Starting 5 for 2010-11

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by chillfan23, Jul 19, 2010.

  1. KGREG

    KGREG All-Star

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    How cool would it be if we went into camp with a good old fashion competition for the starting 2-guard spot.......
  2. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    The last time Rip Hamilton didn't lead his team in points per game was when he was 2nd to Michael Jordon.

    No way an 8 time scoring champ gets asked to come off the bench on any team in the NBA.
  3. BB4L11

    BB4L11 First Round Draft Pick

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    I'd agree with that, I'd also add that big money players are going to be the ones that get the minutes. You don't pay them big dollars and sit them on the bench, in a team like this anyway.

    The way we have to look at it is we are not going anywhere of note with this team so what will happen is the owners etc will want to compete enough to get the crowds in to make some money to cover their debts and hopefully someone from somewhere has a breakout season or that we pick up someone special in a trade or the draft sometime this decade.
  4. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 3x Fantasy Champion

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    IMO - Every starting position should be up for grabs. Make training camp a big fat TRY-OUT.

    When you run a picket fence offense almost exclusively designed to get #32 his shots; he SHOULD lead the team in scoring. If Ben Gordon can out-play Rip, he should get Rip's minutes.
  5. jayborne

    jayborne Bench Warmer

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    Reading through this thread makes me not want to anticipate next season. This whole "rebuild while being competitive" mentality Joe has is just a nice way of saying the team is going to be bad with players who won with the organization in the past. It's a terrible plan. We're in the same position as teams like Toronto and Cleveland, except their best players left and we actually built a roster this bad.

    I think a lot of the criticism of Coach Q is unfair. Joe has assembled a roster that's advantageous to no one involved in the organization. He's killed his reputation as an elite level GM. He's given Kuester a 4 sided puzzle with 7 corner pieces and expects him to solve it. The fans don't have a reason to show up to games with a mediocre at best team. National media has no reason to even remotely acknowledge the team's existance. We even have to reach for straws to think of a young guy we can legitamately build around.

    I'm more interested to see the minute distribution than who starts. This entire roster is filled with fringe starters, then Rip & Tay. ANd starting them might not even be in the best interest of the team.
  6. Brap

    Brap Starter

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    I like that turn of a phrase, but disagree with your premise. I think Joe has filled the roster with a bunch of talented youngsters. Kuester is going to have to figure out which guys that we'd otherwise like to see get PT, ride the pine, and which guys are going to be in the regular rotation. The thing with this clusterf*&k, is that the coaches will make decisions.

    The other thing about those decisions is whoever gets plunked on the bench will have a whole host of fans on these boards proclaiming K and Joe D as idiots for benching them. It's going to be ugly in here for a couple seasons while this gets sorted through and a competitive team starts to emerge from natural growth from within, from trades, and from the 2011 and 2012 drafts.
  7. jayborne

    jayborne Bench Warmer

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    It's not really the coaches decision when the money you are paying two shooting guards whose games don't really complement each other 10 Mil + per. Their contracts almost guarantee them minutes. Having Rip and BG on the roster at the same time does nothing but complicate things for Kuester by eating minutes from the younger guys and not really improving the team. That issue has to be resolved some kind of way or he's just hurting this team.

    And we have decent young talent, but it's kind of complimentary. We don't have a young guy you can hang your hat on. And if we do, he hasn't emerged. I would hope Q isn't going to struggle finding times for our young players. Stuckey has a role already, Daye can get 15-20 minutes on the wings, Jerebko can get around 20-25 minutes as a tweener, and Monroe should be able to get over 20+ minutes. Cutting veteran minutes will be his biggest issue next season.

    Where Kuester can really impress me is pace. He's supposed to be an offensive mind, so we should be getting more possessions and shots up. This team is really an average defensive team, we need to finally expoit our strength of having offensive talent. We need to play to our roster, not some foolish past identity.
  8. dba

    dba All-Star Moderator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Does anybody really believe CVS is going to start? Surely if he doesn't then JJ will. I don't think there is any way they start the rookie. Ben isn't going to get more than 25 a game, opening up more minutes to the rook and CVS. Max once again seems the odd man out.
  9. Brap

    Brap Starter

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    I think CV will get the first opportunity to prove himself and win the starting power forward slot. He has very high end potential, and from what we're hearing he's in great shape - looks great - and could regain the place he had pre-injuries when Joe signed him as an emerging player in this league.

    That said, until we see him perform at a consistently high level, he's as much a suspect as he is a legit prospect. Still, we have no reason as a team going that can't contend without guys like this breaking through, not to give him a big chance to do so.

    If nothing else, he could regain his trade value around the league, so even if he isn't the best fit for us long term, he could be the guy who we trade to get the best fitting player to plunk next to Monroe for the next 5-8 seasons. That can't happen if he's molting on our bench.

    I think CV will get that chance, but that he'll also be short-leashed.
  10. Brap

    Brap Starter

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    PISTONS: Where There’s a Will...

