What is Pistons DNA?

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by professor, Jul 22, 2006.

  1. professor

    professor Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    Re: Why is everyone so high on JMax?

    I know it's a quasi-sacred phrase around here, but I wonder if someone could kind of spell out for me 1) just what Piston DNA means exactly? and 2) (following the DNA metaphor) what set of traits (on or off court) it spawns? 3) a list of Pistons who do and don't have it (past or present; with any explanations people care to give) might be helpful too.

    just cause sometimes it seems like a conversation stopper phrase and i always like to take a can-opener to such things... thanks
  2. max

    max All-Star

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    Re: Why is everyone so high on JMax?

    I am not sure what it means now. When he was drafted I think it meant a guy that always works hard, always gives it 100% and never complains.

    I took it as a way to describe a player who lacks standout talent. Dumars sort of explained the Mateen Cleaves pick along similiar lines. "He knows how to get the job done" or something like that.
  3. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    Re: Why is everyone so high on JMax?

    Hard working team oriented player.

    Compare Jmax to Milicic. I still think milicic will do pretty good in the league but i wouldn't say he has "pistons dna" Since the beginning, there were negative comments about darkos work ethic. There really isn't much of that for jmax. His biggest fault is a lack of 'upside.'

    Then look at rodney white and mateen cleaves. neither was good enough to stick with the team but rod was a me first kind of guy. Mateen keeps coming back.

    I suppose Pistons DNA has its roots in the bad boys. There is a reason why that concept resonated with the fans in detroit. No other city has been able to field a collective group like the going to work teams or the bad boys. Most other teams bring a 1-2 punch of superstars and have great role players.
  4. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Re: Why is everyone so high on JMax?

    I think it stands to mean all things virtuous in an athlete, without accolades or self-promotion. It also encompasses a solid work ethic and implies an underdog. A physical or mental toughness is also assumed.

    A clever play on DNA as it is about the mental/emotional makeup of an individual more than the physical. A 5'6" rail thin PG with no jumpshot or dribbling skills could have Pistons DNA.

    Defining the intangible?

    Strong Pistons DNA

    - Ben Wallace
    - Isaiah Thomas
    - Dennis Rodman
    - Bill Laimbeer
    - Dave Bing
    - Jerry Stackhouse
    - Don Reid
    - Lindsey Hunter
    - Tayshaun Prince
    - Antonio McDyess
    - Joe Dumars
    - Rick Mahorn
    - Michael Curry (?)
    - Adrian Dantley
    - Mateen Cleaves
    - Grant Hill
    - Jerome Williams


    Lacking Pistons DNA

    - Bonzi Wells
    - Bob McAdoo
    - Rodney White
    - Derrick Coleman
    - Clifford Robinson
    - Damon Jones
    - Joe Smith
    - William Bedford

    Questionable Pistons DNA

    - Darko Milicic
    - Carlos Delfino
    - Alan Houston
    - Sean Elliott
    - Mehmet Okur
    - Chucky Atkins
    - Smush Parker

    A loser can have Pistons DNA and a winner might not. Being a great player doesn't imply Pistons DNA.

    Note: If you don't like Delfino, Memo or Darko on the "Questionable" list, please explain why they deserve to be on the Pistons DNA list without jacking the whole thread please.
  5. Hobbs

    Hobbs First Round Draft Pick

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    Re: Why is everyone so high on JMax?

    Grant Hill has strong Pistons DNA? Man, just, man.
  6. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Re: Why is everyone so high on JMax?

    I didn't count FA against a player. Grant did everything we could have asked for when he was here. He was a model citizen and represented the franchise well. And he gets some extra points for playing injured.

    I don't even like Grant Hill but he had Pistons DNA.
  7. Hobbs

    Hobbs First Round Draft Pick

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    Re: Why is everyone so high on JMax?

    I don't think so. He was more popular on the road than at home because he was viewed as a soft, elitist type and he never resonated as a "true" Piston and was thought of as a 4th quarter choker. He was the Teal Years personified and the Teal Years had no Pistons DNA.

    And Jerome Williams wasn't Pistons DNA either. Self aggrandizement is not a virtue.
  8. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Good discussion, worthy of it's own thread.

    @Hobbs, give us your list! I'm sure you have some players I missed on all of those categories.
  9. Hobbs

    Hobbs First Round Draft Pick

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    Your list was fine except for the two I mentioned.

