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Should Chauncey be starting?

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by Mark V, Nov 9, 2013.

  1. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    KCP feels 100%. There are 15 rookies with more PT than him so far, including Hardaway Jr. with almost twice as many minutes.

    MCW is getting almost 40 minutes per game and he was drafted 3 spots later.
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2013
  2. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    I think it is important to remember, Andre didnt get a lot of minutes early last year, but more towards the middle of the year.
     
  3. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    We have a fine option. Jennings and Pope start. Siva and Billups come off the bench. Siva is a true pass first point guard, and with Billups out there helping to direct things too, it should work fine. Lets not use a point who can not organize the offense. Bynum can neither act as a point, nor defend any. He should not be playing.
     
  4. Mogilny

    Mogilny All-Star Forum Donor

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    I think it is. There are a lot of teams who would fall out of the PO picture if they started a 4 PPG scorer who is to old to play D.
     
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  5. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 3x Fantasy Champion

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    I didn't say it wasn't AN issue.
    I just don't think that it's THE issue.

    There are some other rotation and roster deficiancies that (IMO) trump Chauncey's 25 or so MPG. I totally agree with you that Bup shouldn't be starting though. Pope needs to be starting - not Chauncey.
    ...And I see no reason that at least two of our three best big dudes shouldn't ALWAYS be on the floor surrounded by guys that can shoot make outside shots.
     
  6. Walter

    Walter All-Star Forum Donor

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    Stuckey has indeed been playing well as a 6th man. The ideal guard rotation would be Jennings/Pope starting with Billups/Stuckey off the bench. That leaves Bynum as the odd man out, but you can also play Bynum/Billups with the second unit.

    The two guard combinations we should avoid like the plague are:

    Bynum/Stuckey - redundant and no reliable outside shooting
    Bynum/Jennings - too small and a liability defensively

    Siva is unfortunately an insurance policy until someone gets injured.


    FWIW, I would be very surprised if we finish the season with the same set of guards we currently have.
     
  7. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 3x Fantasy Champion

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    Stuckey has been putting up some decent stats as a 6th man.
    By no means would I say he is "playing well".
    Everything else in your post is spot-on as far as I'm concerned. :nod:
     
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  8. The Panda

    The Panda Garbage Post All Star Forum Donor

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    I agree with this. Chauncey isn't a solution, but he isn't the biggest problem. His role in the offense is very small.

    I don't think Pope needs to start. But he needs to play more. He plays smart on both ends and he is a threat from 20+ feet and to dribble/drive. With Jennings, that gives us legit floor spacing and some aggressiveness.

    Smith needs to stop isolating on the wing. He should never be accepting the ball there unless he is passing it. Drives from 18 feet will work, but the guy isn't LBJ, he just doesn't have the ball control.

    Also, I don't think Drummond should be playing 40mpg. That's unfair on him.
     
  9. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    A per of 20 is playing well. He obviously won't sustain that and it's coming against reserves, but he's made the most of his opportunity so far.
     
  10. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    Hmm, been watching film on Smith constantly, and one of the things he does best, get the ball on the wings and score the ball. Indeed, Smith has excellent handles, and could start at shooting guard for us. Yeah, I have seen him bobble the ball here and there on passes, but rarely while driving the ball or bringing it up the floor.

    Yes, Billups is not our biggest problem. Its not seeing guys like Mitchell and Pope out there on a constant basis. Instead, we are playing Bynum, Singler, JJ, and now Datome.

    At times, Billups has been a huge part of our offense, since he is often the guy out there being the floor general. However, what you may be noticing is that since Billups began to start aside a now ready Jennings, his role as floor general has become redundant - and now he is just an old guy with no particular role. We are using him all wrong. He, or Siva, should directly sub for Jennings, so that we have a guy who can run the show right out there at all times. If we choose Siva, then we could use Billups as a backup to Pope a bit. Very little minutes there, since Pope should be able cover the vast majority of minutes at shooting guard. And even if we choose Billups as the primary backup to Jennings, Jennings also can play a ton of minutes and Billups could still put in some work backing up Pope. Perhaps the best scenario for now, go with Billups as the only guard backup, with Jennings and Pope starting and both playing a ton of minutes. Then Siva becomes the backup point in cases where either Billups or Jennings gets into a bit of foul trouble.
     
  11. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Oh god Josh Smith at the 2.
     
  12. The Panda

    The Panda Garbage Post All Star Forum Donor

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    Uhhhh... I watched him get stripped on two consecutive drives from the right wing against OKC by such notable defenders as Steven Adams. I don't mind him setting picks there and rolling to the basket, his athleticism means he can get behind the defense, its just the isolation which frustrates me. He is best at cutting to the basket or post play.

    Shooting guard? If Josh Smith threw up any more bricks he could build Dumars a popcorn factory.

