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2005
    Messages:
    4,860
    Likes Received:
    803
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Saginaw, Michigan
    Flip is not a CHAMPION....he's in over his head right now. I'm glad he tried to get this team on track in this game, but he just does not understand what it takes to get it done at this level. Pop knows, D'antoni don't, Avery knows, Riley knows......Miami vs Dallas, got root for Wade on this one, Just cause I hate Devin Harris. Dude ruined too many nights for me when his badgers would come into Crisler and beat the crap out of my wolves, while the Maize and Blue losing was nothing we hadn't grown accustomed to over the past decade, I just hated the way Harris did it, I mean he's 14 yrs old for crying out loud....what??.... you mean he's 24...BS....lemme see some ID.

    aiight Pistons, lets just win game 5, please, if nothing else make this a respectable 6 game series.
     
  9. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2005
    Messages:
    20,559
    Likes Received:
    2,417
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Dagobah
    That sounded bush league the first time he said it, and it really sounds bush league at this point in the playoffs.

    Get a damn win instead of worrying about one play. Solve the Heat's defense. Actually push and score in transition without jacking 3s. Stop playing zone, because Riley had it figured out in less than 2 minutes.

    It's going to come down to will (ref: aurorakmw) and our horses against their horses (ref: mercury). Unfortunately, we're not able to take care of fundamental things like time and score (ref: KGREG) or taking timeouts, making adjustments (ref: The Low), so we're gunna start down -1 point for coaching off the bat.

    Btw, I'm starting to question the return of Ben. Forget the free throws. He's got one block in 4 games. Tonight we had 2 blocks to the Heat's 5. There is simply no energy, lift or passion on defense besides Tay, Hunter, Rip and Davis.

    Shoot, forgot to give BIG UPS to my man Mo Evans. He played well considering. It's a shame we didn't make use of his 3 point shooting earlier in the series.
     
  10. lapiston

    lapiston Team Captain

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2005
    Messages:
    1,213
    Likes Received:
    196
    Pistonloyalist, it is difficult to write this but BOTH we don't have sharp perimeter speed to stop Wade and Flip has made no noticeable adjustments. Wade is good but not that good. Our bigs are all relatively slow when it comes to stopping a Wade driving. Ben could but he is being used up on Shaq. Ben should play most of his early minutes when Shaq is out as he can move to guard Wade as Wade drives in. We could use Tay as a back up when he drives but we want him to score taking away energy. We don't have a young Hunter to stick Wade which is the main problem.

    Where Flip comes in is that any team can take out ONE main option and we have taken out neither. Have to blame Flip some and maybe our guys are arrogant too. Whatever the case, what looked like a beautiful run to a ship is now a break down. Losing to the Heat is one thing but losing like this is a shame. They are not that much better but they are winning easily.
     
  11. pistonsloyalist

    pistonsloyalist First Round Draft Pick

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2005
    Messages:
    477
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    U.S. Virgin Islands
    Yep. I thought Davis was a bright spot in this loss. Flip only played Davis because he had to, but he looked good and (IMO) has earned some more playing time in game 5.
     
  12. KGREG

    KGREG All-Star

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2005
    Messages:
    4,860
    Likes Received:
    803
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Saginaw, Michigan
    Ok last one and then I'll try to sleep.
    -When you're trying to "Figure" it out, you've allready lost. Yes we're seeing that there is indeed a foot speed problem on the frontline, we need some youth/speed.........yeah I know I may have opened Pandora's Box for BBALLJAY and DaveG-rap:frusty:

    The thing that is killing us is the Cleveland series. Had we beat them convincingly in 5, and then played like this against the Heat, well we could just flat out concede that they were just better than us, it would almost be easier to stomach. But we have to face a fact here, had Wade not got hurt last year they may have beaten us, sad but true. But staying healthy is key for a 'ship. Hell if Rip and Sheeds ankles were OK maybe we're smoking these cats (although I doubt it with this new regimes x's and o's). Bottom line is that Cleveland EXPOSED us, it may be a blessing with 2 starter contracts coming up.

