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Stop complaining about the Center position

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by DaviaG-Rap, Aug 19, 2007.

  1. DaviaG-Rap

    DaviaG-Rap First Round Draft Pick

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    Joe Dumars is a great GM but he can't just pull a good starting caliber C out of his holiest of holies. Besides the way I see it we can either play a frontcourt featuring Sheed, Dyess, Maxiell and a good center in the mold of Cwebb who can play 30mpg....or a frontcourt of Sheed, Dyess, Nazr, Maxiell and AJ with Sheed, Dyess, and Nazr sharing center responsibilities. Personally, I'd rather see the latter.

    PF- Sheed 16, Maxiell 18, AJ 14
    C- Nazr 14, 20 Dyess, Sheed 14
     
  2. ggazoo69

    ggazoo69 All-Star Forum Donor

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    I think Nazr should get more minutes, given that he's the only true center on the team.
     
  3. Hobbs

    Hobbs First Round Draft Pick

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    I think Nazr should get fewer minutes given that he sucks.

    Seriously, the only games Nazr should play in are the ones against the legit offensive threat big centers (that's like, what, 3-4 guys?). No reason at all for him to see the court against anyone else.
     
  4. ggazoo69

    ggazoo69 All-Star Forum Donor

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    I don't think Nazr is very good either, but what's your solution? Barring Dumars getting someone else, who plays more minutes? Sheed at the 5? Dude'll be in foul trouble and complaining to the refs pretty quick. Maxiell? Too small.

    The Pistons were 17-7 last season when Nazr played 20 minutes or more.
     
  5. round

    round All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion

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    I think alot of folks expect Dumars to pull out Wilt or Russell out of his back pocket for a minimum contract.

    Do we have a great Center.... Nope, but how many teams have somebody that can be atleast in the conversation for all star at all 5 positions? I can't think of any.... But we have 4.

    He is what he is and we will just have to live with it and play with the hand were dealth.
     
  6. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    If I recall correctly, we did sign Dyess, who has played quite a bit of center for us the last few years. Between him, Sheed, and JMAX, center is covered. No need to let a scrub like Mohammed play.
     
  7. bricalz

    bricalz First Round Draft Pick

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    Nazr is a support player. He can play. He can help.

    Nobody can compare to the Yaos and the Shaqs.

    But I recall Nazr as a very serviceable center when he was given the chance in San Antonio. We'll be fine.
     
  8. ggazoo69

    ggazoo69 All-Star Forum Donor

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    I have no problem with that, I guess, as long as Dyess can defend the position consistently. In fact, perhaps Dyess should be starting instead of coming off the bench then. I think JMax is too small. Here come the Big Ben comparisons ...
     
  9. tpaPistonFan

    tpaPistonFan First Round Draft Pick

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    I don't think there is much to worry about. Consider this; There are only 3 true centers that we need to worry about: Shaq, Yao and Oden. Shaq is 1 injury away from retirement, Oden has NO offensive game and we only play Yao twice a year. As long as TMac plays for Houston we don't ever have to worry about playing Houston in the finals :).. Since he is a LOSER!!!!

    Plus we can always rely on Flip's zone defense.. Sense the sarcasm!! :)
     
  10. Pwn Toney

    Pwn Toney All-Star Forum Donor

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    The problem is, you don't just accept [STRIKE]medioc[/STRIKE] below mediocrity just because the answer isn't smacking you in the face. If that was the case, every GM would be a title winner. Part of being a good GM is doing the homework to FIND the right answer. I'm so tired of people (AND McCrapsky) acting as if you can't make a change until you have an indisputable solution glowing in the sky like a magical orb.

    AMEN.

    I don't expect Wilt, but if you're going to replace a player like Ben Wallace, whose defense and rebounding are clearly lacking in this current incarnation of the Pistons, then at least try to replace him with a player who isn't garbage. This is like letting trash pile up in your house while waiting for the garbage man to come into your house and take it out for you. Just take it to the dump yourself, and get rid of it already.
     
  11. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Big Ben Comparison!

    There is so much more to basketball than height. Otherwise, Ben Wallace wouldn't play Yao Ming so well.

    Quickness, athleticism, range, hustle, strength.

    I've seen a lot of big stiffs (get your minds out of the gutter), guys who were tall enough by the "gotta be tall" paradigm to have been superstars, but in real life were only capable of collecting splinters and paychecks.

    The one thing I love in an athlete, above all other attributes is heart. I just can't get enthused about a great shooter or dunker as much as a guy who gives everything he has on the court, in the face of overwhelming odds.
     
  12. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    I would say that at this point... and probably for the forseeable future, Dwight Howard would crush Oden head to head.
     