    You know what. I mostly* agree with you here.

    Part of the reason that I loved this team make up is because it has a bit of identity. Aggressive, big, bruising, strong D. Pope fits that identity. So does Mitchell. JJ doesn't. Neither does Singler. Siva is a tenacious defender but I don't think he is ready to step it up just yet.

    We need a guy like Billups to calm the floor in the final minutes. He has a lot of value in doing that. And we need Datome and Singler because they bring 3 point shooting to a team that is oh so desperately lacking it.
     
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  13. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    You know you have arrived at PF.com as a notable poster when you can drop one liners like this.
     
  14. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    There's been a void ever since they traded Daye.


    Sent from the new and improved Tapatalk 2.
     
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  15. KGREG

    KGREG All-Star

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    Precisely the reason why Pope should start. I'm willing to ride this whole Stuckey as the 6th man thing out until the wheels fall off, and they will, they always do. Chauncey's defense isn't as good as KCP's and he doesn't get out and run like KCP. I thought we were trying to be a team that played D, caused turnovers, crashed the boards and ran......Chauncey don't run.
     
  16. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    Think about this: In 6 basketball games with Billups starting, he has yet to score a point in the paint.

    Any other teams in the league have any player with more minutes without a point in the paint? And we are leading the league in steals and top 5 in total turnover creation (so tons of fast break opportunities).

    He's not starter quality at this point. If he is, he's afraid to exert himself.
     
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  17. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    Here is how our starters rank in the league in terms of the standard box score + efficiency:

    Plr: Pts/Rb/Ast/Stl/Blk/Eff
    BJ: 05/ 12/ 13/ 02/ 40/ 09
    CB: 50/ 33/ 20/ 40/ 39/ 45
    JS: 07/ 09/ 13/ 15/ 01/ 12
    GM: 8/ 03/ 15/ 09/ 09/ 04
    AD: 19/ 05/ 53/ 06/ 23/ 09

    Green = top 10 in league
    Black = 11-20th
    Red = worse than 20th (i.e. below average for a starter)

    BJ: Great at scoring and stealing the ball. Average rebounder and passer. Below average in blocks, which are least important for a PG. Overall, top 10 point guard.
    CB: Average in assists... for a shooting guard. Way below average in every other possible measure. Would be posting average stats for a bench player.
    JS: Top SF in the league in blocks, which is to be expected. Great scorer and rebounder. Average passer and thief... but for SF's, which is impressive, since he's out of position slightly and have huge physical advantages.
    GM: Above average in everything so far, except for passing, where he's average. We know he's an above average passer, so chalk it up to the strange system tough SOS, and new teammates.
    AD: Great rebounder and great in steals. Average scorer in the garbage man role. Doesn't pass, which we know. Below average in blocks, which we should be OK with, since we know that's one of his greatest strengths (easing off because of 2 other bigs in his vicinity and foul trouble).


    Conclusion: Chauncey is a serious weak link so far. We have 4 out of 5 starters that are above average at their positions, which should be the recipe for some real success... especially since we play the starters for such a high percentage of the game.


    Counterpoints:
    Chauncey knows that we need floor stretching, so he's camped out at the 3-point line.
    He's playing out of his normal PG position
    He's didn't play much preseason, so he's just getting in shape
    He's too busy coaching and doing Mo Cheeks' job and it's hard to concentrate on actually playing
    He just missed shots, nothing that you can do about that.
    He may have witnessed Will Bynum play in practice and it he is now very discombobulated in general.
     
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  18. del

    del Team Captain Forum Donor

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    Is anyone else in the league still trying to run this two combo guard thing?! To be honest I am completely sick of it. In the past a lot of it was down to personnel.

    Currently we have a shooting/slashing point guard in Jennings, we have a 3 & D shooting guard content not to touch the ball in KCP.

    We have a point guard who needs to play limited minutes in Billups, we have a ____ guard in Stuckey who is best cutting from the elbow and needs a shooter next to him.

    How in hell are we still playing Jennings next to Billups and Bynum next to Stuckey?!?!
     
  19. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    Jennings, Bynum, and Stuckey all like to slash. Any two of them together is problematic... but less so off the bench since the lane gets unclogged a bit. So, I get that Bynum and Stuckey might be paired together with Singler/Smith/Drummond for example.

    But yeah, we drafted Pope for a reason. He makes sense on paper. He also made sense on wood in the preseason. Maybe he comes off bad on dry erase board?
     
  20. The Panda

    The Panda Garbage Post All Star Forum Donor

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    I would rather Singler start than Chauncey B. Billups should be playing no more than 15mpg. I love the guy, but that is his role. Back up point guard who slows the offensive when we don't have such a big rebounding presence to get good shots.
     

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