    We also have to face the fact that Ben is not going to be a dominant shot blocker anymore, he wasn't that last year either. You can lose a 1/2 step overnight in your sleep, and a few inches off your vertical, ask Sheed. BTW anybody else notice Sheed hasn't caught a oop off the P&R in a few seasons now, when he first got here he was good for at least one per game, and a put back dunk.......anybody remember Sheed getting any sort of offensive putback under Flip????????? Kinda hard to do when the go#%$*mn play calls for you to be camped out on the 3pt line.:doh:
     
  13. max

    max All-Star

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2005
    Messages:
    7,425
    Likes Received:
    424
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    my bunker in the Carribbean
    From what I see the main problem with penetration is the Wallace's are not there to bail out the team. Ben is busy with Shaq and Sheed seems to have lost mobility with his injury plus foul trouble is a constant problem.

    Pistons usually get a lot of points off their defense and now we are a grind it out half court team. Need those forced TO's to open up the offense.

    I am not giving up on Ben returning as a Piston but if we lose this series then someone on our frontline is not going to be back next season. We have been cheating with this 3 PF rotation and its finally starting to catch up. Always had problems with wiry 7'ers like Foster ( Indy ), Verajio ( Clev) - you know the guys. Now trying to play Shaq without even a reliable Center off the bench is making the job almost impossible. If Ben comes back then it will have to be with him going back to playing PF like he used to do. Ever since he made the switch his rebounding and blocks have been down.

    Hopefully we can at least get game 5 and make the series respectable. Looking at the Piston bench even when we came back in the 3rd they just look done. I don't know what it is but they appear to have lost the will to win. I never thought I would ever have to write that.
     
  14. jwalk40

    jwalk40 Second Round Draft Pick

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2006
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    0
    The Pistons must find a way to turn their offensive efficiency around. If it means the boring half court offense of the past, fine. If it means more transition game, fine. But this in the middle stuff isn't working out.

    Isolation Plays- One or two isolation plays in succession works out great for Chauncey or Tay, but the Pistons lack the superstar talent (nor do they get enough calls) for this type of offense to succeed play after play. Even when the Pistons do find success with this offense, Riley has been quick to make the needed adjustments (Posey on Tay, Williams off Billups).

    Pick and Pop- When will Rasheed realize that they will stay with him on the perimeter until he proves he can move inside. He continues to stay at the perimeter after every pick, eliminating both his shot and any chance for Billups to take his man off the dribble. He needs to roll towards the hoop for an easy basket/dunk. If he works inside, he will get his threes later.

    Weakside Rebounding- Detroit should abuse Miami on the offensive glass when Shaq is on the floor guarding Ben. It has become quite clear that Shaq has made a commitment to leave Wallace alone and assist his teammates. Whenever Shaq rotates to the strong side to contest a Piston drive or shot, Ben must move to the glass for the offensive rebound. After a couple of put-backs, Kazaam will be forced to pay attention to Ben giving the rest of the Pistons better looks.

    Officiating- As always in the NBA, the aggresor will get the favorable calls (see Dwyade). Now, I'm not suggesting that Rip and Chauncey start driving with reckless abandon towards the hoop (once again see Dwyade), but the Pistons cannot allow a single player to almost take more foul shots than the entire Pistons team combined. Do not settle for contested jumpshots where fouls are rarely called. Be aggresive to the hoop and give your team two tries to get points on the board.

    All that said, down 3-1 will prove to be an uphill battle, but must start with intensity at the Palace. Dwyade and Shaq lost a closeout game at home last year. Give them flashbacks by forcing a game 6.
     
  15. TWOTIMESRALPHI

    TWOTIMESRALPHI Team Captain 3x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2005
    Messages:
    1,999
    Likes Received:
    120
    Location:
    Vienna
    what can a fan say? Thios ain't the Pistons that won the hearts about 2 years ago. As Mc Cosky wrote, they're complaining, avoiding to hustle and not playing D- as they were known for their D.
    Wade has been penetrating the hell out of this team, just like LBJ. When I complained about Sheed's obsession to 3's, many of ya told me that this was to avoid injuries and he'd turn on his inside play comes playoff time.
    So, where is it?
    I don't want to see Ben anymore in the Pistons Uni- I hate to see young and even old bigs abuse him like he used to abuse others. Hate to see him not blocking. Not having his huge rebounding nights. Hate to see him decline since that makes me feel old. I want to keep him in my memore as the shotblocking and rebounding machine he once was and not as the outcoming of Bo Outlaw.
    I think this series is over- we all knew it somehow since February. The team had a huge start and then, at the time around february, it regressed. Opponents started to adjust and the W's becamer closer and the team lost more often. Finally in the CLE series we all saw that this team was not as good as the regular season made us think. I'm sad.
     