    One way or another - I believe that Bynum will prove to be a big asset to our organization. Maybe he's the backup PG on our team - if so, I think he might be the best backup PG in the league when healthy. Maybe he's going to be trade fodder. But I believe this kid can really play.

    I think this was a great signing by Joe D and at a more than fair price.
  11. KGREG

    KGREG All-Star

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    I LOVE IT!!! Especially the part about how his goal is to be the starting PG of the Detroit Pistons!!! For the record, I prefer Will over Stuckey at the point.
  12. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Ditto.

    Although I would love for Stuckey to prove me wrong so we have to very good points.
  13. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 3x Fantasy Champion

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    Q (and Joe) need to create a culture where Will can honestly push Rodney for playing time and the stating PG role. Will is good enough to either take Rodney's job from him or at least push him to be a better player.
  14. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    Just thinking. So nobody take this any other way than that. Just putting down a rotation for the sole reason to think about the roster.

    Stuckey, Rip, Daye, CV, Monroe start.

    CV plays center on defense, using his length to guard around the basket. The rest of the group does the defensive rotating, and as Stuckey at 6-5 and solid in build would be the smallest guy out there, we won't get burnt on too many mismatches.

    Bench: Bynum and White at point to start the season. Lets see who helps us more. White's extra size might trump Bynum's experience.

    Gordon at shooting guard, Tay at small forward helping to run the offense for the 2nd unit. Ben Wallace and JMAX as the bigs.

    This rotation involves 11 people. It leaves out Summers and JJ. However, this does not mean the coach could not find some minutes for each. Like on back to back sets, which means about 40 games worth, letting a couple of starters go lighter minutes in a each back to back set while giving some time for JJ and Summers.

    Keeping 13 guys involved sounds tough, but hey, we will only be adding the two rooks, White and Monroe. Its not impossible.

    Dividing the 240 game minutes could go like this for the season (on average):

    Point
    Stuckey 28
    White 10
    Bynum 10

    SG
    Rip 27
    Gordon 21

    SF
    Daye 24
    Tay 24

    PF
    CV 22
    Summers 8
    JJ 8
    JMAX 6

    Center
    Monroe 22
    Ben Wallace 16
    JMAX 10

    I want to emphasize that these are averages. For instance, I am not proposing that JJ play 8 minutes every game, but rather 16 minutes in half the games. Same for Summers. 40 games of 16 minutes is plenty enough minutes for further development of these players.

    CV might play 30 minutes on non-back-to-backs, while playing just 14 minutes a game during back-to-back sets.

    Rip might play 36 minutes 3/4 of the time, sit out one game of most back to back sets. (.75 * 36 + 0 * 0 = 27)

    Stuckey could play 36 minutes in half the games, while having his minutes limited for back-to-back sets. (Either sitting one game out or playing light minutes each game.)

    Other starters such as Daye and Monroe simply would never play heavy minutes and should be fine playing the same minutes game after game.

    Assuming all this gets us to the playoffs - we will 1)have a whole team full of fresh players, 2) have lots of options

    But here is what is more likely to happen. Tay starts out doing great, so Kuester forgets to ever take him out of any games, ever. By week 3, Tay hurts his back and is pretty much worthless for the season. Despite this, he will play plenty, leading us to many, many losses.

    Ben Wallace looks very energetic to start the season. Kuester is starting him, and by mid season he is wiped. Still, he plays on, helping in Tay's effort toward losing us game after game.

    Rip never plays less than 40 minutes. Minor ankle problems turn into big ones. He never plays effectively after about game 20, and like Ben Wallace, is busily helping Tay lose game after game most of the season.

    And then you got CV. Rejuvenated. To start the season. But the season is a marathon. Kuester will probably start him, play him til he is too hurt to help - and then start limiting his minutes but never enough so that he ever returns to health. He too will help Tay in losing game after game.

    Playoffs will be a pipe dream by midseason, if not earlier.
  15. jayborne

    jayborne Bench Warmer

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    I respect the effort to come up a plan, but I wonder about some of the decisions. We already have a cluttered backcourt with "proven" players, why make it worst with White? And Villanueva and Monroe are about the same size, I think Monroe may even have better length. Don't see the advantage of ever associating CV's name with center. He's a terrible defender, likely the worst on the team. And finally, why put Jerebko and Summers on equal footing?
  16. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 3x Fantasy Champion

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    Jeb HAS to get minutes.
    ...HAS to!
  17. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    JJ was an all star ONE TIME only. It makes perfect sense for him to back up Charlie All Star.
  18. Ryder

    Ryder First Round Draft Pick

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    I'd be shocked if Jerebko didn't start at PF, I also see Big Ben starting at center if he plays at the same level as last year, with Monroe getting the rest of the minutes, eventually taking the starter role after the all star break.

    Stuckey/Rip*/Tay/JJ/Ben
    Bynum/Gordon/Daye/CV/Monroe

    *if he's not traded
  19. BillLaimbeer

    BillLaimbeer All-Star 4x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Jerebko is the Pistons best player, in my opinion.
  20. coynejeremy

    coynejeremy All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    I've said it before, but you are a good person.

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