Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by Mark V, Nov 19, 2013.
NBA Trade Machine - ESPN
Throw in a late round draft pick and I'm in.
We're only 2 games better than at this point last year.
I say we wait til Dumars is released this summer,
and then let the new GM have a go at this mess.
NBA Trade Machine - ESPN
I'd consider this.
Would be a shame to abandon our 3 bigs until we've seen what they can do as 2 at a time.
Would be ashame to abandon the 3 bigs without any actual coaching.
That actually is a good idea. You caught me off guard with that one, Nemo.
This reminds me of last year when all the coach really had to do was play monroe and drummond together. He'd still be coaching. This year, all cheeks had to do is try what everyone pointed out the day we signed smith. Then it's on dumars if it doesn't work.
It makes you wonder sometimes how much teams pay attention to the data that is easily available. Numbers like the 2-man and 3-man on-floor statistics over 41 games are very telling, at this point.
I noticed that half court shooting is down this year.
To some teams, that is probably like differential equations and to others it is like 2+2.
From everything that I can gather on the internet... the Detroit organization it caught between the two schools of thought. Frank was a bit of a numbers guy and Gores wanted to bring more of an analytical approach. Dumars and Cheeks are old school. Josh Smith is home school and doesn't even care what his FG% is.
Picking the best available from the FA class and then being the only bidder for them by quickly meeting the ask is not very technical. Moneyball took off in baseball and that didn't even have the zero sum resource constraints that the NBA has with the salary cap structure. With salary cap, you have to either get lucky, be a genius talent evaluater, have a genius coach, or outsmart everybody with an efficient allocation of money and resources. The game has changed since 2004.
In 2004, we had a bit of a genius coach, we got really lucky in some trades and acquisitions, and I'd argue that Joe did a great job of evaluating underappreciated talent. There was probably minor analytics involved. Now we have a weak coach, we've had some luck in the draft, Joe's FA's are turning out to be horrible, and there are no indications that we are trying to view the stats or salary structure any differently than we used to.
Rehaul the brains of the operation. I'd suggest that we overpay the crap out of Phil Jackson, but he recommended Cheeks reportedly.
Trade machine shows -6 wins for both teams. Now that's a win-win trade.
I doubt that Phil Jackson is the answer. I would bet he's every bit as old school as Dumars is.
Well lets trade CV for Mark Jackson then...right right?
I would love to get Goran Dragic here somehow. He breaks down defences at will. If you haven't seen him play much, today's game against the stronghold of Indiana is a prime example. He makes smart decisions, can shoot from deep and has a relatively injury-free history. The Suns are in a strong position though, so there is no real need for them to make moves now. They still have Dragic locked up for a measly 7.5m for the next 2 seasons after this one (though he will surely opt out of his player option in 15/16). Bledsoe was killing it before he got injured so the Suns will surely wait to see how he comes back before dealing Dragic anywhere.
Making a match with the Suns is also a difficult proposition due to what we can offer. If we nab Dragic, Jennings obviously needs to go - but Jennings is like for like and Monroe doesn't fit their system. Which means we'd need a 3rd or 4th team to join in. Tough.
I'm just going to quote a post I had earlier involving a trade for Dragic. Let me know what you think...
Ha, nice. I was playing around with the trade machine before you posted that and I had the Knicks as my third team! But it didn't involve Melo. I said that Monroe wouldn't interest Phoenix, but news now coming out they are trying to acquire Pau Gasol - there goes that theory! Which means... Joe get in there and cut the Lakers grass! Monroe and Gasol both expiring and similar skillsets - will probably both command similar $$ but Monroe with the upside of course. If they're willing to get Gasol, surely they'd take Monroe instead.
Your trade would be pretty interesting philosophically. Going from big ball to small ball overnight. Gut feeling - not sure Melo and Dragic would be a good fit together. Not really a Melo fan I guess. Also I'm not sure what's really in it for Knicks in that trade.
Dragic is an absolute bargain though.
If Dumars hasn't picked up the phone about sending Moose to the Suns then he deserves to be fired immediately. Gasol and Monroe are essentially the same player, Gasol is a slightly better defender and has a slightly better touch from 15 feet. Because he is so cheap right now, we can package in a bad contract and go for the jugular. Monroe+Jerebko for Dragic. Monroe + Charlie V for Frye and Dragic. Phoenix are looking to make their team, they have tonnes of draft picks and cap room. Ideally you send Monroe over for Dragic and a late first rounder this year. Then you start talking to the Knicks about packaging Smith and Jennings for Melo with the pick you just got. Throw in expirings and it starts to make sense.
For Detroit, its obvious. My trade makes us hugely better. We get a legit SF in Melo, who plays just enough defense for Drummond to cover him. We get Dragic, the closest thing to an awesome point guard that is even possible to get right now.
The Knicks get a couple of things. Firstly, a PG who can score and handle the ball. Felton stinks and everyone knows it. They get Josh Smith - a highlight guy who can actually play defense, something they sorely lack. Lastly, they get some cap relief through Okafor, which they are desperate for given their current situation.
Phoenix gets scoring at the 4 with Monroe and defense at the 5 with Chandler. They pretty much threw away Gortat and their interior defense has looked awful ever since.
My gut feeling says Phoenix wouldn't like this because I'm pretty sure they are going for the playoffs now and Bledsoe has had knee problems and won't be back for at least a month. And even if they did, there is going to more salary relief for the Knick's involved here. Chandler + Monroe is a huge steal for Okafor and Dragic, that's undeniable.
Is my sarcasm detector off? Why would Phoenix trade Dragic for Monroe when they are in a win now situation and can get Gasol for a injured player and a pick? They wouldn't do Dragic - Monroe straight up, much less add a pick. And Melo for two bad contracts and a pick?
Brandon Jennings is a clear upgrade over Raymond Felton. Josh Smith would be the best PF on their team by a country mile. It's a two position upgrade + a pick and salary relief for a guy who probably won't re sign there.
Obviously it is a highly unlikely trade.
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