    Just think of the city. Completely unconcerned with glamour, gritty, etc., and so on. Grant Hill was too Hollywood. Jerome was trying too hard to get everyone to like him (and he was a selfish player to boot).
  10. max

    max All-Star

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    I may have to disagree with Cliff on the lacking list. He was an excellent defender and fit in well with the team. Just lacked enough talent to take us to the next level.

    Ideally you want to mix in some talent with a strong work ethic and the team concept to produce a winner.

    My main complaint with Hill is that he kept advising the GM on roster moves and did not know what he was doing. The club kept trying to appease him so he would re-sign in 00.
  11. easybuckets

    easybuckets First Round Draft Pick

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    Smush wasn"t here long enough or get enough pt to say. He is a gritty kid who tries hard. If Piston D N A means gutsy, persevering, plays hard, then Smush has it. Was not a good point guard but good at steals and a pretty good ball handler. Don't know why he choked duing the playoffs, but i do think he has a lot of heart.
  12. bball jay

    bball jay Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    ben wallace doesn't have pistons dna.
    selfish, me first, malcontent, plays hard only if he gets enough touches on offense.

    darko definitely has pistons dna to me. he's an unselfish pass first player, he is a defensive first player, he does the little things like altering shots, defending the pick and roll. he backs down from nobody. my favorite series of events is how he went face to face with dikembe then blocked his sky hook the next play. 2nd favorite is how he gave mourning a monster facial and showed ben how to do it. ben is notorious for getting his dunks blocked by mutumbo. darko was a mutation to the pistons dna that we weren't ready for yet. i think there was some jealousy that with his skill set he didn't have to go all out effort every single play to achieve the same results.

    delfino has pistons dna too. he is a tough hard nosed defender. he is an unselfish player. he doesn't back down from anybody including larry brown. he is another mutated dna that the pistons may not be ready for. just because a player is unhappy on the bench doesn't mean he doesn't have pistons dna.
  13. jammertime

    jammertime Starter 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Gotta disagree with you Hobbs. I think Jermome "the Junk Yard Dog" Williams and Grant Hill were perfect examples of Pistons DNA.

    Especially JYD. He certainly didn't get by on his "raw talent" - or his looks. :eek: It was all about energy and effort.
  14. Hobbs

    Hobbs First Round Draft Pick

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    Jerome was horrible. He stole rebounds from other players so that his stats would look good, he did a globetrotter impersonation whenever he got an offensive board so that all eyes would be on him, and he made sure to mug for the cameras instead of getting back on defense.

    Grant was a great player, but he wasn't a "pure" Piston. He was glamour instead of grit. He was run when the getting got tough (pretty much every 4th quarter). No sir, not buying it.
  15. max

    max All-Star

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    I will agree that Ben's DNA was slipping.
  16. lurker

    lurker First Round Draft Pick

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    I totally disagree. An undrafted nobody transforms himself into a game-changing defensive superstar through sheer force of will and plays a key role in bringing a title. Ben is the epitome of Pistons DNA.
  17. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    If Ben's DNA slipped, then so did Rodman's. He forced a trade and turned into a near suicidal, crybaby under Ron Rothstein.

    While it is totally subjective, I say that if the BULK of their Pistons career was honourable, then they should get the benefit of the doubt.

    I included JYD because he did plenty in the community everywhere he went. Not for endorsement dollars. Because he's genuinely a decent person, if a little bit of a showboat for a completely average talent.

    Chris McCoskey let it slip on the radio a few months back that Cliffy had to be moved because he was becoming a bad influence on Memo (said it was common knowledge). Uncle Spliffy has too many run-ins with the law to accompany his pedestrian output to be considered Pistons genetic material IMO.
  18. Buckeyes#1

    Buckeyes#1 First Round Draft Pick

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    When I think of Piston DNA, the first thing that comes to my mind is a willingness to play suffocating defense. Was this phrase Piston DNA around during the bad boy years? A few that come to my mind are Thomas, Laimbeer, Rodman, Ben, Lindsey. Those guys head my list.
  19. bball jay

    bball jay Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    yes. back in the day ben was the epitome of pistons dna.

    the last couple of years he's been a malcontent. a weak link in the strong starting 5 chain. can't count on him during crunch time. refuses to go into the game. bad mouths the coaching staff and team direction. 1 block in ecf. wants touches on the offensive end yet can't hit a free throw. plays hard only when he is involved in the offense.

    yes. i agree that rodmans dna slippped too. it's also similar how the changes happened when the players favorite coach left the team. they both later played for chicago. they are both around the same height. both wear weird hair styles. both are free throw specialists.
  20. lurker

    lurker First Round Draft Pick

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    You got through that whole post without mentioning Darko. Good job. :thumb:

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