  13. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    I disagree with this on so many levels.
    1. the team is not below mediocre. ONE piece in a weak pool can be considered to be so. I don't even think thats the case. I think the drop off between good and the rest is huge. Take out the Naz-hatred and would it REALLY by an upgrade for....Zaza Pachulia? Eddie Griffin? Pryzbilla? What I am accepting is that this team is good but it has a weakness. The biggest weakness is the coaching IMO. More talent won't make them play harder.

    2. solutions aren't found. you don't just click on realgm's trade checker and bam! its fixed! other teams gotta want what you got. Who in the blue hell (saw the Rock's new movie preview) would give up a mediocre center for our sub mediocre center. solutions are made. it takes two sides to agree to a deal. Is Joe too shrewd? There are yes and no answers to that one. But who is to say that he hasn't tried many times only the other guys don't want to deal.

    3. I forget what 3 was for.

    4. the issue has been the non stop complaining and the lateral (at best) solutions. Unless we move hunter AND flip we'll miss out on Adonal Foyle! trade for brendan Haywood. does denver want our cast offs for camby? ok camby is a huge upgrade but no way does Denver deal that. Not now. most people here have run scenarios to change things up nothing looks helpful or realistic. There probably is no solution at this point but who is to say what can happen up until the trade deadline.
     
  14. lemonpen

    lemonpen First Round Draft Pick

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    I can't call Haywood lateral consideration, when he can put us one year closer to relieving ourselves of a burdensome contract. The only thing I find more dissappointing that NazMo's play is realizing how much longer I may be forced to watch it.
     
  15. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    Regarding the issue of other teams not wanting what we got in Nazmo.

    We wanted him when we got him, right? Did he really play worse for us than he did for SA? The greater fool theory. If Joe D was the greater fool, then surely there is another GM out there more foolish than him.

    What I'm getting at is that if we really want to get value for a player, be it Flip Murray, Nazr, Darko, etc., then we have to make them look good before we enter into trade talks. Benching a guy and calling him out on his desire, or whatever that players' particular shortcoming is, will only show weakness.

    Maybe the first half of this coming season, Flip Saunders and Joe D can implement a strategy that makes Nazr and or Murray look like a valuable piece of the team. Give them playing time. Drop a few quotes to the press about how they are "living in the weight room" this year and "mentoring the rookies." Showcase them a little.

    The current strategy seems to do accomplish the following:
    • Makes other teams realize the players suck
    • Makes other teams realize that we are desperate to trade them
    • Angers the players and makes them more likely to demand a trade suddenly, which further kills negotiating power.
     
  16. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    I think we wanted Pryzbilla first.

    Excellent ideas...but none can be implemented in the off-season. While we can build up our guys, it may shake out that a particular team dynamic will have a decent big buried or pushed aside for a emerging player. Other teams will want to make financial moves. Our team dynamic might make naz look better or cover his weaknesses.
     
  17. basketbills

    basketbills All-Star Forum Donor

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    Also, don't forget that all of us can do our part by posting at other internet forums and praising Nazr's athletic skills. I'll give a sample scripted post here but feel free to create your own. I use Celtics as an example here but you can substitute it for any team's name.


    Like I said you can reword it to make it fit your own style.
     
  18. MotownPride

    MotownPride Starter 2x Fantasy Champion

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    I wonder if organizations do have people on the payroll whose job is to generate buzz about players in an effort to boost perceived trade value.
     
  19. lapiston

    lapiston Team Captain

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    Right now, I just don't see how we can go far with the center position as it is. We will have to go through Shaq and Z (who did far too much damage to us last year for a not-so-dominant center), Howard and Curry maybe in the earliest rounds.

    In the playoffs, teams exploit weaknesses to the hilt. It is not the regular season that I worry about. It is the playoffs and this team is getting older. The future is now. The fact is that we lost Ben and got Nazi. And that is where we stand.

    Sheed can play center but he will pick up fouls. We can't afford that. Maxiel is way too short. Amir not bulky enough and with little experience. Dyss cannot bring it game after game especially at center where he is overmatched size-wise. Dyss has not been able to fill that position effectively before.

    That leaves us with Nazi. Nazi is better than he showed but probably not enough better to give us the presence that we need.

    We need a big body down there some of the time. A not so skilled player is ok but we need a banger who can body up and take the fouls. This problem won't go away and will loom large when it counts--in the playoffs.
     
  20. himat

    himat Bench Warmer

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    I don't have a problem with people complaining. Unless Nazr gets better (anyone can improve if they put the work in) fans might want a new center. Yes their are not many centers better than Nazr, but their are a few.

    People can complain if Joe D. is not trying to improve the Center position, or if Nazr isn't working hard to become a better player.

    If Nazr is working his butt off and if Joe D. is trying hard to still improve this team than maybe people should stop complaining. No one knows what is happening though, and chances are that Nazr is not improving much or Joe is not trying to move Nazr so people have the right to complain.

    Yes their will be very few ways to get Nazr traded for a good C without trading a top Piston, but it's Joe's job to find that deal. No matter how hard it is.
     

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