  16. Zoso

    Zoso First Round Draft Pick

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2005
    Messages:
    373
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Grand Rapids, MI
    At this point, it's obvious that everyone can and should be held accountable (some maybe more than others) for the sudden demise of our squad from our head coach to our starting six. All of them, each and every one of them are responsible for choking this series (almost) away.

    But who knows where we would be if Rasheed had two healthy wheels.

    If you recall, it was the same question we were asking a couple of years ago in the New Jersey series when Chauncey was hobbled with a bum ankle. It's the exact same situation. If Eric Snow, never would've pulled off one of his patented moves in the second round, maybe we wouldn't have gotten swept.

    I think, that year, the Pistons knew they couldn't beat New Jersey with Chauncey hobbled as badly as he was. So they didn't have the heart to win the series, so they didn't give maximum effort, hence, we got swept.

    I think that's what might be going on here, just on a slightly smaller scale. They know how hurt Rasheed is so maybe they don't think they can take Miami without a 100% Rasheed Wallace.

    After sitting there watching our team, choke away yet another game like that. I think I was equally disgusted with the terribly biased Miami slanted broadcast that ABC shoved down our throats for three hours last night. :mad:

    It seemed like every single time they went to a commercial the lead in involved Shaq and Dwayne Wade (the latter curiously dressed in a sweater vest) popping up on the screen saying;

    "You're watching the Eastern Conference Finals on ABC."

    I mean, it was like they did that going into every single commercial. Talk about over kill. :doh:

    They did the half-time piece on Pat Riley too. The only thing I recall, that actually included the Pistons (the Ben Wallace interview piece just before the game started aside) was that little piece they did of Flip Saunders, during a timeout, when he thanked the troops, and that was it. It was like the 2004 finals all over again. Talk about déjà vu.

    I bet they don't even read the millions of e-mails and countless letters the Pistons fans send when they complain about it, they probably just mass delete/shred, and never give it another thought.
     
  17. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2005
    Messages:
    20,559
    Likes Received:
    2,417
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Dagobah
    I couldn't stand the sound of Hubie Brown and Mike Breen anymore.

    George Blaha is good about shining up a loss. It's what kept me sane last night.
     
  18. Zoso

    Zoso First Round Draft Pick

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2005
    Messages:
    373
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Grand Rapids, MI
    Yeah, I hear you, man. There's nothing like the comforts of home to get you through the rough times.

    That's why I always watch FSN or TV 20's feed (WXYP, out here in Grand Rapids) (when they're available) during the playoffs.
     
  19. jammertime

    jammertime Starter 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2005
    Messages:
    4,404
    Likes Received:
    71
    Location:
    Windsor, Ontario
    I liked the fact that Davis left no margin for error with his fouls. Those were nice, hard, clean fouls. Why can't the rest of the team do the same? I'm sick of these pansy fouls that allow Wade to throw up a circus shot that drops and get the fans (and announcers) screaming for him to heal them!!!!

    I do wish Davis would translate that defensive aggression to the offensive end. Take it up strong!!! There was one play in particular late, on a Hunter feed (I think) in the paint and he just stood there trying to head fake Shaq for about 5 seconds and then got blocked. If he would have gone up strong right away, he would have had an easy bucket (before Shaq was able to slide over) and possibly an and 1.

    I've been VERY disappointed with the entire teams lack of strong finishes. How many point blank layups/dunks/tip ins have we missed in the playoffs??? GO UP STRONG AND TAKE NO PRISONERS!!!!! Maybe J-Max should show them how its done. Man, that thunder dunk against the Raps still gives me goose bumps!
     
  20. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2005
    Messages:
    4,398
    Likes Received:
    830
    Location:
    Oakland, CA
    I don't like the Heat but they're playing the way I like to see teams play. Contrast the inspired play vs. The thinly veiled rhetoric of a team that's lost its heart.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page