Sheed and Dyess in crunch time

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by Lee356, Feb 18, 2009.

  1. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    I have been quite ill. No energy to do this. So I will ask anyone out there to do a favor. Research how many games Dyess and Sheed have played the last 5 minutes of games, where the score was within 5 one way or the other when they entered. How many games did we win vs. lose like that? Thanks to anyone who takes the time. Goodnite.
     
  2. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    Probably the easiest way to get a feel for it would be to look at their crunch time stats.

    Clutch Statistics

    (4th quarter or overtime, less than 5 minutes left,
    neither team ahead by more than 5 points)

    SHEED

    Floor Time statistics
    Min Net PtsOff Def Net48 W L Win%
    70% +2 104.9 103.8 1.1 12 14 46.2%
    He good.


    DYESS
    Floor Time statistics
    Min Net PtsOff Def Net48 W L Win%
    69% -25 84.1 98.0 -13.9 9 13 40.9%
    He bad.


    The min% means that is the % of Crunch time minutes that they have played. Since their results are so different, they obviously have a lot of time apart, but still in during crunch time. Looks like Dyess helps defensively, but our offense drops off the table (20 points per 48 minutes worse than Sheed). With either of them in, we lose more of these situations than we win.

    So, I'm not really answering your question (what happens when they are both in), but it makes it look like the answer is probably somewhere in between these 2 charts above.
     
  3. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    I do appreciate the effort. But this does not tell me if they won or lost the games.

    PS, I kind of thought I was getting better. I feel a bit better. But I think I will be spending another day mostly in bed. I'll get to this as soon as I can if noone else can take the time.
     
  4. round

    round All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion

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    I don't have the patience to do what Lee is asking for, but watching the last month I think were argueing maybe about which person should go to the bench.... AI vs Rip and should be thinking about Starting Dyess over Sheed at this point. I think that Dyess is playing better and does less right now to hurt the offense.

    I don't have the stats in front of me, but i seem to think Lee has said that Max plays better with dyess while Amir was better with sheed. If I remember that correct I'd say lets start Max with Dyess to start the games.

    I mean whats another lineup change.
     
  5. professor

    professor Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    I assume you mean the entire final five minutes together, and not just some portion of them. Correct?
     
  6. professor

    professor Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    Here's what I was able to come up with. I used popcornmachine's game flow to determine line-ups in the final five minutes and I used ESPN's play-by-play to determine score at 5 minutes to go mark and final score.

    Since we got Dyess back there have been eleven games that satisfy the conditions of Lee's query (score within 5 points either way with 5 minutes to go AND Sheed and Dyess both play the final five minutes)

    Short answer: our record in those eleven games is 5-6. Here's the breakdown:

    Date/Opp/Score with 5 mins to go/Final Score

    2/17/Milw/79-83/L 86-92
    2/10/Chi/96-88/L 102-107

    2/7/Milw/92-97/W (OT) 126-122
    2/1/Cle/72-75/L 80-90
    1/28/Minn/81-84/W 98-89
    1/25/Hou/96-101/L 105-108
    1/19/Memp./77-75/W 87-79
    (*Rip entered for Dyess with 40 seconds to go and the Pistons ahead 85-79).
    1/17/N.O/79-79/L 85-91
    (*Jmax entered for Dyess with 7 seconds to go and the Pistons down 89-85).
    1/14/Ind/85-85/L (OT) 106-110
    12/29/Orl/79-77/W 88-82
    12/12/Ind/99-99/W 114-110

    (*Stuck entered for Sheed with 14 seconds to go and the Pistons ahead 111-108)
     
  7. starwar2138

    starwar2138 First Round Draft Pick

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    i c it 2 lee when we make our run sheed and tay is on the bench because we r running when they come in they slow the game down sheed hate the zone because he cant move fast but it better for the team we have ai and rip dfen is better in the Zone i like sheed and tay but they stlye dont work with a running team i watch us lose at lease 12 games that way now everybody is starting to see it 2.
     
  8. Stereodave

    Stereodave First Round Draft Pick

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    A related stat I would like to see is +/- for total time Sheed and Dyess are on the floor together. I am not very good at finding stats but I think this one could be very revealing and would probably back up Lee's view 100%
    Thanks for any help I can get on this:hoops:
     
  9. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    Thanks. That is 3-6 over the last nine such. Kind of thought so. And the two regulation wins were over Memphis and Minny. Not very impressive. They did get the Milwaukee game to OT. Basically, the pair lack a quality win in regulation during January or February which would make Curry even possibly think the pair makes any sense.
     
  10. professor

    professor Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    All true. Of course, one of the things I realized is that we also finished weakly in a number of other games that didn't fit the criteria of your question, which obviously doesn't contradict your point but just suggests what we all know: there are other problems on this team besides the fact that Curry plays Dice and Sheed together at the end of games.
     
  11. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    Guess again, Maxey went for 0 and 1 last night. How can you take him out?
     
  12. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    Please do get specific. Like small ball? That was a problem too. Leaving Afflalo out of games? Leaving Maxiell out of games? Leaving Amir out of games? All have hurt us.

    Also, playing Dyess and Sheed together pretty much always hurts us. Not just the end of games. Like last game, Sheed never did hit a three in the game. Instead, he was seen repeatedly, at his very advanced age, running like heck to get back down on transition D. In fact, one play in particular just made me puke, watching Dyess trying his darndest to get back on transition D, but obviously being totally unable to keep his balance, track what was going on around him, or in anyway help for all his hustle. Sure, its hustle. On both Dyess and Sheed's part. But totally ineffective in the vast majority of times, and doing nothing but wearing the old gentlemen out.

    To be clear, you have to start either Amir or JMAX, so you have a fleet power forward to do that kind of hustling, rather than leaving it to old men.
     

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